Ironman Information Thread
Before my memory fades, and while enthusiastic cult members remain, perhaps a thread would be in order to assist and inform the masses. There are many Ironman bikes out there in the hands of the enlightened, and many more in the wild, seeking intelligent captivity. While the "80's paint job" thread has about everything you could think of about the Ironman models, this one is simply about "what came on what, and when."
By no means do I know everything, or can remember everything, about the changes in the iconic bike from the beginning until it left us in 1989. There are subtle differences, even in the same model years, that we geek over, discuss, and let each other know. Once in a while, one of us runs across an all-OEM model, and can fill in gaps. The 80's were a time of change in bike production, and those affected the Ironman, as well. My suggestion is we stick to what we know as fact, or supported rumor, like geometry changes, etc. My suggestion is we leave the debatable opinions in the "main" Ironman thread, so as to keep this an informative location. As we all know, it was done right. Please post a catalog page or magazine ad, or as close to an OEM model as you can. We still have the "...Ironman...80's" thread to post the hot rods, all other Ironman gouge, but this thread is for those who want to reference OEM information. (As if I make the rules...) |
The Predecessor
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The Beginning
1985 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Original"
Frame: Tange 1 Fork: Tange sloped crown Wheelset: 6207 hubs laced to bronzed Araya A20 rims BB: Tange Crankset: 6207 Calipers: 6207 Levers: 6207 non-aero Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm) Stem: Nitto Headset: 6207 star nut Shifters: 6207 friction 2x6 Shimano old-style bosses aka. Shimano Brazed-On A Type FD: 6207 28.6 clamp RD: 6207 SIS short cage Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.0 Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo Tires: Panaracer Technova Freewheel: Shimano Colors: Metallic Red/Silver and Titanium Silver/Blue Grey Scheme: Contrasting head tube color DT Decal: Centurion with joined UR, "heavy" shaded font. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott Signature Headbadge Decal: "C" in same font as DT Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps Seat tube Decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom Fork Decal: Centurion on fork crown, Red Tange on the top of the legs. Touch-up paint: (Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post) http://i797.photobucket.com/albums/y...nrightside.jpg |
Moving Modern
3 Attachment(s)
1986 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Classic"
Frame: Tange Champion 1 48-60cm even sizes. Fork: Tange Champion 1 sloped crown Wheelset: New 600EX 32 or 36h laced to Araya 20A bronze rims or Wolber Alpine, Ashai 14g stainless spokes BB: Tange Crankset: New 600EX BioPace 52/42, Shimano UG chain Calipers: New 600EX Levers: New 600EX or DiaCompe AGC aero Bars: Nitto B115 Stem: Nitto Young Headset: New 600EX Shifters: New 600EX FD: New 600EX 28.6 clamp RD: New 600EX SIS short cage Seatpost: Sugino SP-KCL graduated fluted 27.0 Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo Tires: Panaracer Vertex Freewheel - 13-15-17-19-21-24T New 600EX Colors: Guards Red w/White duotone, Anthracite w/Siver duotone. Scheme: Contrasting head tube and seat tube color. Graphics: Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge. DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded font, slightly graduated thickness. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps Seat tube Decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom Fork Decal: Centurion on fork crown, Red Tange on top of the legs Touch-up paint: Testor's Red, Duplicolor bright red, Krylon short cuts SCB-005 Red Pepper , the short cuts comes in a 1 oz. bottle (Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post) http://i.imgur.com/TmpCB8D.jpg http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=483355 http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=484844 http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=483344 http://i797.photobucket.com/albums/y...psxhcwijsy.jpg http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=483649 |
The Year of the Split: Experts and Masters
1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. The "Classic" & the "Miami Vice"
1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. Georgena Terry design. 1987 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. A "Classic" Master Frame: Tange 1 Fork: Tange sloped crown on the Master, Unicrown on the Expert. Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Terry Expert, 700c rear, 520c front, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims Wheelset: Shimano 600EXon the Master, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims BB: Sugino Crankset: Shimano 1050 52/42 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX 53/42 on the Master Calipers: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX the Master Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 600EX aero on the Master Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm) Stem: Nitto Headset: Shimano 105 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX star nut on the Master. Shifters: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX on the Master FD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EXon the Master, both 28.6 clamp RD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 600EX on the Master Seatpost: Sugino SP-KCL graduated scale 27.0 Saddle: Vetta Mundial on Expert, Vetta Turbo on Master, women-specific Vetta on the Terry model Tires: Panaracer Technova II Cassette: Shimano UG Colors: Expert "Classic" Red/White. Expert "Miami Vice" Magenta/Yellow Colors: Expert "Terry" Peach Colors: Master "Classic" Yellow/White, Bright Marine Green/White..others? Scheme: Contrasting head tube and seat tube color. Graphics: Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge. DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded thinner font, more graduated thickness. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading Seat stay decal: Centurion below the caps Seat tube decal(s): Blue Tange 1 at top, Quality from Japan/Designed in USA at the bottom Fork decal: Centurion on the crown (including the unicrown), Tange Red on the fork legs Touch-up paint: (Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post) http://i.imgur.com/eJqYy8s.jpg http://i.imgur.com/ktp1Z3q.jpg http://i.imgur.com/4m6vzCZ.jpg http://i.imgur.com/S3WWltc.jpg http://i.imgur.com/ncjlaKC.jpg http://i.imgur.com/oTGjlZM.jpg http://oldtenspeedgallery.com/blog/w...-master-03.jpg http://i.imgur.com/bc5GsSF.jpg http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1445304462 http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1445304474 |
The Year of the Fades
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. "Straight Fades"
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Purple Haze" and "Straight Fade" Frame: Tange 1 Fork: Tange unicrown Wheelset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Araya CTL-370 rims Wheelset: Shimano 6400 on the Master, Araya CTL-370 rims BB: Tange ball bearing type. Crankset: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400-53/42 on the Master Calipers: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 6400 aero on the Master Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm) Stem: Nitto Headset: Tange Levin CD on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Shifters: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master FD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master, both 28.6 clamp RD: Shimano 1050 on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Seatpost: Sugino 27.0 fluted on the Expert, smooth on the Master Saddle: Vetta (Turbo copy) on the Expert, Selle Italia Turbo on the Master Tires: Panaracer Technova II Cassette: Shimano HG 2x7 cassette. 13-24. Colors: Expert: Red/White, Marine Green/White "straight fades" (possibly a yellow/white) Colors: Master "Smoked" purple fade, and see below, a Yellow/White "straight fade" Master. Only one I've ever seen. Scheme: "Straight Fade" on the Experts. "Smoked Fade" and "Straight Fade" on the Master, see above. Graphics: Squiggles and Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge. DT Decal: Centurion in an even more graduated font, from very thin to bold thickness. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading, geometric shapes in the logo Seat stay decal: Graphics below the caps, but no text Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork Seat Tube Decal(s): Clear/colored Tange at the top, Clear/colored Made in Japan/Designed in USA at base. Fork Decals: dropped the Centurion from the crowns, Clear/colored Tange at the top of the legs Touch-up paint: For the 88 purple haze I found that Pure Ice name brand nail polish 542cp "No Means No" is a perfect match for the dominant purple. The fading purple is either Sally Hansen brand hard as nails nail polish 370 "No Hard Feelings" . Or L.A. colors name brand color craze nail polish cnp507 "Wisteria". (Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post) http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1440785231 http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1442713624 http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...1&d=1445350633 |
Going Carbon, winning the Ironman, again.
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Carbon
Frame: Carbon main triangle, carbon stays inserted into aluminum lugs Fork: Aluminum sloped crown Wheelset: Shimano 7400 hubs laced to Araya CTL-370 rims. BB: 7400 Crankset: Shimano 7400 Calipers: Shimano 7400 Levers: Shimano 7400 Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm) Stem: Nitto Headset: Shimano 7400 Shifters: Shimano 7400 FD: Shimano 7400 28.6 clamp RD: Shimano 7400 Seatpost: American Classic 25.4 Saddle: Vetta Turbo Tires: Panaracer Technova II Cassette: Shimano HG 2x7 Color: Alloy lugs, clear coated black carbon fiber, alloy fork Scheme: none Graphics: Squiggles and Geometric shapes in the DT decal and on headbadge. DT Decal: Centurion in a new un-shaded thinner font, more graduated thickness. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Carbon" added over Ironman Headbadge Decal(s): New heavy "C" without shading, with geometric shapes Seat stay decal: Squiggles below the caps, no text Tange Decal: Clear/colored decal on top of fork legs only. HT Decal: Made in Japan below the headbadge ST Decal: Centurion on the sides, nearly same size as DT decal An Ironman Carbon used by Dave Scott. http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1444930664 An Ironman Carbon model upgraded... I wanted an OEM pic, but there aren't many "good" pics of the Carbon out there. http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...1&d=1440893605 |
Last of the Legend, Suntour's last gasp...and twin sons of different mothers.
2 Attachment(s)
1989 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Expert. "The Black Dog" and "Smoke on the Water"
1989 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Hard Rock" and "The Red Menace" Frame: Tange 1 Fork: Tange unicrown Wheelset: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Araya CTL-370 rims Wheelset: Shimano 6400 on the Master, Araya CTL-370 rims BB: Tange on the Expert, 6400 series on the Master? Crankset: Suntour GPX on the Expert on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Calipers: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Levers: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 aero on the Master Bars: Nitto B115-390 (<=54cm) -420 (=>56cm) Stem: Nitto Headset: Tange Levin CD on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Shifters: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 SIS on the Master FD: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master 28.6 clamp RD: Suntour GPX on the Expert, Shimano 6400 on the Master Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.2 Saddle: Avenir Turbo Gel Tires: Panaracer Technova II Cassette: Shimano HG Colors: Expert in solid black and smoked blue fade Colors: Master in solid red and marbled grey fade Scheme: All solid color or smoked fade or marbled fade Graphics: Squiggles dropped for geometric shape bookends in the DT decal and on headbadge. DT Decal: Centurion in a consistent, same-size thickness and spacing, and no squiggles, just "bookend" shapes. TT Decal: Ironman logo with Dave Scott signature, "Expert" or "Master" added over Ironman Headbadge Decal: New heavy "C" without shading, geometric shapes in the logo Seat stay decal: back to Centurion below the caps, no squiggles Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork Seat Tube Decal(s): Clear/colored Tange at the top, Clear/colored Made in Japan/Designed in USA at base. Fork Decals: dropped the Centurion from the crowns, Clear/colored Tange at the top of the legs Pedals: Sampson/SR clipless Touch-up paint: Testor's Red, Duplicolor bright red, any shade of black (on the solid colors) (Add changes in PM's or this thread, and I'll try to get them into the post) http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=483097 http://s6.postimg.org/p6yr32nq8/20150708_170549.jpg http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g2...9%20Expert.jpg http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=483359 |
Things I absolutely don't know about the Ironman models....
The actual seat post size. I know what was specified, but I've put a 27.2 in all of mine.
The actual bottom brackets used in any of them. I go with what people tell me. The correct headsets used in some of them. Why they simply didn't use complete groups (i.e. headsets and bottom brackets and pedals) The prices. Colors I haven't seen. Why the changes in saddles, but all basically Turbos. Spoke count changes. If pedals were part of the package, or additional. Non-Aero vs. Aero brake levers. Why the heck they ever stopped making them. |
Little things I've picked up about the Ironman models....
BF Goodrich's threatened legal action and Dave Scott's endorsement pretty much came together to cement the name. Scott was an icon of the beginning triathlon trend, and the Ironman became pretty much an iconic bike. Centurion's folks envisioned a training/racing bike, affordable and with excellent stuff for the price point.
Alan Goldsmith, a long-time influence in American cycling for 50 years, had a hand in the design of later Ironman models. Dave Scott had a hand in specifying them, as well. The Ironman created sales in other models of the Centurion line-up, just by getting folks in the door and then being a bit more expensive than some could afford. The Lemans/Lemans RS and the Elite RS benefited from this situation, to the point where the Lemans/Lemans RS was a sales leader for Centurion. The rumored geometry change in 1989 was sparked by Centurion telling a bike magazine that it had occurred, but then not producing the numbers. The only evidence is that magazine article and anecdotal evidence. The unicrown fork was probably Tange Prestige, for the convenience of the manufacturing facility. The Panaracer Technova/Technova II tires were so hard that the test bikes for magazines often had wheels that went out of true after each hard ride. This resulted in some testers criticizing the light Araya CTL-370's as "too light," and others simply swapping tires and getting on with the praise. |
1987
Headset Expert: 105 (1050) Master: 600 (6200) Wheelset: Shimano 6200 on the Master, Wolber Super Champion Alpine rims Levers: Shimano 1050 aero on the Expert, Shimano 6200 aero on the Master Master: Cranks Shimano 600 (6200) Master: Brakes Shimano 600 (6200) Saddle Master: Turbo Expert: Vetta Color Expert: Magenta with Yellow Duotone , and Guards Red with White Duotone Master: Bright Marine Green with White Duotone, Lemon Yellow with White Duotone Spokes/Wheels 32 Hole 48-60 CM, 36 Hole 62 CM |
My guess for shifting>
1985 (Shimano 600 6200 Series) Pre SIS Both Friction, 6 Speed Freewheel 1986 (Shimano 600 6200 Series New SIS ) SIS introduced Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel 1987 Master: (Shimano 600 6200 Series New SIS ) SIS introduced Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel Expert: (Shimano 105 1050 Series SIS) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel 1988 Master: (Shimano 600 6400 Series SIS Introduction of 7 Speed ) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Cassette Expert: Expert: (Shimano 105 1050 Series SIS) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 6 Speed Freewheel (?) 1989 Master: (Shimano 600 6400 Series SIS Introduction of 7 Speed ) SIS Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Cassette Expert: Expert: (Suntour GPX Accushift 7 Speed) Accushift Rear only, Friction Front, 7 Speed Freewheel (?) |
Perhaps I should move all these to the main Ironman thread?
UPDATE: added in case this thread bombs away... |
Comp TA 56cm - I bought from original owner. It matches up with above specs, except for rear derailleur, tri color. Bar tape is OEM as well. Shown with new tires which I put on.
https://dl.dropbox.com/s/s4uhgy6jffd...24.21.jpg?dl=0 |
Back in the 80's, I managed the first triathlon store in the US in Berkeley California, called, naturally, The First Tri. We never called Mr. Scott by his name. He was simply referred to as "The Man".
The store only lasted a few years. Had we been a Centurion dealer, perhaps it would have lasted longer. Seemed like every runner or swimmer that decided to do a triathlon went out and bought one of those "The Man" bikes. |
1987 Ironman Expert - Magenta/White Duotone. Mostly All original except for Tires/Toe Clip Straps/HandleBar tape/ Chain
https://vivalaslider.files.wordpress...-33.jpg?w=1000 |
1989 Ironman Expert "The Black Dog" (not the best specimen to represent) but some what original (not stock Rear Wheel, Tires, Handlebars, Stem, Brake Levers, Seat, Pedals)
https://vivalaslider.files.wordpress...ped.jpg?w=1000 Shot taken before restoration, Currently in Progress. |
Bicycle Guide magazine Ironman spec sheet from 1986 review.
https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-b...%252520006.jpg |
Originally Posted by RobbieTunes
(Post 18249094)
1985 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman. The "Original"
BB: 6200? Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.0 vs. 27.2 is debatable Seat stay Decal: Centurion on the caps Tange Decal: Red? Blue? BB was Tange Seatpost size is 27.0 Tange 1 blue decal on seattube Tange 2 red decals on forks |
Originally Posted by RobbieTunes
(Post 18249100)
1988 Centurion Dave Scott Ironman Master. "Purple Haze"
BB: 1050? 6400? Seatpost: SR Laprade fluted 27.2 Saddle: Vetta Turbo Tange Decal: Clear decal on ST and fork BB: 6400 Seatpost: Sugino non-fluted 27.0 Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo Tange 1 blue decal on seattube Tange 2 red decals on forks |
Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist
(Post 18251950)
My 88 Purple Haze, as purchased:
BB: 6400 Seatpost: Sugino non-fluted 27.0 Saddle: Selle Italia Turbo Tange 1 blue decal on seattube Tange 2 red decals on forks I have seen these:http://www.bikeforums.net/attachment...p;d=1442713624 |
Originally Posted by RobbieTunes
(Post 18251988)
Every Ironman came with a fluted seatpost.
I've never seen a Purple Haze with those type of Tange decals. I have seen these: Seatpost is definitely a non-fluted Sugino and is 27.0 (27.2 won't fit). Perhaps the bike shop I got it from did a switch. |
Great summary. I am looking forward to completion of the photo record and I think it would be great to have a picture and description of the first Diamondback following the demise of the Centurion brand to serve as a bookend to the saga. Wasn't that Diamondback basically a rebadged Ironman?
|
I took the liberty of transcribing the above into a spreadsheet on google:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1927924249 I'm sure there are errors. What I'd like to do is open this up to editing control by "the brain trust" to be determined. I never did one of these online spreadsheets before, so I have to figure out the sharing function. I think I'll need emails to send editing invites. Review and Comment before I proceed. I think this document could be used to wrangle together a lot of info in one place, including images (already started, see year tabs on bottom of sheet). Additional info like known touch-up paint options struck me as one thing that would be helpful. I keep seeing that issue raised in the forum. |
Originally Posted by Vintage_Cyclist
(Post 18252037)
Quick trip to the garage, you are correct. I remembered wrong on the decals!
Seatpost is definitely a non-fluted Sugino and is 27.0 (27.2 won't fit). Perhaps the bike shop I got it from did a switch. Sidenote: Before I forget the 86 classic suggested price was 525.00, however my LBS had it at 575.00. Also, short cage definite on 86 classic as it was the only shimano 600 sis rd available in 86. Thanks. |
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