650b/27.5" Hybrid Options
 

After a great adventure with lots of biking in Utah last week (more on that later in another thread), I'm interested in buying something with 27.5" wheels and hydraulic disc brakes. I have never had more than a passing curiosity with disc brakes, especially hydraulic discs, but I was blown away at their power, modulation, and resistance to any sort of fading or degradation on longer hills. I was completely sold the first time I rode them. Because retrofitting one of my current bikes is not economically feasible, I'm planning on buying something new.

It has to have hydraulic discs, and I'd like to try a 27.5"/rigid fork frame. The bike I used had a 100mm travel XCM fork, but I don't think I need that, and I like the stability that a rigid fork provides (no wiggle in the stanchions, etc). In other words, any modern mountain bike (that I've seen) is out, as they all use suspension forks.

The Giant ARX (used to be called the ATX Lite in 2017) is currently my front-running option. A dealer 70 miles away has both the medium and large frames in stock in the black/blue/yellow color combination, which is the one I think I like the best, so I plan to look at that dealer soon.

The other bike I like is the Specialized Roll, but I'm having trouble with the value of the bike. At $500, the Giant ATX has hydraulic discs and a 3x8 cassette drivetrain (and weighs in at about 26 pounds according to other threads on the ATX Lite). At $575, the Specialized Roll Sport has mechanical discs and a 7-speed freewheel, which are both non-starters for this purchase. It's the $700 Roll Elite that competes with the ARX on specs, and the Specialized is 40% more expensive than the Giant. I almost always recommend letting the spec sheet and price play second fiddle to things like fit (which I still think is valid), but that's a significant price difference.

Are there other hyd disc/rigid fork 27.5" hybrids that I'm overlooking? I know I need to find the right fit and all that -- at this point, I'm wondering just how many options there are to begin with. It seems that Giant and Specialized are the only two horses in the race given the things I want. Other ideas? (I like the Raleigh Redux also...it has a 1x drivetrain that I'm still on the fence about.)

Thanks in advance.

What type of riding do you do and why the 27.5"? Are you small? If that is the reason, some bikes change wheelsize from S to XL.
The only other reason for 27.5" is tighter cornering for MTB technical trails..... but since you want rigid fork I doubt you have that in mind.

Riding is 50% off pavement and 50% on paved or highly dressed trails. Off pavement riding is crushed gravel or some single track forest paths (but not gnarly stuff). I'm looking at 27.5" to keep the overall tire size down while still being able to run a 2.0-2.25" tire. A 29er with tires that thick just get too large for my preference. I'm 6'0", so not small, but I don't care for super large tires.

I should say that I don't care for super large diameter tires. I do like large section width tires (2"+), which is why I'm preferring 27.5" for this bike, to keep the overall tire size from becoming too large.

You can get any size tire for either 27.5 or 29"/700c.
For your riding a 2" sounds good. Like the Giant Toughroad would be great. But for your size I don't know of a bike with 27.5.

I don't understand yor objection to a tire size that clearly comes with bikes for your size. As I said, 27.5 is only used on small frames or MTB designed for tight cornering, neither applies to hybrids for 6' tall people. 29" rolls much better.

27.5" tires are available on all sizes of frames, and this size is starting to be offered on a number of hybrids, like the Giant ARX and the Specialized Roll (though I'm not familiar with others, yet). Both of these bikes come exclusively with 27.5" tires and are available with large frame sizes, and neither of these bikes are mountain bikes for tight trails. In fact, both bikes come with frames that would be TOO large for me. For either one, I'm probably in between a Medium and a Large, and both are available in eXtra Large as well. The Giant's XL frame has a stand over of 32", which I could not physically stand over.

I like 27.5" tires because I like the 700c size. As you know, 700mm = 27.6", so a tire with a diameter of 700mm has a functionally equivalent diameter and circumference as a 27.5" tire. There are a number of resources and websites that list the pros and cons of 29" and 27.5" tire sizes (and both sizes do have benefits and drawbacks), but the ultimate test for me is the bike itself. Here's one from Giant itself:

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/int/technology/detail/94

I own a number of 700c hybrids with tires that measure a true 700mm (622mm rim + 39mm sidewall + 39mm sidewall = 700mm), and that tire diameter is about as large as I'd like. I rode a couple of 29er MTBs while in Utah, and didn't care for the larger diameter of the tires (about 730mm). The extra weight and diameter just made for steering that didn't feel quite as quick or as controllable to me. The 27.5" mountain bike I rode felt like a better balance.

A bike like the ARX with 27.5x2.25" (or similar) will give me a rigid frame hybrid with tires that have the same diameter as my other 700c hybrids (but with more air volume). One of my favorite bikes is my Trek 750, with the 39mm tires I mentioned above (they're marked 42mm, but are 39mm inflated). It's a rigid frame hybrid that I love to ride. But it has rim brakes and could not be easily converted to discs, at least not at a reasonable cost. The closest that I think I can get to that is something like a Giant ARX, which will have a 700mm tire diameter, a rigid frame, and the hydraulic discs that I'd like.

OK, that explains your reasoning a bit. But I still would judge each bike on its own regardless of wheelsize. the problems you tell about the bikes you used could be geometry problems, or wheel problems etc.

I saw the giant size comparison before and they are not wrong, but mis-represent. Any design or sizing for bicycles is a compromise and so is wheel size. and if Giant would be serious with that, they would have to mention that for every 29" bicycle they sell (most of theirs) and basically tell us to not buy giant 29" bicycles :)

with a 29" wheel you likely have a 2" tire for a hybrid, not a 2.6" like for a 27.5" with that the weight difference is negligible. and even if you use same size tire, they claim 1.5% vs. 3.6" worse acceleration compared to 26". I doubt one can notice a 2% difference in a hybrid. If that was true, racing road bikes would use smaller wheels too. You have more rolling resistance and bearing resistance with smaller wheels. the static weight difference (against shown with same size tires) also is negligible.... compare that to your weight.

there are probably reasons for 27.5" (why not go to 26"t then to make it even better?), and you may like smaller wheels better. but that is a lot of marketing gubididu. It probably would be a bit more believable it fit wouldn't come from a manufacturer that sells many 29" bicycles and wouldn't have rammeed 29" bikes down our throats just to turn around now and tell us to throw away our 29" bikes and buy the "newly discovered" 27.5" wheels. what's next, 27" wheels to make them even lighter?

Here an explanation on the wheelsizes:

I would consider a 26" if they came on modern bikes in adult sizes with good components. You can often find them on big box bikes, and sometimes even on mainline brands (like the Giant Sedona), but they often don't have better equipment. The Sedona meets some of my criteria, but it has a suspension fork which I don't prefer, and it has mechanical discs, and I'd prefer hydraulic. The Trek 8500 I rode all week in Utah on vacation had 26" tires, and it was a blast to ride. I'd definitely look at 26" bikes if they had the features I want.

There are 100,000 26" bikes on CL for dirt cheap. You can just outfit them any way you want (many have disc brakes too). I think the only thing they don't offer is through-axle (but no hybrids I know have TA anyway). If for some reason I would like 26", I never would buy new.

The used market for 29"/700c is basically empty (probably the same for 27.5") and/or highly overpriced.

I have three 26" bikes at home. Retrofitting them with disc brakes will not be cost effective. I'd spend half as much as a new bike, and it just wouldn't be worth it to me.

That about describes the local market here.

I am going to look at the Specialized Roll today; my local bike shop sells these and has a number of them on the sales floor. If I don't take a Roll home, I'll drive the 70 miles to see the Giant ARX tomorrow. I'll ask both shops about equivalent 29ers, but I would still want a rigid fork. At nearly twice the price of the ARX, the Toughroad is more than I care to spend right now, but it's the type of 29er bike I'd want if I went to that tire size. Unfortunately, this is a segment where marketing spin is strong, and rigid 29ers are often marketed as "ADVENTURE!" or "BIKEPACKING!" bikes. In reality, I just want a simple rigid frame bike with a cassette and hydraulic disc brakes and some frame clearance for larger section tires. At only $500, the 27.5" ARX checks all of those boxes. The Roll does, too, but it's a steeper $700 for the equipment I want. I have a very good relationship with my local Specialized dealer, so maybe they can work with me some on the price of a new Roll, if I like it.

A Specialized Cirrus Disc could work, but it comes with only 32mm wide tires. I want at least 50% wider than that, and I'm sure the Cirrus frame won't support it. Great deal at only $560, though. Or the Giant Escape Disc...a little pricier at $695, but it still comes with only 32mm tires (and probably not the frame clearance for 50mm).

Unfortunately, the only other options I seem to have, in a 622mm wheel, is something like a Surly Ogre or Troll or Bridge Club, and I'm back up in Giant Toughroad price range. Nice bikes for sure...but more than I'd like to spend.

If you have a suggestion of a all-rigid 29er in the $500-600 price range that will meet my criteria, I'd happily consider it. Seems that one can buy a hybrid with a suspension fork for this price all day long. But rigid forks now seem to be relegated to the "ADVENTURE!" category, with spendier prices.

I'd recommend looking at the hybrids at bikesdirect. all 700c/29" i assume, but good value.

Thanks; I have been looking. Anything that supports wide tires seems to come with a suspension fork. Anything with a rigid fork comes with (and probably is limited to) narrower street tires. Thus is my mania -- the two bikes I've noted above (Giant ARX and Specialized Roll) seem to be the only ones, regardless of tire size, that meet all of my criteria in my desired price range.

Actually, a third option that I've mentioned earlier, the Raleigh Redux, also meets my criteria, but the Redux 3 seems to be either discontinued or low stock at the moment (nothing in my frame size) and the Redux 2 is only a 1x9 as I recall, which is not what I want.

My wife has a Liv Bliss Lite which is the women's version of the ARX, only with mechanical disc brakes instead of hydraulic. It's a great bike - light weight and plenty good enough for the type of riding you're looking to do with this bike.

I tried the Specialized Roll at lunchtime today and it's not the bike I'm seeking. It was fun and definitely different, but I felt positioned too far back on the bike (in no doubt due to the very shallow seat tube angle - 67 degrees). A cruiser bike for sure, but I didn't feel like I could get "up on" the bike to crank.

I also tried a Specialized Crosstrail while I was there, with the brain fork, but I didn't care for that either. With no apparent way to tune it, it was super stiff, and I couldn't perceive any actual damping action from it. The stanchions were also a bit wiggly (which is one of the reasons I want a rigid fork to begin with), so I passed on that.

The local Giant dealer indeed does not have any ARXes in stock, so I plan to make a drive tomorrow.

The ARX looks like a nice "no BS" bike. A lot of the riding feeling is in the tires too and how much pressure they have.

Large tires (2" for a hybrid) are very rare, which is how I ended up with the Toughroad. I rode the toughroad back to back to a Giant Escape (32 mm tires or so) and the Escape was much more twitchy and less compliant (admittedly a year ago I was new to serious riding and they have different geometries).

tire size is another industry fraud where everyone was told skinnier tires are better and now we come to the realization that wider tires don't have more rolling resistance but provide more comfort and now everyone with an old frame realizes that their old bikes don't clear wider tires and needs to buy a new bike....

I agree with you regarding tire width. In fact, I looked at a Specialized Sirrus today, but didn't seriously consider it because they will take only a 38mm or so. Some people like narrow tires, and that's cool, but I personally prefer wider.

I really did like the Roll's 2.3" tires. They (Specialized Nimbus) were completely smooth and rode GREAT. I'm hoping for the same out of the ARX. It has light knobbies and, if I replace them, it'd be for something a bit smoother. Bring on the balloon bike.

You always can install skinnier tires, but it is hard to install wider tires :)

better rolling with less pressure

you can get premium quality (expensive) 650b tires from https://www.compasscycle.com/product...ts/tires/650b/

to make your 27.5 MTB into a street hybrid, when desired, ..

The Devinci Cartier Alivio has hydraulic brakes. The Devinci Cartier Altus has mechanical brakes. They both come with fenders (cool as that size would be difficult to find anyway) and 27.5" x 1.75" semi-slick tires. Even if it's 1x8 or 1x9 gearing, I find a front derailleur a bit annoying.

You may be able to find the Haro Beasley with 27.5" wheels if you look for it.

Or, if you're looking for 42c tires on a 650b hybrid with more aggressive posture, the Raleigh Strada is one option although you'd have to order it from the UK which is a bit expensive.

I'm considering selling two of my bicycles to buy either the Raleigh Strada or Devinci Cartier. I find I'm too tall on a bike with 700c wheels and too short on a 26" wheel bike.

By the way, if someone is looking for a bike with no front derailleur, the Louis Garneau M1 is a 29er and the Bianchi Iseo Disc is a hybrid with 700x35c tires.

EDIT: The only slick tire I've been able to find in 650b is the Maxxis Detonator at 1.50" (about 38c I think) https://www.maxxis.com/catalog/tire-261-119-detonator

I did buy the ARX today. Pictures and more info here.