Fiberglass and Resin for Repairs in Remote Areas?
I saw a thread on broken gear on ******'s bicycling section, and the poster had made several repairs using resin and fiberglass.
He fixed a derailleur in Mongolia, and it held for years. http://i.imgur.com/1f0jC2q.jpg http://i.imgur.com/bu1OzF2.jpg Is anyone else repairing things with fiberglass? How would I go about learning how to use it, and are the materials portable enough for ultralight bike touring and bikepacking? |
I learned to use fiberglass by watching my father while growing up and by simply buying the materials and learning hands on. I don't think I would carry it on tour with me. I think it would be unnecessary.
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Boats.. they make them out of it.. and Corvette sports cars Too .
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That's the sort of thing you do when you have no other option and the place you're at has nothing else, it isn't something I'd prepare for. Zip ties, spokes, niconel wire, 1/16" polyester/specta line, polyester whipping twine, gorilla tape, etc. will be more.versatile. "Resin" could be polyester resin which is near useless compared to epoxy.
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Any good farmer knows it is JB Weld when you want to fix something.
Having done several glass boat repairs, and forming a couple of mountaineering sleds out of fiberglass; I have to agree with the folks above. Why would you want to carry it? Fiberglass is a much better material for building sleds and boats than for repairing bikes components. The "Bob trailer" of the ski world--fiberglass and polyester resin. http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/y...cabdecc5af.jpg http://i783.photobucket.com/albums/y...af37ef2b5e.png |
Originally Posted by Doug64
(Post 16859083)
Any good farmer knows it is JB Weld when you want to fix something.
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I have mentioned this option in several threads on roadside welding. It is absolutely feasible to use composites to fix frames, or even possibly parts. Not so sure about that birdsnest of fiber in the picture. Carbon is a lot stronger, and cheap enough in some forms. Just look at all the bamboo bike threads, they are held together with everything from twine to carbon tow. Epoxy is good, JB is good, but it doesn`t wet out fiber all that well. Small bottles of WEST and some carbon tow could fix almost anything.
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Originally Posted by MassiveD
(Post 16860610)
I have mentioned this option in several threads on roadside welding. It is absolutely feasible to use composites to fix frames, or even possibly parts. Not so sure about that birdsnest of fiber in the picture. Carbon is a lot stronger, and cheap enough in some forms. Just look at all the bamboo bike threads, they are held together with everything from twine to carbon tow. Epoxy is good, JB is good, but it doesn`t wet out fiber all that well. Small bottles of WEST and some carbon tow could fix almost anything.
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Adapt. Use mail order over the internet for spares.
I have never considered using fibreglass as a repair aid, much less carry it with me. Max, if you are a lightweight tourer, why clutter your kit with something you might use once in a decade, if that? |
Rowan, I was more curious about it as a fix in areas where a mail order doesn't work. I'm getting into bikepacking, and if something critical breaks in the woods, I need to find a way to fix it. Can't duct tape everything!
I'm thinking the resin and fiberglass seen in the photos would only weigh a couple of ounces, and can fix any theoretical break short of a frame crack. I'm not saying "I'm definitely doing this," this thread is more about "Is anyone else having good fortune doing this?" |
I've become a huge fan of Fiberfix since seeing it on Shark Tank and ordering some for very successful home reapairs.
FiberFix | Welcome It is simple to use, only requires water to activate, and becomes rock hard in 10 minutes. I plan to carry a small packet of it (lightweight also) on future touring rides. adding: I've worked plenty with fiberglass and carbon fiber. The epoxy is messy and can be difficult to work with. That fiberfix stuff is MUCH easier to work with. |
Originally Posted by mdilthey
(Post 16864370)
I'm not saying "I'm definitely doing this," this thread is more about "Is anyone else having good fortune doing this?"
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See Movie All Is Lost with Robert Redford All Is Lost (2013) - IMDb ..
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Carbon weighs next to nothing. Epoxy is available almost everywhere, though you can't get the best stuff on the spot. In fact, for those who are all about "you can get it air freight over night, blah blah", could just order it.
The weight and space argument in nonsense when people regularly discuss camp chairs, pillows, and hammock stands here. A common thread is about the weldability of metal frames this is a game changer where every frame is equally repairable. And not everyone is doing a pas de deux, there are large group for whom an ounce of tow could be a very useful addition. There are also products like carbon rope that might be useful for something, and could then be pressed into use for a repair. Most people have nylon cord for tents, etc... Haven't looked into the properties but carbon is 100 time stronger than nylon, and carbon cord could conceivably be used for a tent guy, and then be used for a repair, though I think working with tow (which is in some cords), sounds more practical. There is this thread in the frameforum about a cracked BB, a few yards of tow would fix this nicely, or enough to build up 1/16", probably more than a yard. http://www.bikeforums.net/framebuild...ston-area.html And this youtube where they fixed their spinaker pole on the fly (these guys are royalty in certain boating circles, the WEST guys). Starts 3:30 Mead and Jan Gougeon On Their Mackinac Race - YouTube With carbon tow you can repair just about anything, for instance a tire casing. Of course you don't have to carry it, that isn't really the issue. The point is that it is available, everyone has different experience, has suffered different material failures, or will be in situations where help is readily available or not. It is knowing what you can use to meet various problems that is key, not whether one chooses any particular one or not. |
Originally Posted by fietsbob
(Post 16865055)
See Movie All Is Lost with Robert Redford All Is Lost (2013) - IMDb ..
I don't fault the movie though. Stuff goes wrong, and people make mistakes. When they survive or not, the point isn't that their behaviour was typical or inevitable, it is only that the behaviours in question were noteworthy. If the same guy in a parallel universe had patched the boat, no movie. |
Originally Posted by sstorkel
(Post 16864576)
Based on my (limited) experience working with fiberglass and resin, I don't think it would be helpful in fixing any of those problems...
Not to mention my minor frame building experience, I come at this mostly from boatbuilding experience. When making wood composite boats, everything is cut out one part at a time and glued into the boat. Unlike some other boat building methods the boat is essentially built one repair at a time. I made these panniers for my mother over 25 years ago, now one of my daughters is using them. They replaced at lower weight both the rack and the bags, had they been designed for touring I would have added cloth tops. But they were just for around the town stuff https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8235/...59e784a9_o.jpg |
yea damage control critique I heard .. put something solid over the hole ..the table top? then bolt and glass it in place ..
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We're talking about bicycle tours are a long way from boat in the middle of the Atlantic. I still cannot imagine a repair that would be worthwhile on a bicycle with fibreglass.
If you are going into remote areas, ensure your bike can handle what you expect. Make sure it is properly maintained and check it regularly for potential problems. And let someone know where you are going, and when you expect to be home again or back in civilisation (which should be SOP for anyone going into remote areas anyway). Get a hold of the Richard's 21st Century Bicycle Book for some tips on how to adapt to circumstances with fixes from the environment around you. By the way, fibreglass resin is not the best stuff to spill in a pannier or bag. And the catalyst is particularly unpleasant in my opinion. However, if there is a burning desire to take it, ensure you practise before leaving. There are things such as ensuring the surfaces to which it is to be bonded are roughened up with sandpaper (something else to carry) to ensure a good take, and knowing how long you have before the catalysed resin goes off (and that could be minutes or hours if in a cold environment and you haven't added enough catalyst). |
Some good info in this thread, some bad.
I think the most useful piece of advice so far is this: It is knowing what you can use to meet various problems that is key, not whether one chooses any particular one or not. Not useful: "It's not worth the weight." Give me a break. i cannot think of an all-purpose repair material lighter and more compact than carbon tow/fiberglass and a bit of epoxy. My toothbrush and toothpaste is probably twice the weight of a useful amount. "If you are going into remote areas, ensure your bike can handle what you expect. Make sure it is properly maintained and check it regularly for potential problems." The answer to "How does this repair work?" is not "Don't break your bike." A repair is unpredictable and, in some cases, an inevitable challenge on long tours. This advice is as close to useless in this context as possible; this is better left to "Tips and Tricks" or a new thread called "Common Sense." "X/Y/Z is better." I'm not asking a general repair question. Sure, duct tape and spit might be a great repair for some things, but I'm asking for specific advice pertaining to fiberglass. If you have no experience, this is a good place to listen rather than speak. "It'll never hold./It's useless." I literally have a picture in the OP of a derailleur repair that held for hundreds of miles... Thanks to everyone offering actual advice and information, floating above the chaff. /rant. |
Never had any Problems with breaking my RD .. so YMMV.. still use the same Campag Euclid MTB RD I got in the Mid 80's
The rear pannier in place does keep the RD from hitting the ground when you lay the bike down on the right side . If really worried get 2 new RD one on the bike and 1 in a package ready to be airmailed to a place you indicate when you write back to your support friend at Home. |
Originally Posted by mdilthey
(Post 16870668)
Some good info in this thread, some bad.
I think the most useful piece of advice so far is this: Not useful: "It's not worth the weight." Give me a break. i cannot think of an all-purpose repair material lighter and more compact than carbon tow/fiberglass and a bit of epoxy. My toothbrush and toothpaste is probably twice the weight of a useful amount. "[/COLOR]If you are going into remote areas, ensure your bike can handle what you expect. Make sure it is properly maintained and check it regularly for potential problems." The answer to "How does this repair work?" is not "Don't break your bike." A repair is unpredictable and, in some cases, an inevitable challenge on long tours. This advice is as close to useless in this context as possible; this is better left to "Tips and Tricks" or a new thread called "Common Sense." "X/Y/Z is better." I'm not asking a general repair question. Sure, duct tape and spit might be a great repair for some things, but I'm asking for specific advice pertaining to fiberglass. If you have no experience, this is a good place to listen rather than speak. "It'll never hold./It's useless." I literally have a picture in the OP of a derailleur repair that held for hundreds of miles... Thanks to everyone offering actual advice and information, floating above the chaff. /rant. Good luck with your endeavours. But be careful how you treat well-meaning people with your snooty reactions. |
Originally Posted by mdilthey
(Post 16870668)
Not useful:
"It's not worth the weight." Give me a break. i cannot think of an all-purpose repair material lighter and more compact than carbon tow/fiberglass and a bit of epoxy. My toothbrush and toothpaste is probably twice the weight of a useful amount. "[/COLOR]If you are going into remote areas, ensure your bike can handle what you expect. Make sure it is properly maintained and check it regularly for potential problems." The answer to "How does this repair work?" is not "Don't break your bike." A repair is unpredictable and, in some cases, an inevitable challenge on long tours. This advice is as close to useless in this context as possible; this is better left to "Tips and Tricks" or a new thread called "Common Sense." "X/Y/Z is better." I'm not asking a general repair question. Sure, duct tape and spit might be a great repair for some things, but I'm asking for specific advice pertaining to fiberglass. If you have no experience, this is a good place to listen rather than speak. "It'll never hold./It's useless." I literally have a picture in the OP of a derailleur repair that held for hundreds of miles... Thanks to everyone offering actual advice and information, floating above the chaff. /rant. |
Originally Posted by sstorkel
(Post 16870987)
Sounds like you already know everything you need to know. Which makes me wonder: why'd you bother to ask the question if you're already an expert?!?
This was the question: "Is anyone else repairing things with fiberglass? How would I go about learning how to use it, and are the materials portable enough for ultralight bike touring and bikepacking?" With some very helpful exceptions, most of the responses are from people who have never performed a fiberglass repair in their lives. They just want to tell me how wrong I am for even seeking the knowledge of a material i'm unfamiliar with in this application. The plural of opinion is not data. Rowan, i don't remember saying anything snooty. The only thing I see that resembles snooty is you putting your advice in a lockbox publicly, like you're the arbiter of knowledge and i'm unworthy for even considering challenging your word... That's never the kind of advice i'm after anyways. |
midithey, While I don't foresee me performing fiberglass repairs, I don't see why it couldn't make many emergency repairs. Even if it only allows a bicycle to be pushed, it beats carrying it.
Brad |
By far the best, and easiest to use, are the West Systems epoxies. But, I'd never consider bringing these materials on a bike tour. While they could be used, they are too messy and cumbersome; they don't work properly unless one uses their metered pumps. Just too awkward.
If you want to learn about techniques, the West Systems site is a good bet: Epoxy by the Leading Epoxy Manufacturer | WEST SYSTEM Epoxy The repairs in the photos are extremely crude, seemingly done by someone who had never used the materials before. If they worked, great, but there's a lot of extraneous material that's adding nothing to the repair. I'd say your chances of needing a repair that would be well served by fiberglass techniques are slight. |
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