Is Armstrong the biggest ass in the history of Professional Cycling?
I'm somewhat sympathetic to the argument that many many riders were doping in Armstrong's era, and recognize the pressure riders were under to dope to be competitive, so I'm not that outraged that Armstrong doped.
However, the way Armstrong treated people, bullying others into doping, lashing out against former teammates, intimidating witnesses, and retaliating against anyone perceived as against him is outrageous. Given the way he treated Steffen Prentis, Emma O'Reilly, Fillipe Simeoni, Christophe Bassons, Tyler Hamilton, Floyd Landis, Frankie Andreu, Jonathon Vaughters, etc. etc. he is one vindictive prick. I'm sure there have been other horse's asses in pro cycling, but Armstrong has to be on every short list of All time Asses. |
Yes.
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If what Hamilton said is true: that Armstrong snitched on Hamilton to the UCI in 2004, then Armstrong is one big B'.
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I use to feel that way about Lance,maybe it's the way he's being attacked,but I support him now.Anybody that has ever been around any pro sports in the last 20 years, knows that virtually all top level pro athletes in any sport,have been doping to some degree.If you don't believe that than you are being naive.To go after Lance retroactively is what gets me.It's over and done with.I hope the French tell them to go to hell
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Originally Posted by bike56
(Post 14831329)
virtually all top level pro athletes in any sport,have been doping to some degree.If you don't believe that than you are being naive.To go after Lance retroactively is what gets me.It's over and done with.I hope the French tell them to go to hell
You have some serious catching up to do. Start with Tyler's book, or the downloadable affidavits off USADA's website. |
Originally Posted by bike56
(Post 14831329)
I use to feel that way about Lance,maybe it's the way he's being attacked,but I support him now.Anybody that has ever been around any pro sports in the last 20 years, knows that virtually all top level pro athletes in any sport,have been doping to some degree.If you don't believe that than you are being naive.To go after Lance retroactively is what gets me.It's over and done with.I hope the French tell them to go to hell
My point is about Armstrong's behavior toward his peers. I don't think Ullrich, Pantani, Basso, etc, etc, went around trying to destroy other people's careers to cover their own tracks. And as to the retroactive thing, the evidence shows Armstrong was still at it in 2010, and other charged individuals are still in a position to continue the same bahavior now, i.e. Bruyneel. |
Originally Posted by merlinextraligh
(Post 14831267)
I'm somewhat sympathetic to the argument that many many riders were doping in Armstrong's era, and recognize the pressure riders were under to dope to be competitive, so I'm not that outraged that Armstrong doped.
However, the way Armstrong treated people, bullying others into doping, lashing out against former teammates, intimidating witnesses, and retaliating against anyone perceived as against him is outrageous. Given the way he treated Steffen Prentis, Emma O'Reilly, Fillipe Simeoni, Christophe Bassons, Tyler Hamilton, Floyd Landis, Frankie Andreu, Jonathon Vaughters, etc. etc. he is one vindictive prick. I'm sure there have been other horse's asses in pro cycling, but Armstrong has to be on every short list of All time Asses. Now, off to my other job as an amateur psychoanalyst:innocent:. |
Originally Posted by bike56
(Post 14831329)
I use to feel that way about Lance,maybe it's the way he's being attacked,but I support him now.Anybody that has ever been around any pro sports in the last 20 years, knows that virtually all top level pro athletes in any sport,have been doping to some degree.If you don't believe that than you are being naive.To go after Lance retroactively is what gets me.It's over and done with.I hope the French tell them to go to hell
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Why does everything about Armstrong turn to the most?
Now I think he was a real prick. Some of what he said regarding the mussette bag incident were unbelievable. But there is a difference between our era and the past. Now everything becomes public and add to that things that are now public and will be forgotten in 20 years are not forgotten yet. I can think of some pretty nasty bits for Anquetil, Coppi and Hinault. I also remember one thing Merckx said regarding the drug test that got him thrown out of the 1969 Giro. Basically it was "Why would I dope on that stage, there was nothing to gain". I believe him and if it truely was that his sample was tampered with I'd say that pretty much leaves the worst of Lance far behind. Oh and what happened in 1904 wasn't very nice. |
Originally Posted by Keith99
(Post 14831483)
Why does everything about Armstrong turn to the most?
Now I think he was a real prick. Some of what he said regarding the mussette bag incident were unbelievable. But there is a difference between our era and the past. Now everything becomes public and add to that things that are now public and will be forgotten in 20 years are not forgotten yet. I can think of some pretty nasty bits for Anquetil, Coppi and Hinault. I also remember one thing Merckx said regarding the drug test that got him thrown out of the 1969 Giro. Basically it was "Why would I dope on that stage, there was nothing to gain". I believe him and if it truely was that his sample was tampered with I'd say that pretty much leaves the worst of Lance far behind. Oh and what happened in 1904 wasn't very nice. |
Yes I read Tyler's book which actually lead me on a quest to find out more about Lance.I read all the books out telling Lance's side, and watched interviews and documentaries on the net.I never cared much for him in the past and had always kind of avoided his books and videos,and always felt he was doping,but the more I learned,the more I liked him.Maybe I was taken in by his story and personalty,or just feel sorry for him.Punish him yes,but to take all 7 TDF titles.I guess I feel like the sport of cycling in general is being attacked,and dam,those years of the TDF were exciting
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He's an ass for sure. But I see a lot of that in my profession. I'm used to it.
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i thought the tdf during the lance years (save '03) were some of the most boring races. well, along with the big mig years.
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^ Proctologist?
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Originally Posted by bikerjp
(Post 14831542)
^ Proctologist?
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Originally Posted by Jed19
(Post 14831403)
I have been hearing for a long long time that LA is not a very nice human being. But then, most guys with a constitution like his are not great human beings. I think the kind of "mental fortitude/drive/sine qua non" that is embodied in people like that is also mostly responsible for the way they look at people, ie expendables to be used and discarded in pursuit of their goals.
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Originally Posted by Nachoman
(Post 14831536)
He's an ass for sure. But I see a lot of that in my profession. I'm used to it.
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Originally Posted by bike56
(Post 14831506)
Yes I read Tyler's book which actually lead me on a quest to find out more about Lance.I read all the books out telling Lance's side, and watched interviews and documentaries on the net.I never cared much for him in the past and had always kind of avoided his books and videos,and always felt he was doping,but the more I learned,the more I liked him.Maybe I was taken in by his story and personalty,or just feel sorry for him.Punish him yes,but to take all 7 TDF titles.I guess I feel like the sport of cycling in general is being attacked,and dam,those years of the TDF were exciting
You're probably too young to remember Ben Johnson demolishing the record in the 100 meters, but man, that was a real kick in the ass. |
Absolutely, positively yes! I'm just waiting for Trek and Nike to wakeup and stop supporting/enabling him.
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I never thought he was an ass until his comeback in 09 TDF. Everyday at the press conference rolling his eyes and giving that,"I'll bite my lip" BS trying to make Contador look like a jerk for refusing to kiss his or Brunyeel's ass. Actually, that TDF made me a fan of Contador for standing up to LANCE.
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I'm sure that Lance is a bit of an SOB, yes. Let he who is without sin...and all that.
I'm also certain that things are being a bit "blown up" right now. Don't believe everything you read or hear while everyone is jumping on the bandwagon wanting to "reveal" how Lance Armstrong is the anti-christ. I would imagine that in a couple of years all the people who are now denouncing Lance will probably have mellowed and will speak fondly of Lance. It's just that it's currently cool to beat him to death. Lance has faults and has made mistakes. He's also one of the greatest athletes of all time and strikes me as a basically good guy at heart. I'm not falling for all the BS. |
Any of you been around American big business? This is how life is lived in the good ole USA.
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Originally Posted by richard_dupp
(Post 14833277)
Any of you been around American big business? This is how life is lived in the good ole USA.
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Originally Posted by Thulsadoom
(Post 14833212)
I'm sure that Lance is a bit of an SOB, yes. Let he who is without sin...and all that.
I'm also certain that things are being a bit "blown up" right now. Don't believe everything you read or hear while everyone is jumping on the bandwagon wanting to "reveal" how Lance Armstrong is the anti-christ. I would imagine that in a couple of years all the people who are now denouncing Lance will probably have mellowed and will speak fondly of Lance. It's just that it's currently cool to beat him to death. Lance has faults and has made mistakes. He's also one of the greatest athletes of all time and strikes me as a basically good guy at heart. I'm not falling for all the BS. So no one is without sin, and all of us have made mistakes. Most of us have not been on a multi decade program to systematically destroy people who are in the position to reveal our illegal schemes. |
Originally Posted by richard_dupp
(Post 14833277)
Any of you been around American big business? This is how life is lived in the good ole USA.
- hedge fund manager; - beverly hills plastic surgeon; - general officer in the military; - US Senator; - CEO; - big revenue producer in any given field; - and the list goes on. |
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