40 year old Motobecane /bottom bracket creaky
 

So the time has come to do some important maintenance I have a bottom bracket creek. Sometimes it goes away for a while. It isn't very bad but hampers the enjoyment of the bike and can't be very good for it . I would like to do something about it myself . I don't have a bike stand or have I done this before .
what tools would I need ?
what is the procedure?
What grease do I need?
is repacking bearings part of it ?

Thank's

youll need the specs. That said, you may not be able to find any documentation. Bring it to a bike store would be my best advice.

Pour some oil in the bearings might fix it good enough.
Its forty years old and unless you replace it's never going to be perfect.
And everything could be seized and a pain to take apart.
Is it a cottered crank?
If it is you could give them a spray penetrating oil and then a tap of a hammer and snug up the bolt if it moves. If it doesn't it's good.
I don't know what tools specifically you would need to service but it might be a lot.
You could end up needing a drill or a torch.

Thanks for the replies It it functions pretty well I'll try what I can. I don't know what kind of crank it has . Perhaps someone here would know. I would appreciate any suggestions


Thank you again

There is a bottom bracket tool, what one depends on what your bottom bracket is. You will take it off and see what's in there. Probably cup and cone bearings but they might be in a race. Probably 1/4 inch but possibly slightly smaller. Just take them out and see what you have, then get new bearings of the right size they are cheap. Grease them up and put everything back together. If you can't find the right tool you can use a hammer and chisel to unscrew it.

sound very hopeful I want to learn as much as I can . But if doable I will . Love to hear more about it . If I can do this and a rear Hub lube job I will have a good bike again .Got to find out what I have .

Loose cotter pins ?
Post some close up pictures of the cranks from a couple of angles.

O.K would love too .
I have not posted any pictures yet I just crossed the threshold of 10 posts so I should be able to. But I tried earlier today it didn't work maybe I have to change the size of the picture, will post as soon as I can. thank you for your communication , along with the others too.
I remember this bike being much more enjoyable ,a few years ago quite fast and smooth but now, something is missing.
I spun the rear wheel freewheeling it and it spun very freely but not smooth there was vibration but thats' another story.

regards
Alex

You can upload to Imgur or any other photohosting site.

For a great intro on all things bicycle I'd suggest you look at Lennard Zinn's bicycle maintenace book, any edition will be fine for a 40 year old Motobecane. This will show you just about all options. You Tube of course can help also.

is it the bottom bracket that creaks or the cranks? cotterless cranks will creak if
they're loose ( they don't have to feel loose to be loose enough to creak)
cottered cranks creak when the swedge is coming loose between the arm and the
spider or chainring. if it's actually the bottom bracket the creak is usually because
the right side or fixed cup is loose. once again it doesn't have to feel loose to
be loose enough to creak

Yes it worked , but oversized and not elegant. iPhoto straight out of the bag , I wanted to reduce the size but need to totally redo iCloud, Blah blah blah .
now we can see it though . https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...0442484e93.jpg

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...82c4dd741e.jpg

You know, I don,t know . The crank does not feel loose . How can I tell which it is? . I am happy to take it apart ( only if I need to ) once I understand what to do . cotter pins cotter pins,..... hum I have safety pins , Ive worked with . yes of course, I have heard of them, many year, but have yet to work with them .
so do you suppose she has a cottered or cotterless crank ??
I would like to get that book Zinn thanks for the suggestion ( ebay)

You have cotterless cranks.

EDIT: Here's a cottered crank from another old Motobecane (Mirage, new in 1975). The top of the cotter pin (It's not like what we think of when we say "cotter pin") is visible sticking out of the crank.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...3d4bb50abd.jpg
1975 Motobecane crank and chainrings

It's a basic square taper bottom bracket. They are surprisingly easy to do maintenance on, and when adjusted correctly spin as well as upscale new ones. You need this tool, https://www.parktool.com/product/cra...ttom%20Bracket to remove the crank bolts. Use this one to remove the crank arms from spindles https://www.parktool.com/product/uni...ttom%20Bracket (requires an adjustable wrench). Use this one to remove the lock ring on the non drive side
cup https://www.parktool.com/product/adj...ttom%20Bracket and this one to remove the non drive side cup https://www.parktool.com/product/cra...ttom%20Bracket. Then remove the spindle. The bearings will probably be "caged" bearings instead of "loose" (this will make sense once you remove the non drive side cup). Finally, remove the drive side cup. After forty years this may be difficult. You may need to use a threaded rod with a fender washer and nut on the non drive side, fit an adjustable wrench to the cup and then put a nut on the outside of the adjustable wrench so you can tap it with a hammer without it falling off. VERY important, the drive side cup is reverse threaded, meaning it's lefty (counterclockwise) tighty, righty (clockwise) loosey. You can then clean everything, regrease, put in new bearings (1/4"). You can either clean the cage and put bearings back into the cage, or you can pitch the cage and use loose bearings (which will make it spin more smoothly). For number of bearings, fill each cup and then remove one bearing. That's the correct number. Put everything back on in reverse. Google to learn now to correctly tighten everything using the non drive side cup and lock ring. Easy!

To service this bottom bracket you will need a crank extractor tool which you can use after you remove the bolt in your crank arm. Then you will need a tool like the image below (a "bottom bracket lockring wrench"... the "hook" on the right end) to remove (and eventually re-tighten) the lock ring on the non-drive side; it has notches at intervals around the circumference. You can also use a punch or even (shudder) a screwdriver and a mallet to drive the lock ring off, but you may damage it. Then you can remove the NDS cup and see what is going on in there. If you remove the chain first, you'll be able to remove the drive side crank and chainrings.
If the Bottom bracket hasn't been serviced in 40 years, be prepared to find wear, rust, and who knows what. I just finished re-building the Motobecane whose crank I showed elsewhere. It involved replacing the crank axle and the bearings, but it was worth the effort IMO.

EDIT: Good advice ^^ from revcp. You don't actually have to remove the drive-side cup unless it's in bad shape. Usually the crank axle races are ruined long before the cups. I left my DS cup in place. I also replaced the caged bearings (7 ball per side) with uncaged balls... 11 per side. Better load bearing and longer service life.
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...d8bd06b962.jpg
BB Lockring wrench

Start by making sure everything's tight.
Sometimes you can isolate noises by stressing each part as individually as possible.
For instance, standing next to the bike, squeezing both brakes, and the pedal at "3-oclock" step hard on the pedal, release, step hard again.
Repeat on the other side.

Also, when you notice it while riding, pay close attention to what type of effort causes it

For grease I just use a decent marine grease. It's totally waterproof and requires a good scrubbing with soap and a stiff-bristle brush to get it off.

You need a socket or special wrench that fits your nut on the bottom bracket spindle - usually 14mm but sometimes 15mm. Those a re the two most common sizes.
Then you need a crank extractor aka puller that screws into the threads on the arms of you crankarms.

A pair of large slip-joint pliers can be used in a pinch to undo the lockring on t he left side of the bottom bracket. A pin tool is usually uused to unscrew the adjustable cup. Your appears to be a large nut. If so, then a large adjustable wrench might fit it.

So, with luck t he only tool you might need to buy is the crankarm extractor/puller.

I'd clean the inside of the cups really well and then put in new ball bearings. Use lots of grease. I put grease in the cups wherethe bearings will go and also on the bearings themselves if caged.

Cheers

It's not clear from your picture who made your crank. If it is TA or Stronglight, you will need the proprietary extractor tool to remove the arms. A Motobécane of that era will likely have a metric thread bottom bracket, which limits your choices of replacement parts, should that be needed. Velo-Orange and Phil Wood offer metric thread cartridges, and there are threadless options from Velo-Orange and others that can work.

pics are not good but I could tell that it's a 5-pin crank so it is either TA
or Stronglight. if the year is late enough the extractor threads will be standard
22mm but if earlier it would be 23mm and 23.35 respectively. closely measure
the threads b4 buying the tool(crank puller/extractor)
also noticed a Huret Jubile cable guide (the most elegant one ever)

When you finish servicing the BB, put some anti-seize on the axle flats before reinstalling the crank arms. I can't tell you how many creaky-weaky noises I've made disappear with a liberal application of anti-sieze.

This is and interesting question I'm not sure I'll be able without your knowledge and experience to even judge once I get everything apart I could observe it better. I just bought the Leonard Zinn book ( Ebay $5.60 ) ,

Could also be the saddle, pedals, stem, handlebar or the frame itself. Did You isolate the bb area ad the culprit just by ear or did You do some other testing?

I've bought the Leonard Zinn book on eBay



I just performed your test! no doubt something is loose or wrong. A high pitched nock sound, only once as I move alternately from one side to the other. I can also feel the movement,,, the slack. Is there a way to tighten this up externally without taking the crank a part ? Just till I get the tools to do the job It's a very good test, thank you homebrew,

Steve It is a Stronglight and late 70's father bought it in 1978. Important to know as to what tools I will need ? Mainly the extractor? The nice tools at a reasonable price recommended here in this post ,,by park tool seemed respected. I looked on eBay for others and the secondhand ones are about the same price as the new one why is that? Has the quality staid the same? So many things are going down in quality I could get an older one( extractor) as someone stated I could try using something good I have in the house , I have some good tool but I want the job to go as smoothly a possable for the pleasure of it, and not nicking up me or the bike . By the way are there other type of bike jobs one can complete with these same tools?

Next I am going to go non-cage and want very good bearing what do you recommend please, and how many ?


By for now , cheers.






where are the axle flats ? and thanks .


And thanks to all that are continuing to give me advice .

Sounds like the bottom bracket is a bit loose. You can try the same test with your and, for better feel. Hold the pedal, put a little forward pressure on it, then push-pull the pedal toward the bike, and away from it. Do you feel any play ?