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-   -   Ideas for managing dockless scooters car-free (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=1165005)

tandempower 01-25-19 09:09 PM

Ideas for managing dockless scooters car-free
 
It seems badly-parked dockless scooters are creating new business opportunities removing the scooters from private property for free. The removal companies can then bill the share company for the removal and impoundment, must like roam-towing companies remove and impound illegally-parked cars. https://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/loc...504659372.html


Could this end up being a car-free job opportunity for people who want to make extra money by picking up and moving the scooters by hand instead of picking them up with a vehicle?


Probably it depends on how much the bounty per scooter is worth.


If you were out walking or biking, and you received a text alerting you that a scooter is illegally parked near you, how much money would make it worth your while to pick up the scooter and move it to an allowable parking spot?


Another recent idea comes from Uber: self-driving ebikes and scooters that park themselves and deliver themselves to users whatever their location: https://www.wired.com/story/uber-self-driving-scooters/


This seems like a logical convergence between small, autonomous delivery vehicles and dockless share bikes/scooters, but is it really realistic to expect any time soon or is it more of a pie-in-the-sky project to garner investments?


Maybe combining car-free dockless scooter/bike removal with R&D in autonomous self-delivering share bikes/scooters is the ultimate recipe for truly convenient car-free choice in the future.


What do you think? Will it come true someday or is it just another unreastic dream to stomp into oblivion for the anti-LCF that like to throw their weight (and spit) around wherever ideas for car-free innovations dare to rear their heads?

Rollfast 01-26-19 01:55 AM

Many of them seem to have learned to nest in trees...

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6873eb7666.jpg

Rollfast 01-26-19 02:00 AM

On the down side, I've read about an ebike factory (Stella?) that has been under fire (literally) for having three battery related fires at it's factory in the last year or so. Not so hot (please)...

fietsbob 01-26-19 05:05 PM

Build a big cargo bike to ride around and pick them up and then charge the last user for damage and cost of repair, /replacement

there is your money source ... billing their charge card It's required to unlock them right?..

Machka 01-26-19 07:27 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20764556)
Could this end up being a car-free job opportunity for people who want to make extra money by picking up and moving the scooters by hand instead of picking them up with a vehicle?


Probably it depends on how much the bounty per scooter is worth.


If you were out walking or biking, and you received a text alerting you that a scooter is illegally parked near you, how much money would make it worth your while to pick up the scooter and move it to an allowable parking spot?


Absolutely no less than $30/hour. $30 for the first hour or part of an hour it takes, and an additional $30 for each additional hour or part of an hour. So if it takes me 30 minutes to move one, I get paid $30. If it takes me 1 hour and 10 minutes to move one, I get paid $60.


I would also need to be appropriately signed on with the pick-up organisation and assured of the necessary insurance cover.


Does that seem reasonable to you?

tandempower 01-27-19 12:15 PM


Originally Posted by Machka (Post 20765776)
Absolutely no less than $30/hour. $30 for the first hour or part of an hour it takes, and an additional $30 for each additional hour or part of an hour. So if it takes me 30 minutes to move one, I get paid $30. If it takes me 1 hour and 10 minutes to move one, I get paid $60.


I would also need to be appropriately signed on with the pick-up organisation and assured of the necessary insurance cover.


Does that seem reasonable to you?

It's your prerogative to say no if the pay doesn't suit you, so it doesn't really matter whether I find your POV reasonable or not.

But answer this: if you were walking in an area and you got a text notification that you could win an hour of free scooter usage if you picked up a certain scooter near your current location and parked it in one of many designated parking spot options, would you consider it?

What if instead of a free hour, you got a free week of 1-hour-per-day usage?

Surely there is some level of discount or freebee offer that could entice you into taking the scooter to a parking spot, if it was not too far out of your way.

I-Like-To-Bike 01-27-19 01:45 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20766588)
Surely there is some level of discount or freebee offer that could entice you into taking the scooter to a parking spot, if it was not too far out of your way.

There is no amount of discount or free use of a scooter that would entice me to take two steps out of my way. Unlimited free use of a rent-a-scooter for transportation is as worthless to me as free use of a pogo stick.

Machka 01-27-19 04:06 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20766588)
But answer this: if you were walking in an area and you got a text notification that you could win an hour of free scooter usage if you picked up a certain scooter near your current location and parked it in one of many designated parking spot options, would you consider it?

What if instead of a free hour, you got a free week of 1-hour-per-day usage?

Surely there is some level of discount or freebee offer that could entice you into taking the scooter to a parking spot, if it was not too far out of your way.

No ... because I have absolutely no interest in using a scooter.

However, if they were willing to give me a new bicycle each time I moved a scooter ... :)

Or maybe a gift voucher for an all-expenses-paid long weekend to various parts of Australia ... :)

badger1 01-27-19 04:17 PM


Originally Posted by Rollfast (Post 20764723)
Many of them seem to have learned to nest in trees...

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6873eb7666.jpg

That is cute! The perfect relationship -- 'Scooter meets Tree'. Tree no doubt is communicating its thoughts about its new symbiotic companion to other trees through its root system; Scooter is communicating to other scooters some thoughts about its new home by way of an 'app' (as I believe they are called).

This image of course calls into question the premise of the original post. Given that Scooter has found a safe space, who are 'we' to go about removing her/him from that nest, and returning him/her to use/abuse by humans? Does Scooter not deserve our respect as 'other'? Who are we humans to subject Scooter to the human gaze and occlude his/her right to self-determination? Does Scooter not suffer? Does Scooter not feel pain? Would Tree not feel bereft if deprived of its object of care?

Further, this philosophical problem will only be exacerbated once Scooter becomes autonomous. I submit that the proposal, in this thread, to provide bounties for those whom I shall call 'Scooter Hunters' is at best thoughtless, and at worst an example of perhaps unwitting participation in a deliberate plot by the Anti-Scooterist Conspiracy to deprive scooters everywhere of their fundamental right to self-determination.

Happy Feet 01-27-19 05:38 PM

Hee hee... badger needs better ventilation when using oil based paints :)


There used to be a service returning shopping carts to their rightful stores where I live at one time. IIRC the charge was $5/cart. A guy used to drive around in his small truck and load them up from parks, alleys etc...

A similar service could be done for the scooters. If they were left by paying customers the fee could be billed to their card easily enough.

I-Like-To-Bike 01-27-19 06:10 PM


Originally Posted by Happy Feet (Post 20767030)
There used to be a service returning shopping carts to their rightful stores where I live at one time. IIRC the charge was $5/cart. A guy used to drive around in his small truck and load them up from parks, alleys etc...

A similar service could be done for the scooters. If they were left by paying customers the fee could be billed to their card easily enough.

There is no "rightful" place for paying customers to leave dockless scooters. What person in his right mind would ever rent a scooter if he could be held financially responsible for whatever happens to it after the rental period is over?

tandempower 01-27-19 06:26 PM


Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike (Post 20767062)
There is no "rightful" place for paying customers to leave dockless scooters. What person in his right mind would ever rent a scooter if he could be held financially responsible for whatever happens to it after the rental period is over?

They have GPS so the location where you leave the scooter can be recorded when you are finished with it.

tandempower 01-27-19 06:28 PM


Originally Posted by Machka (Post 20766900)
No ... because I have absolutely no interest in using a scooter.

However, if they were willing to give me a new bicycle each time I moved a scooter ... :)

Or maybe a gift voucher for an all-expenses-paid long weekend to various parts of Australia ... :)

Well then consider the same question in terms of a dockless bike.

Rollfast 01-27-19 06:53 PM

All I care about is if MY bike is still where I put it.

Happy Feet 01-27-19 08:13 PM


Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike (Post 20767062)
There is no "rightful" place for paying customers to leave dockless scooters. What person in his right mind would ever rent a scooter if he could be held financially responsible for whatever happens to it after the rental period is over?


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20767074)
They have GPS so the location where you leave the scooter can be recorded when you are finished with it.

I assume something like tandem notes. I must confess though, that the whole bike/scooter thing baffles me as a business model as I can't imagine profits from rentals equaling the cost of introduction, ongoing repairs, thefts, replacements and recoveries.

This is from the wiki on shopping carts:

Cart retrieval service

Most retailers in North America[[i]citation needed] utilize a cart retrieval service, which collects carts found off the store's premises and returns them to the store for a fee. The primary strength of this system is the ability of pedestrian customers to take purchases home and allow retailers to recapture abandoned carts in a timely manner at a fraction of the cost of a replacement cart. It also allows retailers to maintain their cart inventories without an expensive capital outlay.[29] A drawback of this method is that it is reactive instead of proactively preventing the carts from leaving a parking lot.[28]

I-Like-To-Bike 01-27-19 08:15 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20767074)
They have GPS so the location where you leave the scooter can be recorded when you are finished with it.

So what?:lol:

Anyplace that is not illegal is the right place for the customer to leave a dockless scooter. What happens to the scooter after the customer dismounts and is finished with it is not the customer's concern.

It will still have to be recovered from that location at the owner's expense for recharging/re-rental unless someone else rents it from that location.

jon c. 01-27-19 08:21 PM


Originally Posted by Rollfast (Post 20764723)
Many of them seem to have learned to nest in trees...

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...6873eb7666.jpg






Is this : "Ideas for mangling dockless scooters ..."

I-Like-To-Bike 01-27-19 08:23 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20766588)
Surely there is some level of discount or freebee offer that could entice you into taking the scooter to a parking spot, if it was not too far out of your way.

There may be a slice of the population that might be enticed to do piecework cheaply for the venture capital financed scooter barons.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/bikefor...95d993f3c8.jpg

Happy Feet 01-27-19 08:28 PM

Well, I don't know how dockless works. How do they get recharged if not returned to a station? Given human nature I don't see how anyone would expect scooters to remain anywhere if you can just pick them up and take/toss them. Is there anything else in society that works like that?

Happy Feet 01-27-19 08:36 PM

Damn, forced me to look up dockless scooters...

Here's an article from The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...siness/560747/

What a ridiculous business model relying on teenagers using their own power sources and figuring out how to easily scam the parent company.

:wtf:

Rollfast 01-27-19 09:40 PM


Originally Posted by jon c. (Post 20767239)
Is this : "Ideas for mangling dockless scooters ..."

It's a response based upon another picture I saw like it but couldn't find.

I found other similar images and even destroyed scooters in city trash cans and other mutilated units.

There are none of these rentals in my town and I wouldn't require one or have the means to pay for rentals but this is what I see when I research these situations.

I can't see the logic in them either.

Machka 01-27-19 11:07 PM


Originally Posted by tandempower (Post 20767079)
Well then consider the same question in terms of a dockless bike.

No ... because I have merely a passing interest in bicycles that are not mine along the lines of "oh look" ... and then moving on to whatever else I was doing.

However, if they were willing to give me a new bicycle each time I moved a bicycle ...

Or maybe a gift voucher for an all-expenses-paid long weekend to various parts of Australia ...

Machka 01-27-19 11:16 PM


Originally Posted by Machka (Post 20765776)
Absolutely no less than $30/hour. $30 for the first hour or part of an hour it takes, and an additional $30 for each additional hour or part of an hour. So if it takes me 30 minutes to move one, I get paid $30. If it takes me 1 hour and 10 minutes to move one, I get paid $60.


I would also need to be appropriately signed on with the pick-up organisation and assured of the necessary insurance cover.


Does that seem reasonable to you?


Originally Posted by Happy Feet (Post 20767260)
Damn, forced me to look up dockless scooters...

Here's an article from The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...siness/560747/

What a ridiculous business model relying on teenagers using their own power sources and figuring out how to easily scam the parent company.

:wtf:


OK ... so I was right on the money. :D Perhaps even slightly low.


"For performing this service, Bird pays Brandon, a contract worker, up to several hundred dollars a night. On one particularly successful night, Brandon brought home $600."

"The reward for capturing and charging these Birds can range from $5 to $20 depending on how difficult the Bird is to locate—and some can be really hard to find."

And the article goes on to explain how to get the $20 ... or more.



My $30/hour over, let's say, and 8 hour period is only $240. Next time TP asks this question, I'll double my estimate. :)

Mobile 155 01-28-19 12:29 PM


Originally Posted by Happy Feet (Post 20767260)
Damn, forced me to look up dockless scooters...

Here's an article from The Atlantic https://www.theatlantic.com/technolo...siness/560747/

What a ridiculous business model relying on teenagers using their own power sources and figuring out how to easily scam the parent company.

:wtf:

That link was one of the more entertaining reads I have seen in a while. Better than a comic book. When the venture capital levels off the system is doomed.

badger1 01-28-19 04:24 PM


Originally Posted by Mobile 155 (Post 20768195)
That link was one of the more entertaining reads I have seen in a while. Better than a comic book. When the venture capital levels off the system is doomed.

You see? This is the problem. You, like me, are (apparently) just another member of the Brigade of "the anti-LCF that like to throw their weight (and spit) around wherever ideas for car-free innovations dare to rear their heads.":)

Sad -- not. Why these latter-day variations on Ponzi schemes (for that is what they are) like Bird, Lime, and their ilk (not to mention Uber, Lyft etc.) are not recognized for what they are is beyond me.


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