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Returning rider looking for opinions
So, it's been a while. I started out as a MTB rider. Then, I moved and found myself without trails to ride on. My father-in-law let me borrow his old high tensile steel Miyata from the late 70's and I was hooked. Rode that for a couple years until life happened and I had kids and 2 jobs. Haven't rode with any consistency for probably 6-7 years and really want to get back into it especially now that my oldest is probably going to drop the training wheels this summer and want to be everywhere.
I'm not going for anything crazy. I'm pretty much just looking to be a casual rider but really find that drop bars are more comfortable than flat bars. I've been looking at some of the sub $400 bikes over at bikesdirect.com and like what I see for the level of riding I intend on doing. Been looking at the Wellington 3.0 and 4.0. Looks like the only difference on those is steel fork vs. carbon fork. The Motobecane Mirage S looks nice as well. Also like the SuperMirage S and SL although those look more like CX bikes but would be nice to have the option of wider tires if I did any gravel trails at all. Edit: Forgot to mention that, yes I looked at the used market in my area. Looks like it's entirely vintage which 7-8 years ago I would have been all over. Just don't want to have to deal with any quirks of vintage any more. I have time to wrench but don't want to have to track down parts that will fit an older bike. I'm not 100% sure how I feel about cheap carbon for the fork. I've never owned any bikes with carbon on them at all much less what has to be low end carbon at these price points. Any opinions there? I have no problem wrenching and even enjoy it as I basically rebuilt the old Miyata when I rode it. I've even done some wheel building by learning from Sheldon Brown's web site. He was even kind enough to respond to some questions I had when Trying to rebuild a tacoed wheel with a new rim 15 years ago or so. Anyway, your help is much appreciated. Seems like the reviews I've read of most of these bikes is that they're a good deal if you're willing to work on them yourself. Otherwise, you're probably going to spend just as much if you have someone build it for you. |
I've never gone the bikesdirect route because I've never felt the need. Last winter, when I was in the market for an inexpensive sub-$400 bike, I went to my local bike shop. They had a previous year's model Specialized Allez (aluminum frame, carbon fork) on the floor for $400. It was a hideous color combination (neon babycrap green / neon orange and it sounds a lot prettier than it is). I was able to negotiate it down to get out the door for less than $300. And I didn't have to assemble anything -- fully assembled and fitted to me for bar and saddle position.
That bike is my "gets no respect" backup bike for when I don't want to or can't ride my primary road bike. But I think it says something that, in a year's time, I've put 2,750 miles on it. It's a great bike! [EDIT: It appears on Specialized's website that the least expensive Allez now lists for $840. I would still check local dealers for New Old Stock bikes in this series. Bargains can be found.] |
I hate answering these kinds of questions because l am recommending how someone allocates their resources not knowing how dear those resources are to them. But out if it were my money I would look at other alternatives based on several experiences I have had with people who have bought bikes from Bikesdirect. I do all my own wrenching on bikes which range from mtb to gravel to time trial to aero road to commuter to fat. I ride with numerous people who are newer to riding and do not want to spend the $1,000 to 1,500 to get a nice entry level bike. The vast majority of these bikes are never quite right from the beginning. Slight to major tolerance issues, inexpensive parts that will not stay adjusted and striped or severely over torqued bolts. Since it seems like you like to wrench, this would get very frustrating for you. Lastly, living in the cold northern climates I find the worst time to look for a used bike is during the winter. Fall is usually the best in my opinion as people need to get the car in the garage before winter. The second best is Spring, when people have just purchased a new bike and are unloading the old. So the lack of inventory is not that surprising! I recommed being patient and looking for a nice used bike, one that can be upgraded if you like over time and give you pleasure rather than pain when you ride it. One thing to be aware of when buying a used bike is that you can be buying deferred maintenance so bring someone or take to a mechanic if not sure yourself. eBay and craigslist can be good sources for used bikes as well. |
Time to hunt for a triple tandem? Perhaps a quad?
http://www.triplethire.com/images/Ch...se_350_jpg.jpg https://www.rodbikes.com/catalog/quad-picture.gif Unfortunately, it might blow up your budget. :eek: As far as budget oriented bikes, also keep the used market in mind. |
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This is indeed a thorny issue.
I don’t see any reason to spend $1000 to get an “entry-level” bike … “entry-level” is an undefined term anyway. The best way to figure out your needs is to describe what you plan to do with the bike. If you plan to ride fairly gently on smooth roads with not load heavier than a few tools and a jacket, you can get plenty of bike for $400. As for carbon forks, a cheap carbon fork is not going to snap or anything … it just won’t be a slight as an equally strong more expensive CF fork. What it will do is deaden some of the high-frequency vibration that Al forks are famous for transmitting into a rider’s hands. When you buy a $400 bike at Bikes Direct, you are basically getting a heavier bike with a few marginally weaker parts. Any bike with a multiple of seven in the back Could be (not necessarily anymore) a frewwhel, not a freehb bike, which means the rear axle is very marginally weaker, and your gear-ratio selection is pretty limited/ most riders simply won’t care, at that price point. The idea of swapping out cassettes for different terrain simply won’t occur to them (any more than most car owners with manual transmissions think about changing ratios, or drives in general think about changing the differential ring gear to suit different performance needs,) and those riders aren’t likely to subject the axles to sustained, high-energy impacts which might bend it. (I have toured fully loaded on a freewheel bike.) All the component s will be a little heavy, some of them a little plasticky, and some of them will feel a little clunky in operation … but most of them should work just fine. Most riders at that level aren’t gouing to be worrying about lightning fast, effortless shifts because they won’t be pushing for maximum performance. This looks like a decent deal—the Motobecane Mirage SL for $450, with new Claris 2400.. Save Up to 60% Off Carbon Fork Shimano Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S The Motobecane Super Mirage SL Disc (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...e-roadbike.htm) has last-generation Claris—which is good enough, I have it on one bike—but it has an Al fork. That might be more than offset by fatter, softer tires. The wide tires help with comfort but slow you down some … but you aren’t looking to race. The Mira disc brakes are not great, but should be easy to set up … which you might have to do frequently. I have not heard great things about them. I use Spyre SLC mechanical discs on one bike---top of that particular line which includes Mira—and I can say they don’t stop any better than rim brakes but of course stop Immediately in the wet, instead of fractions of a second later … which is not a huge deal for most riders. Still not a bad bike for a casual rider. You could have a lot of fun. However …. It might feel sort of sluggish compared to your old Miyata. The Windsor Wellington 4.0 ($400) (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...ington4-xv.htm) has that 21-speed drive train I mentioned above. I am not sure but it May be a freewheel design. I don’t think so … but …. It really shouldn’t matter anyway. I wish I could find out for sure, but there is a limit to how much research I am willing to do. I have a very similar CF fork on a Dawes I bought from BD—rock-solid fork. Have no fear. The steel fork of the 3.0 will be a little heavier. It will deliver as good a ride as the CF fork. Is a CF fork worth $50? Honestly, on a bike of that quality … Not to me. The whole thing will weigh so much anyway, the CF fok with Al steerer won’t make much of a difference, IMO. My most serious and least wanted advice … comeon, you knew this was coming … Save up a little more. If all you really want to do is follow the kids around the neighborhood, you can get a perfectly serviceable bike for $100 at any Walmart-type store. If you want a bike you can go out and ride with some real pleasure for a lot of years, you probably want to spend $700 or so. I suggest this because once you buy a bike, (kids and stuff) you won’t likely be able to buy another bike for several years … which means you might be really wishing you had spent a few bucks more for several years. $300 is a lot of money … but at the same time it is a penny a day. I guarantee you, if you really enjoy riding, you will likely enjoy riding more on a bike with At Least 2400 Claris, and hopefully new Sora. Maybe something a couple pounds lighter. And maybe a little sturdier … cheap wheels with cheap hubs can be a pain, derailleurs which don’t stay adjusted can be a pain …. From what BD offers now, the Motobecane Grand Record looks like a good deal ($700) (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...record_yvi.htm) Here’s why: Shimano RS100 Wheelset right off the top. Shimano doesn’t make bad stuff. Even their cheap stuff is decent. These are not lightweight, racy wheels … but you won’t likely need to get them serviced more than once. One time being put true and tensioned, and you will probably be able to ride them for a decade or more. Second, it has a threaded bottom bracket, but not a super-cheap one. Very important, it has Tiagra 4700 running gear. This is good stuff (though I wish it were a double, not a triple—I think that is overkill.) This is a very pleasant drive train, I hear. I have 4500 and 4600 on a pair of bikes, with some 4700 parts … and 4700 is supposed to be better. Also important—the bike has a tall head tube, and by just flipping the stem you could have a very comfortable, relaxed, upright riding position,. Flip the stem down and you can be more racy. Swap a different stem (a good one is $15-$30) and you can have even more extreme upright or racy posture on the bike. A bike with “Race” geometry, which usually included the shortest possible had tube, might not suit a more casual rider. Also, it has some pretty nice tires, my personal favorite Conti UltraSport II. Tires wear out, so no big deal, but … Drawback: you would need to spend $10 or $15 to buy some cheap pedals … or take them off another bike. Thios bike comes with clip-in pedals, which might not suit you. You would have to buy shoes and cleats … not sure if you’d like to or not. Whatever. Only you really know your finances and your desires, and the bikes you are looking at will work just fine for casual riding. I was on a charity tour that went from LA to DC on $500 Dawes bikes form BD and other than adjusting brakes and derailleurs and getting some wheels trued, they were maintenance-free. I still have one (though I upgraded it) and still ride it now and then. You don’t Have to spend a lot of money to get a good, ridable bike. You just need to decide how much you want to ride and how hard, and how hard you want to work. If you just want to go out a few evenings and occasional weekends, any of the bikes you are looking at should be fine. |
I'd suggest craigslist for this bike. If you decide you want to ride more, you're going to decide you want something different than what you have anyway, so...
As for riding with kids, I can only speak for myself, but I've found that a road bike isn't the best for that sort of thing... It's better to ride something slow and clunky with the kids -- and you'll STILL find yourself having to actualyl work hard to ride that slowly. This can probably be bargained down under $300.. Needs a new stem and tires, probably: https://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/b...799310827.html Maybe this? https://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/b...792729174.html Either way, make sure anything you buy actually fits you... |
I think Craigslist is worth a look as well. Every now and then some there are some great deals to be had. For example, I sold my lightly used Specialized Tarmac carbon fiber bike for $450 a few months ago. If nothing turns us on CL, Bikes Direct bikes offer a good value at their price point. I have helped a number of people set lower priced ones up over the years and they were fine. One girl rode her sub $300 bike in a few triathlons before upgrading. A $350 BD bike is what got me back in the saddle after a layoff about 10 years ago. Another option is Bike Island. They partner with BD and sell their scratch and dents. They offer free shipping as well.
https://bikeisland.com/cgi-bin/BKTK_...=Bikes:%20Road You have to scroll to the bottom of each bike's description to see what the defects are. Typically it's just scratched dropouts. The more common sizes sell pretty quickly, so check regularly. |
This impresses me as a very good deal.
https://bikeisland.com/cgi-bin/BKTK_...ls&ProdID=2241 Tiagra and 105. The wheels aren't the greatest, but at the price point they are good enough. |
Originally Posted by Paul Barnard
(Post 20764409)
This impresses me as a very good deal.
https://bikeisland.com/cgi-bin/BKTK_...ls&ProdID=2241 Tiagra and 105. The wheels aren't the greatest, but at the price point they are good enough. |
Originally Posted by rms13
(Post 20764450)
"Shifters: NEW Shimano Tiagra shifters integrated into brake levers, 18-speed Compact Drive " ....NEW as in new when this bike came out like 10 years ago
These Bike Island bikes are scratch-and-dent bikes from Bikes Direct---one size only, maybe be some minor defects or missing some parts. it sounds like this one was cobbled together with whatever parts where on the shelf, some 4700, some 4600, and some 5800. I was actually looking for this bike on BD's site because I own a version of it and can personally recommend it. But ... it is only available in 54 cm. That should fit a wide range of riders ... but not everyone. I could ride it---in fact it would fit better than mine, and I rode mine most fo the way across the U.S. in 2015. If it even close to correct size, I'd say, Jump on it. This is a very good basic bike. |
Thanks for the comments! First, the comments including links to Craigslist, I should probably update my profile. I'm no longer in the Chicago area and just moved to St. Louis 3 weeks ago. As such, I'm probably not going to purchase anything until I get into someplace bigger. I'm working on selling a house in Chicago and finding a new house here. As a result, I'm living in a tiny room in a fairly small house with 6-7 other people. Not really any room for a bike at the moment.
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20764187)
This is indeed a thorny issue.
I don’t see any reason to spend $1000 to get an “entry-level” bike … “entry-level” is an undefined term anyway. The best way to figure out your needs is to describe what you plan to do with the bike. If you plan to ride fairly gently on smooth roads with not load heavier than a few tools and a jacket, you can get plenty of bike for $400.
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20764187)
As for carbon forks, a cheap carbon fork is not going to snap or anything … it just won’t be a slight as an equally strong more expensive CF fork. What it will do is deaden some of the high-frequency vibration that Al forks are famous for transmitting into a rider’s hands.
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20764187)
When you buy a $400 bike at Bikes Direct, you are basically getting a heavier bike with a few marginally weaker parts.
Any bike with a multiple of seven in the back Could be (not necessarily anymore) a frewwhel, not a freehb bike, which means the rear axle is very marginally weaker, and your gear-ratio selection is pretty limited/ most riders simply won’t care, at that price point. The idea of swapping out cassettes for different terrain simply won’t occur to them (any more than most car owners with manual transmissions think about changing ratios, or drives in general think about changing the differential ring gear to suit different performance needs,) and those riders aren’t likely to subject the axles to sustained, high-energy impacts which might bend it. (I have toured fully loaded on a freewheel bike.) All the component s will be a little heavy, some of them a little plasticky, and some of them will feel a little clunky in operation … but most of them should work just fine. Most riders at that level aren’t gouing to be worrying about lightning fast, effortless shifts because they won’t be pushing for maximum performance..
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20764187)
This looks like a decent deal—the Motobecane Mirage SL for $450, with new Claris 2400.. Save Up to 60% Off Carbon Fork Shimano Road Bikes - Motobecane Mirage S
The Motobecane Super Mirage SL Disc (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...e-roadbike.htm) has last-generation Claris—which is good enough, I have it on one bike—but it has an Al fork. That might be more than offset by fatter, softer tires. The wide tires help with comfort but slow you down some … but you aren’t looking to race. The Mira disc brakes are not great, but should be easy to set up … which you might have to do frequently. I have not heard great things about them. I use Spyre SLC mechanical discs on one bike---top of that particular line which includes Mira—and I can say they don’t stop any better than rim brakes but of course stop Immediately in the wet, instead of fractions of a second later … which is not a huge deal for most riders. Still not a bad bike for a casual rider. You could have a lot of fun. However …. It might feel sort of sluggish compared to your old Miyata. The Windsor Wellington 4.0 ($400) (Save Up to 60% Off Carbon Fork Road Bikes - Windsor Wellington 4.0 Web Sale Prices) has that 21-speed drive train I mentioned above. I am not sure but it May be a freewheel design. I don’t think so … but …. It really shouldn’t matter anyway. I wish I could find out for sure, but there is a limit to how much research I am willing to do. I have a very similar CF fork on a Dawes I bought from BD—rock-solid fork. Have no fear. The steel fork of the 3.0 will be a little heavier. It will deliver as good a ride as the CF fork. Is a CF fork worth $50? Honestly, on a bike of that quality … Not to me. The whole thing will weigh so much anyway, the CF fok with Al steerer won’t make much of a difference, IMO.. I've worked with cheap discs before. They can be fidly to get set up right for sure but can be nice if they get wet. Having said that, I'm not planning on riding in the rain unless I get caught out on a ride. I think the biggest advantage for me would be the added clearance for bigger tires. The Miyata felt quick compared to a MTB but it was HEAVY. High tensile steel (not cromo) and the rims were steel as well. with the Wellington bikes, they list a cassette part number under freewheel/cassette which would lead me to believe that it is in fact a freehub. With regard to the carbon forks again, if I planned on doing any gravel trails, would something with steel forks be better? I know you said that the cheap carbon wouldn't snap on me, but the steel forks look like they tend to give more clearance for larger tires for comfort as well as getting off a paved but still relatively smooth surface.
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20764187)
My most serious and least wanted advice … comeon, you knew this was coming …
Save up a little more. If all you really want to do is follow the kids around the neighborhood, you can get a perfectly serviceable bike for $100 at any Walmart-type store. If you want a bike you can go out and ride with some real pleasure for a lot of years, you probably want to spend $700 or so. I suggest this because once you buy a bike, (kids and stuff) you won’t likely be able to buy another bike for several years … which means you might be really wishing you had spent a few bucks more for several years. $300 is a lot of money … but at the same time it is a penny a day. I guarantee you, if you really enjoy riding, you will likely enjoy riding more on a bike with At Least 2400 Claris, and hopefully new Sora. Maybe something a couple pounds lighter. And maybe a little sturdier … cheap wheels with cheap hubs can be a pain, derailleurs which don’t stay adjusted can be a pain …. From what BD offers now, the Motobecane Grand Record looks like a good deal ($700) (http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...record_yvi.htm) Here’s why: Shimano RS100 Wheelset right off the top. Shimano doesn’t make bad stuff. Even their cheap stuff is decent. These are not lightweight, racy wheels … but you won’t likely need to get them serviced more than once. One time being put true and tensioned, and you will probably be able to ride them for a decade or more. Second, it has a threaded bottom bracket, but not a super-cheap one. Very important, it has Tiagra 4700 running gear. This is good stuff (though I wish it were a double, not a triple—I think that is overkill.) This is a very pleasant drive train, I hear. I have 4500 and 4600 on a pair of bikes, with some 4700 parts … and 4700 is supposed to be better. Also important—the bike has a tall head tube, and by just flipping the stem you could have a very comfortable, relaxed, upright riding position,. Flip the stem down and you can be more racy. Swap a different stem (a good one is $15-$30) and you can have even more extreme upright or racy posture on the bike. A bike with “Race” geometry, which usually included the shortest possible had tube, might not suit a more casual rider. Also, it has some pretty nice tires, my personal favorite Conti UltraSport II. Tires wear out, so no big deal, but … Drawback: you would need to spend $10 or $15 to buy some cheap pedals … or take them off another bike. Thios bike comes with clip-in pedals, which might not suit you. You would have to buy shoes and cleats … not sure if you’d like to or not. Whatever. Only you really know your finances and your desires, and the bikes you are looking at will work just fine for casual riding. I was on a charity tour that went from LA to DC on $500 Dawes bikes form BD and other than adjusting brakes and derailleurs and getting some wheels trued, they were maintenance-free. I still have one (though I upgraded it) and still ride it now and then. You don’t Have to spend a lot of money to get a good, ridable bike. You just need to decide how much you want to ride and how hard, and how hard you want to work. If you just want to go out a few evenings and occasional weekends, any of the bikes you are looking at should be fine. As far as going the cheap, Wal-Mart bike route, I've been down that road with some of my early MTB experience and I'm not going back. Also, I don't think I've ever seen a bike with drops in Wal-Mart. I know it's not normal for casual riding but I just really like drop bars due to having more hand positions available. Really don't wan something with flat bars. Although, now that I'm reading your final sentence, you may be right. The ~$400 bikes might be what I'm looking for. May even spend a little bit more and get something a bit nicer that should last a bit longer. |
One timy thing----steel forks vs. CF ... weight is the only issue. CF is plenty rugged, and steel .. well, it's steel. Both deliver a nice ride. Whichever is equipped on the bike you choose will be fine.
Let us know what you finally end up with, please. |
Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20765287)
One timy thing----steel forks vs. CF ... weight is the only issue. CF is plenty rugged, and steel .. well, it's steel. Both deliver a nice ride. Whichever is equipped on the bike you choose will be fine.
Let us know what you finally end up with, please. |
Lots of good information in this thread. I think any of the Bikes Direct bikes would be just fine - but you might be able to get something even better. I'm not against BD bikes - I own a BD single speed - but I ended up changing out a lot of components to make it something that I'd want to use on a daily basis.
As others have mentioned, spring can be a very good time to look on Craigslist, as some riders have purchased new bikes for the season and are looking to unload their old ones. I've personally found winter to be a good time on ebay; shipping will eat into the budget, but you might find a gem with a bit of work. Other brands that can be found online, sometimes with crazy low closeout prices, include Jamis, Fuji, and Blue; they're all fine brands IMO but without the brand-name price tag of Trek/Giant/etc. I tend to agree with @Maelochs that $700 is kind of a sweet spot for a road bike; it will get you into a very nice entry-level bike, or - if you know what you're doing - a very competitive machine from the used market. Whatever you go with, I'll also be excited to see your New Bike Day! |
Just poking around on BD tonight and I found this: Save Up to 60% Off NEW High Grade Reynolds Steel Road Bikes On Sale + FREE SHIP 48 Super Road, Wide Tires, Reynolds High Grade Steel Bikes with Lugged Crown CrMo Forks Motobecane Strada LTD 1.0, Shimano 24 Speed Plus Fast Aero Profile Wheels
The rider from 9 years ago is in love with the high quality steel but you can still use modern components. Any thoughts on at least the frame? I think I see several other bikes that use the same frame with better components. I've only gotten a chance to ride really good quality steel but I remember it being surprisingly light weight. Also, does that look like braze ons on the fork for various accessories like fenders, panniers, etc? Can't tell on my screen. |
Yes, it looks like the fork has braze-ons, but I'd email or phone before buying on that basis. I would worry a bit about the octa-link BB because there isn't much out there for replacement. However, it is threaded in, so any threaded BB, including Hollowgram and threaded cartridge BBs fit right it ... but you'd need a new crank set.
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
(Post 20772385)
Yes, it looks like the fork has braze-ons, but I'd email or phone before buying on that basis. I would worry a bit about the octa-link BB because there isn't much out there for replacement. However, it is threaded in, so any threaded BB, including Hollowgram and threaded cartridge BBs fit right it ... but you'd need a new crank set.
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I figured I'd revisit this since I did decide on a bike! Went with this one: Save Up to 60% Off NEW High Grade Reynolds Steel Road Bikes On Sale + FREE SHIP 48 Super Road, Wide Tires, Reynolds High Grade Steel Bikes with Lugged Crown CrMo Forks Motobecane Strada LTD 1.0, Shimano 24 Speed Plus Fast Aero Profile Wheels Got the blue one in a 56cm frame. Absolutely love it! went together pretty easily. Most everything was pretty well adjusted right out of the box. About the only thing that needed any real adjustment after connecting the brake cables was the rear brake since the bolt didn't seem to be as tight as it should be. The brake moved somewhat easily but these are pretty easy to center. Now if they could just send me a rider that was in better shape and if the rain would just stop. Only had a chance to get out once since getting the bike last week because it's been raining here almost non-stop!
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You owe us a picture any time you get a new bike. House rules.
:) |
Originally Posted by Seattle Forrest
(Post 20912022)
You owe us a picture any time you get a new bike. House rules.
:) |
Yeah, I need to get some pics up of it. I just get depressed when I walk by it because I haven't gotten to ride it in a week. Hopefully soon.
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Hi
I'm thinking in getting that same bike, can you tell me how is it?
I'm thinking in riding gravel trails with it. Any input helps. |
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