Originally Posted by Roody
(Post 16835524)
How come?
The major roads over minor roads is due mostly to expected driver behavior. In slower traffic/residential areas, you tend to have more sidewalks, traffic devices, driveways, side streets, and other forms of merging traffic. On a major road, I know most cars are going straight, most cars joining traffic are coming from well defined intersections or parking lot entrances, and if I'm on the major road I have a lot less traffic lights and stop signs. If I'm on the side streets, there are more stop signs, and lights that aren't timed for the side streets, plus a lot of driveways and other side streets where I need to watch for right hooks and people pulling out a lot more. Then you also have random pedestrians doing pedestrian things because they're less worried about crossing a side street than a 2 lane each way road. And, cars turning onto the side streets are used to less and slower traffic and seem to do more rolling stops, while when turning onto the busier streets they tend to re-verify before merging in due to the higher speed of cars and the heaver traffic. |
Originally Posted by FBinNY
(Post 16835511)
It's always a matter of choosing one or the other. The other might not be pavement. It might be schools, police, or higher taxes, but every dollar spent here, is one not spent elsewhere. There hasn't been manna from heaven since we left Egypt.
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Originally Posted by daihard
(Post 16835545)
I'm simply stating which of the two hypothetical choices I would make as a cyclist. Is there any point of bringing in other, non-cycling-related issues here?
In any case, it's not that we're offered the direct choice, but we do have limited input based on who we put into office, and through public meetings. |
Originally Posted by FBinNY
(Post 16835593)
I wouldn't have said anything if you hadn't added the IF I had to choose. There's competition for every dollar, so it's always a matter of choosing one of the other, though some might say they want both instead of something else, which would be equally valid, if they can point at what to sacrifice.
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Originally Posted by daihard
(Post 16835641)
I added the IF part because that was my premise. If I could take both, I would, and I wanted to be clear what premise I made my statement on.
However you and I agree that better roads in general are a higher priority than bike infrastructure. |
My driveway: https://flic.kr/p/f4Q7un
Some gravel: https://flic.kr/p/f4PZ4V Some pavement: https://flic.kr/p/f4Q1DX These were some that I posted in a thread in the commuting section, but I can't find that thread now. How do I get my Flikr photos to show in a forum post any more? I used to copy the url from the photo's properties and use the Image forum button, but now Flikr has my pictures in a slide show format and that doesn't work any more. |
Originally Posted by katsrevenge
(Post 16835496)
I rather enjoy this street. Nice old buildings, lower traffic, 25 MPH speed limit. One way with two lanes.
https://www.google.com/maps/search/s...77caa629e5b512 |
Originally Posted by Roody
(Post 16835514)
That is a nice street. It's like a lot of streets in my neighborhood with nice old buildings, shade trees, and lots of variety in the scenery. No need for a bike lane that I can see! If a street like that gets busy, everybody slows way down.
This kind of road does not need a bike lane, yes. Now the one I ride the side walk to get here.. that one does. Couldn't pay me to ride that one. Busy two way, narrow lanes and parking to the right. I've seen way too many accidents on that road to ride in that mess.
Originally Posted by cooker
(Post 16835824)
Is the parking always on the left? That adds to bicycle safety, although I'm not sure what it does for pedestrians and people getting out of parked cars. Maybe they're more at risk, from drivers edging left as they pass bikes.
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Originally Posted by cooker
(Post 16835824)
Is the parking always on the left? That adds to bicycle safety, although I'm not sure what it does for pedestrians and people getting out of parked cars. Maybe they're more at risk, from drivers edging left as they pass bikes.
There's some thinking that drivers are smarter about opening doors into traffic then passengers, but IME there are more dumb drivers than there are total passengers, so parking on left makes sense to me. |
I like to ride on local 4- and 6-lane roads (which mainly run east-west), with or without bike lanes. Although the traffic moves at 40-50mph and can be heavy, there are no stop signs and the distance between traffic light-controlled intersections makes riding more enjoyable for me. 2-, 4-, or 6-lane roads connect between the east-west routes, and enable me to plan fixed-distance workout routes in advance, as well as change them spontaneously. Good exercise is, literally, no more than a stone's-throw away from my front door.
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Originally Posted by enigmaT120
(Post 16835775)
My driveway: https://flic.kr/p/f4Q7un
Some gravel: https://flic.kr/p/f4PZ4V Some pavement: https://flic.kr/p/f4Q1DX These were some that I posted in a thread in the commuting section, but I can't find that thread now. How do I get my Flikr photos to show in a forum post any more? I used to copy the url from the photo's properties and use the Image forum button, but now Flikr has my pictures in a slide show format and that doesn't work any more. Edit... you can also right click on the flickr image and you'll see a menu. One of them lets you select photos in different sizes. Click on one, then right click and copy Image Url. https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3736/...ab7673a2a2.jpg |
Originally Posted by FBinNY
(Post 16835711)
Yes, and I'd like to eat unlimited amounts of pizzas without gaining weight. But neither of us will get our wishes.
However you and I agree that better roads in general are a higher priority than bike infrastructure. |
Originally Posted by squegeeboo
(Post 16835538)
Well the shortest route part is because I'm lazy.
The major roads over minor roads is due mostly to expected driver behavior. In slower traffic/residential areas, you tend to have more sidewalks, traffic devices, driveways, side streets, and other forms of merging traffic. On a major road, I know most cars are going straight, most cars joining traffic are coming from well defined intersections or parking lot entrances, and if I'm on the major road I have a lot less traffic lights and stop signs. If I'm on the side streets, there are more stop signs, and lights that aren't timed for the side streets, plus a lot of driveways and other side streets where I need to watch for right hooks and people pulling out a lot more. Then you also have random pedestrians doing pedestrian things because they're less worried about crossing a side street than a 2 lane each way road. And, cars turning onto the side streets are used to less and slower traffic and seem to do more rolling stops, while when turning onto the busier streets they tend to re-verify before merging in due to the higher speed of cars and the heaver traffic. |
Originally Posted by gerv
(Post 16836327)
Gorgeous view... but.. um rumble strips!
Incidentally, that road is Hwy 11 in Alberta between Saskatchewan River Crossing and Red Deer, the photograph was taken closer to the Saskatchewan River Crossing end. The shoulders are really good most of the way. They get a bit narrower in places between Rocky Mountain House and Red Deer, but still quite manageable. Rowan and I have cycled from Red Deer all the way out to Saskatchewan River Crossing (260 km), and then down to Banff, on a tour. And I have cycled various parts of that highway many times with Rowan, my father, and other cyclists. After having travelled and cycled in many parts of the world, that highway (especially the part between Saskatchewan River Crossing and Nordegg) is my favourite road for cycling. The best road I have encountered so far ... smoothest, cleanest, nicest shoulder ... light traffic ... gorgeous scenery ... varying terrain ... It is a joy to ride. :) |
Originally Posted by Machka
(Post 16836630)
The rumble strip is only about 1 foot wide, and right next to the white line. That leaves about 4-6 feet of smooth, beautiful pavement to cycle on between the rumble strip and the ditch.
Incidentally, that road is Hwy 11 in Alberta between Saskatchewan River Crossing and Red Deer, the photograph was taken closer to the Saskatchewan River Crossing end. The shoulders are really good most of the way. They get a bit narrower in places between Rocky Mountain House and Red Deer, but still quite manageable. Rowan and I have cycled from Red Deer all the way out to Saskatchewan River Crossing (260 km), and then down to Banff, on a tour. And I have cycled various parts of that highway many times with Rowan, my father, and other cyclists. After having travelled and cycled in many parts of the world, that highway (especially the part between Saskatchewan River Crossing and Nordegg) is my favourite road for cycling. The best road I have encountered so far ... smoothest, cleanest, nicest shoulder ... light traffic ... gorgeous scenery ... varying terrain ... It is a joy to ride. At Kenora, you see everybody coming through, as there is no other road. |
Originally Posted by katsrevenge
(Post 16835850)
Plus I have the Mary Poppins effect going on most of the time, LOL.
Originally Posted by FBinNY
(Post 16835869)
Parking on left is safer for everybody because is reduces the frequency of doors opened into the street side. All cars have drivers, but most don't have passengers.
There's some thinking that drivers are smarter about opening doors into traffic then passengers, but IME there are more dumb drivers than there are total passengers, so parking on left makes sense to me. |
Originally Posted by cooker
(Post 16836782)
Thanks - the western end is not too far from the TransCanada at Kicking Horse Pass - do you think many people incorporate Highway 11 into a cross-country ride? (Or maybe they would if they knew about it?)
There are campgrounds along Hwy 11 (Rowan and I have stayed in a couple of them) and the David Thompson Lodge. As you get closer to Nordegg there are a few more small lodge-type things and a HI Hostel just outside Nordegg (where we've also stayed a couple times). So there is accommodation. And you can get food and a few supplies at the David Thompson Lodge, at a little convenience shop in the middle of nowhere, and at Nordegg. However, I wouldn't guarantee mobile phone coverage. There is a good chance you'll spot wildlife along here. We've seen bear (grizzly and black), wolves (beautiful silver), and mountain goats ... and there are rumours of mountain lions. If someone were doing a cross Canada tour, I would recommend going up the Icefield Parkway (it is beautiful), then perhaps back down to SRC and out Hwy 11 to Red Deer, then meander down to Drumheller and take in the badlands, museum, etc. But you would have to enjoy solitude and quiet. :) The Edmonton Bicycle Club sometimes does rides from Nordegg out to SRC and back as a day-tour or hub-and-spoke tour. I rode with them once, and a group of us did a hike at Siffleur Falls, mid-ride. |
Originally Posted by cooker
(Post 16836812)
I don't get it. You fly over? No, seriously, I don't get it.Good points, although when I'm driving a car on a narrow street, especially a one-way street, I prefer parking to be on the right. ....
Bikes keep left on one ways makes good sense all the way around because drivers tend to have better vision and judgments toward the left. |
This is Hwy 93 between Castle Mountain and Radium Hotsprings. Castle Mountain is on the intersection of the Bow Valley Parkway (1A) and Hwy 93. This highway crosses a bridge, goes over the TransCanada Highway, and then starts to climb. You climb for the next 8 km or so, with steep bits going up to 8% ... then you descend a bit, and bottom out on the valley floor where you follow the river for some time. You climb again toward the end, and then you are treated to a terrifying curvy 11% descent into Radium Hotsprings. :D That photo was taken partway up that first 8 km climb. This road is about 100 km long and remote. You can get supplies at Castle Mountain ... then again halfway along at Vermillion ... and finally at Radium. There is no phone service along the road ... no land lines, no mobile. So if you're going to ride it, you do need to plan ahead. I have never seen that road busy, but some people say they have ... all in the timing, I guess. I've cycled it twice as Day 1 of the Golden Triangle Tour put on by Calgary's Elbow Valley Cycle Club (an excellent tour ... highly recommended), and several times as part of randonnees, including one night journey from Radium back to Castle Mountain. |
Originally Posted by Roody
(Post 16832698)
We just had an interesting thread about protected bike lanes. But most of us are stuck with plain old streets and highways--or even prefer them.
So I was wondering, what kind of streets do you all like to ride on? What are examples of highways that are shared nicely by cars and bikes? Pics are optional but nice. In the suburbs, the picture changes a lot. There are no through side streets, so that option is, tragically, not available. Fortunately, suburban arterials, even though the cars are moving 45-50 mph, often have gigantic 4-6 foot shoulders, some of which are even smooth and totally free of debris. In the case of very high-traffic, high-speed suburban arterials with no appreciable shoulder, I admit I retreat to the sidewalk if one's available. The sidewalk option is usually a lot like a noisy bike path, because in most of these types of landscapes, no one's using the sidewalk anyway. If there's no side street, no low-speed arterial, no shoulder, and no sidewalk, I won't go there by bike unless I have a very compelling reason and I don't have time to mess with the bus or car share. |
Originally Posted by Machka
(Post 16836859)
This is Hwy 93 between Castle Mountain and Radium Hotsprings.
But a stupid question. Usually long grades have two lanes climbing and one descending so slow moving vehicles can be passed on the climb. This road seems to be the opposite, unless it's a trick of the photo's perspective. So is this a photo illusion, or is there a reason for 2 lanes on the descent side, and no passing on the climb? |
Originally Posted by cooker
(Post 16836812)
I don't get it. You fly over? No, seriously, I don't get it..
Lovely Bicycle!: The Mary Poppins Effect? |
Originally Posted by FBinNY
(Post 16836910)
First of all, stop teasing the rest of us with beautiful scenery.
But a stupid question. Usually long grades have two lanes climbing and one descending so slow moving vehicles can be passed on the climb. This road seems to be the opposite, unless it's a trick of the photo's perspective. So is this a photo illusion, or is there a reason for 2 lanes on the descent side, and no passing on the climb? |
Originally Posted by Machka
(Post 16836928)
The two lanes on the right, separated by the white dotted line, are climbing away from me (the photographer) ... the one lane on the left is descending. At that particular location, the climb flattens a little, so I took the opportunity to stop and take a photo. Then it starts climbing again about where the trio of cyclists are.
So it is a trick of camera angle. That makes more sense. BTW -- there are a few roads not that far from here that present the same illusion to people riding on them. You'll be riding down what seems to be a long shallow grade, and struggling to maintain speed. I've gotten off and checked my bike a few times, but finally learned the secret by going the other way and coasting up. |
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