Postexercise anabolic response to protein
Report in a top journal says the anabolic response to postexercise protein ingestion is dose dependent and has no detectable asymptote.
https://www.cell.com/cell-reports-me...791(23)00540-2 Wherefore am I not swole? |
Originally Posted by MoAlpha
(Post 23141815)
Report in a top journal says the anabolic response to postexercise protein ingestion is dose dependent and has no detectable asymptote.
https://www.cell.com/cell-reports-me...791(23)00540-2 Wherefore am I not swole? |
Originally Posted by RChung
(Post 23141841)
Maybe I'll stop off at Costco for that $5 roasted chicken and eat it all for my post ride snack. Should I pick up the hot dog, too?
|
Too many words I had to look up to be certain I knew the meaning of. <grin>
Is this simply saying that if you eat more protein after exercise you get more muscle?. And the more you eat the more you get? Seems I must have missed something. More muscle isn't necessarily a good thing. Adds weight. Being able to use more of the muscles you have is better. |
Originally Posted by Iride01
(Post 23141946)
Too many words I had to look up to be certain I knew the meaning of. <grin>
Is this simply saying that if you eat more protein after exercise you get more muscle?. And the more you eat the more you get? Seems I must have missed something. More muscle isn't necessarily a good thing. Adds weight. Being able to use more of the muscles you have is better. Nevertheless, this can't be the whole story or guys like me who are trying to make gains in the weight room and maybe overdoing the protein a little bit would look like the Incredible Hulk instead of pencil-necked geeks. |
For us, the issue is simply that we need carbs, protein, and fat, with quantities in that order to replace what we have burned. Most of us aren't trying to gain weight and we sure as heck don't want to mess up our livers. Most of us do just fine on the ordinary recs for quantities. So maybe the contention in that article is true, but who cares? We just want a positive nitrogen balance and we're good - but how do we know? I've read that the max was 40g. This might be quite interesting to track sprinters, but they probably already know it. I've messed around with increasing protein quantities, but then a blood test said that much was too much, dialed it back and fine now. Good to know though.
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Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy
(Post 23142439)
For us, the issue is simply that we need carbs, protein, and fat, with quantities in that order to replace what we have burned. Most of us aren't trying to gain weight and we sure as heck don't want to mess up our livers. Most of us do just fine on the ordinary recs for quantities. So maybe the contention in that article is true, but who cares? We just want a positive nitrogen balance and we're good - but how do we know? I've read that the max was 40g. This might be quite interesting to track sprinters, but they probably already know it. I've messed around with increasing protein quantities, but then a blood test said that much was too much, dialed it back and fine now. Good to know though.
What kind of test are you referring to? A bump in a liver enzyme? Creatinine? How was that attributed to protein intake? |
Originally Posted by RChung
(Post 23141841)
Maybe I'll stop off at Costco for that $5 roasted chicken and eat it all for my post ride snack. Should I pick up the hot dog, too?
|
How will you know if your inability to maintain weight is due to loss of muscle as opposed to just less body fat? Both visceral and subcutaneous fat. Visceral fat, I'd think would make the easier and more typical measurement of such think it was muscle loss when it isn't.
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Originally Posted by Iride01
(Post 23142831)
How will you know if your inability to maintain weight is due to loss of muscle as opposed to just less body fat? Both visceral and subcutaneous fat. Visceral fat, I'd think would make the easier and more typical measurement of such think it was muscle loss when it isn't.
|
Originally Posted by Hermes
(Post 23142822)
Prior to my current diet, I might have been inclined to go for an Inn N Out burger double meat double cheese and fries with a coke. Horner would join me.:D
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Originally Posted by MoAlpha
(Post 23142854)
I can see the muscle dwindling off my arms and chest and my wife starts giving me worried looks and asking if I want her to buy ice cream. Obviously, there's fat loss too, but for me that's neither here nor there.
Regardless of why I'm losing muscle, I do need to find some incentive to work out more. |
Originally Posted by RChung
(Post 23142856)
Regular coke or diet?
|
Originally Posted by Iride01
(Post 23142861)
Thanks. I'm not just here trying to make out like this isn't a real issue. I actually am concerned about my own apparent muscle loss at my age of 65 yo. However I'm hoping that it's more due to my insufficient amount of exercise I'm getting for all of my body. Legs aren't a big issue since I do cycle. But my upper body is suffering badly. And I can't find the motivation to go to the gym regularly even though I frequently encourage others to do so.
Regardless of why I'm losing muscle, I do need to find some incentive to work out more. |
Originally Posted by Iride01
(Post 23142861)
Thanks. I'm not just here trying to make out like this isn't a real issue. I actually am concerned about my own apparent muscle loss at my age of 65 yo. However I'm hoping that it's more due to my insufficient amount of exercise I'm getting for all of my body. Legs aren't a big issue since I do cycle. But my upper body is suffering badly. And I can't find the motivation to go to the gym regularly even though I frequently encourage others to do so.
Regardless of why I'm losing muscle, I do need to find some incentive to work out more. |
Originally Posted by Hermes
(Post 23142877)
Normally, I would go for diet but if Horner were there, it would be regular.;) And I would need it!
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Originally Posted by MoAlpha
(Post 23142770)
I'd really like to enter my eighth decade with another 5 kgs of muscle on board, but I am unable to maintain weight when I'm riding as much as I really enjoy and I struggle to gain in the off season. I take your point about the potential ill effects of extreme protein loading and I seriously doubt I could even ingest 100g of protein at a sitting, but if someone told me it would work, I'd try it for a few weeks.
What kind of test are you referring to? A bump in a liver enzyme? Creatinine? How was that attributed to protein intake? |
Glad to read this, I've been spending more time this year looking at diet and exercise and this speaks to how I have to look more at what I'm eating after the workout. Usually I eat a protein bar before going and then do a more normal breakfast after but might need to consider adding an extra egg, yogurt or even a protein shake after. I've been under the whole 25g of protein is all the body can use in a day impression but this does seem to suggest that after a workout the body will process more and for longer. Not really interested in adding real muscle, mostly just burning off fat, but this could make recoveries better.
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth
(Post 23143021)
I've been under the whole 25g of protein is all the body can use in a day impression.
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Post ride roast chicken is great... But don't forget the beer...
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Originally Posted by Russ Roth
(Post 23143021)
Glad to read this, I've been spending more time this year looking at diet and exercise and this speaks to how I have to look more at what I'm eating after the workout. Usually I eat a protein bar before going and then do a more normal breakfast after but might need to consider adding an extra egg, yogurt or even a protein shake after. I've been under the whole 25g of protein is all the body can use in a day impression but this does seem to suggest that after a workout the body will process more and for longer. Not really interested in adding real muscle, mostly just burning off fat, but this could make recoveries better.
|
Originally Posted by PeteHski
(Post 23143168)
I assume you meant 25g in a single meal?
Originally Posted by MoAlpha
(Post 23143246)
The methods are really complex and some of it unfamiliar, but I don’t think there is any indication that the whole 100g gets incorporated into muscle protein, since all they can trace is the labeled protein they’re dripping into a vein. Rather, the study focuses on the signaling role of that huge meal and the effects of that signal on protein metabolism.
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I found this podcast (ZOE interview with Prof. Ben Wall) very interesting in regard to protein intake and the anabolic window for recovery. A lot of coaches still follow the principle of consuming recovery protein in a relatively short window following exercise, but this Professor suggests that the anabolic window is much wider than was suggested from previous research i.e. at least 24 hours or more. So there is no big hurry to chug down 100g of protein shake or chicken in the hour or two after exercise! He also suggests that the daily effective intake of protein tops out at around 1.6g/kg for resistance based training, but could be higher for endurance. The latter seems to be uncertain. So for me that would be around 131g per day max. I probably don't hit that, but haven't checked recently.
https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-protein-and-exercise |
Originally Posted by PeteHski
(Post 23143662)
I found this podcast (ZOE interview with Prof. Ben Wall) very interesting in regard to protein intake and the anabolic window for recovery. A lot of coaches still follow the principle of consuming recovery protein in a relatively short window following exercise, but this Professor suggests that the anabolic window is much wider than was suggested from previous research i.e. at least 24 hours or more. So there is no big hurry to chug down 100g of protein shake or chicken in the hour or two after exercise! He also suggests that the daily effective intake of protein tops out at around 1.6g/kg for resistance based training, but could be higher for endurance. The latter seems to be uncertain. So for me that would be around 131g per day max. I probably don't hit that, but haven't checked recently.
https://zoe.com/learn/podcast-protein-and-exercise |
Originally Posted by MoAlpha
(Post 23141971)
Nevertheless, this can't be the whole story or guys like me who are trying to make gains in the weight room and maybe overdoing the protein a little bit would look like the Incredible Hulk instead of pencil-necked geeks.
He's dead now, I'm not yet. My neck is still pencil-shaped, and strangers still yell out, "OMG, eat a sandwich!!!" I'm still riding pretty well, so whatever. Same height and weight as Sepp Kuss, 2.2 times the age, about half the power: https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...92e7a13544.jpg Obligatory thread content: I will get to the gym eventually (and eat more protein, I guess), after Mrs tm finishes her chemo rounds. I don't want to bring home any bugs. |
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