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-   -   The Water Cooler, Scuttlebutt, Chit Chat Thread (https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=1105191)

merlinextraligh 05-25-17 07:02 AM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19608685)
Nation,

If a race is all together at the finish, what's the best way to help out a teammate who has no sprint? All I can think of is to get on the front for the last 3-5 minutes or so and try to drill it all the way to the finish. A sprinter will still win but at least that will weed out the tired sprinters and minimize the number of non-sprinters who pass him. Or maybe try to slingshot him off the front with 1-2k to go? Except that seems just as likely to do nothing useful, if he can't get separation from the field (see the part where he has no sprint, above). ???

How about you take a flyer at 1k to go? You make others work to bring you back and your team mate gets a free ride. If one or two try to bridge, your team mate could get towed up.

No one reacts, maybe he can bridge up to you.

I have helped a teammate win by taking a 1k flyer. I got caught at 100 meters by a group of 8 or so, including a team mate who got a good leadout as a result of the chase effort. Of course he had a pretty good sprint.

big john 05-25-17 07:22 AM


Originally Posted by rankin116 (Post 19608704)
I vaguely recall that someone here live in New Orleans or is from there? I'm heading down for a conference next week and thinking about bringing a bike, if it makes sense.

Anyone have recs for rides/routes/etc.?

revchuck is from there.

mike868y 05-25-17 08:02 AM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19608685)
Nation,

If a race is all together at the finish, what's the best way to help out a teammate who has no sprint? All I can think of is to get on the front for the last 3-5 minutes or so and try to drill it all the way to the finish. A sprinter will still win but at least that will weed out the tired sprinters and minimize the number of non-sprinters who pass him. Or maybe try to slingshot him off the front with 1-2k to go? Except that seems just as likely to do nothing useful, if he can't get separation from the field (see the part where he has no sprint, above). ???

my first inclination would be to basically do what you said. if the pace is fast and he's in good position, he shouldn't get swarmed. what level field is this? honestly in the 3s sprinting is just as much about positioning and timing as it is about power.

globecanvas 05-25-17 08:05 AM


Originally Posted by mike868y (Post 19608875)
what level field is this?


P123 usually, 40+ occasionally.

wktmeow 05-25-17 09:02 AM

So I broke down and pre-spent some upcoming bonus money on parts to build a gaming pc. I used to game a lot, but haven't had a decent machine in a while. Pretty sure my cycling career will be over soon :)

Also doesn't help that the wife has a stand mixer on the way... gaming and baked goodies, I'm really hosed now.

revchuck 05-25-17 09:33 AM


Originally Posted by rankin116 (Post 19608704)
I vaguely recall that someone here live in New Orleans or is from there? I'm heading down for a conference next week and thinking about bringing a bike, if it makes sense.

Anyone have recs for rides/routes/etc.?

Search under "New Orléans Bicycle Club". That's the local race team and they have rides during the week and on weekends. Good folks to ride with!

himespau 05-25-17 09:51 AM


Originally Posted by wktmeow (Post 19609024)
Also doesn't help that the wife has a stand mixer on the way... gaming and baked goodies, I'm really hosed now.

:thumb:

mattm 05-25-17 10:42 AM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19608685)
Nation,

If a race is all together at the finish, what's the best way to help out a teammate who has no sprint? All I can think of is to get on the front for the last 3-5 minutes or so and try to drill it all the way to the finish. A sprinter will still win but at least that will weed out the tired sprinters and minimize the number of non-sprinters who pass him. Or maybe try to slingshot him off the front with 1-2k to go? Except that seems just as likely to do nothing useful, if he can't get separation from the field (see the part where he has no sprint, above). ???

If a race is all together at the finish, I think it's just too late for said teammate.

Drilling it at the front will only help the sprinters, not tire them out. If teammate can't get separation early in the race, the chances of getting it at the end seem even slimmer.

Seems more like the question should be 'what can I do for said teammate early in the race'?

globecanvas 05-25-17 11:02 AM


Originally Posted by mattm (Post 19609338)
Seems more like the question should be 'what can I do for said teammate early in the race'?

Yeah, except I already know that one :) Teammate is much stronger than me but assembled from entirely different parts. He can almost always get up the road for a good long while but in a race without a big climb (in other words any race I am in) he gets reeled in eventually and just gives up for the finish. If he gets caught late enough it's a great situation for me, obviously. But I'd like to repay the favors he's done me by giving him a reason not to throw in the towel if it nears the end and the group is together. Or just get him any kind of a not-last result in these races. Maybe it's not feasible.

topflightpro 05-25-17 11:37 AM

This seems like it belongs in the racing forum:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome...19156?mod=e2tw

caloso 05-25-17 11:48 AM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19609391)
Yeah, except I already know that one :) Teammate is much stronger than me but assembled from entirely different parts. He can almost always get up the road for a good long while but in a race without a big climb (in other words any race I am in) he gets reeled in eventually and just gives up for the finish. If he gets caught late enough it's a great situation for me, obviously. But I'd like to repay the favors he's done me by giving him a reason not to throw in the towel if it nears the end and the group is together. Or just get him any kind of a not-last result in these races. Maybe it's not feasible.

Attacking early and often, forcing potential breakaway guys to chase you down? That would tire those guys out so that he could launch later but not quite the end of the race?

himespau 05-25-17 11:58 AM


Originally Posted by topflightpro (Post 19609486)
This seems like it belongs in the racing forum:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome...19156?mod=e2tw

I will say that the balance bike approach works. I tried my daughter for 2+ years with a bike with training wheels and nothing stuck. She asked me to take the training wheels off when she turned 5 but then was too scared to ride it. I picked up another bike in her size (16", saying it was going to be for her little brother when he got big enough), but took the crankset off and just said, "well, you know, if you want to try coasting on it, it's there." and she took to it like a duck to water. A couple weeks later (after her balance biking whenever I would let her), she just without saying anything picked up the bike with pedals from where it was leaning against the garage wall, hopped on it and was riding. Her 2 year old brother is now on a dedicated 12" balance bike and wants to get pedals like his big sister.

But toddlers racing them? I'm not so sure about that. I'd like to see them develop the love on their own and choose to do it when they're able to actively make the choice. I've had too many relatives/friends burn out on sports as a kid due to over-involved parents. To each their own, I guess.

To be fair, I didn't get past the paywall to read the full article.

miyata man 05-25-17 12:03 PM


Originally Posted by topflightpro (Post 19609486)
This seems like it belongs in the racing forum:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome...19156?mod=e2tw

John Degenkolb's "Dege Bambini" races, which I can't track down the video of, are to my mind more relevant and probably more instrumental in the kids development. Also they take place in a much healthier European environment instead of the pit of Texas. Stateside the Lemond led CEO charity ride and kids parade lap (that is really a fun on race with louder cheering than the pro race that follows) at the Northstar Festival is pretty amazing too.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C-_9tO_XkAEK-VJ.jpg

Ttoc6 05-25-17 12:06 PM

Tour of Utah route was released. Pretty excited for the Layton to Bountiful stage. This will run in front of where I'll be living and through the area I'll be working at. Going to have to leverage a day off on that Friday to spectate in the new hometown and then head down to SLC to watch the final stage.

Tour of Utah Announces Route for 2017 - Course Maps Included! - Cycling West - Cycling Utah

kensuf 05-25-17 01:23 PM

Howdy.

gerundium 05-25-17 03:18 PM

I know a lot of you guys in here frequently race twice in a day. Any recovery tips for a two stage race day with ~ 3 hours in between events? It's a TTT first (10 km) and a crit (~30 km) after if that has any relevance.

TheKillerPenguin 05-25-17 04:10 PM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19609391)
Yeah, except I already know that one :) Teammate is much stronger than me but assembled from entirely different parts. He can almost always get up the road for a good long while but in a race without a big climb (in other words any race I am in) he gets reeled in eventually and just gives up for the finish. If he gets caught late enough it's a great situation for me, obviously. But I'd like to repay the favors he's done me by giving him a reason not to throw in the towel if it nears the end and the group is together. Or just get him any kind of a not-last result in these races. Maybe it's not feasible.

Is this our mutual bro? IMO before the sprint he just needs to go later into a race, and he should be bridging up to (or blasting through!) something that is already OTF instead of trying to solo.

If this is mutual bro and you are talking about the race I think you are talking about and he is there at the finish with you, I don't think he'll have the desire to position himself properly coming into the sprint if you take a flyer and make others work to chase you down. However, I do think that if you were to string everything out and he happened to be one of the 5-6 guys sitting behind you he would feel comfortable and confident and be able to finish it off. I think you are strong enough to get things single file for him.

TMonk 05-25-17 04:16 PM


Originally Posted by kensuf (Post 19609759)
Howdy.

Well hello stranger.

You riding much these days?

merlinextraligh 05-25-17 06:37 PM


Originally Posted by topflightpro (Post 19609486)
This seems like it belongs in the racing forum:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/welcome...19156?mod=e2tw

Jason Gay was the first sports columnist for the WSJ. He races himself, and writes occasionally about bike racing, and throws bike racing references in other sports columns. Usually pretty funny.

aaronmcd 05-25-17 07:15 PM

Got notification today that I passed the PE national exam and both California civil exams

Flatballer 05-25-17 07:32 PM


Originally Posted by aaronmcd (Post 19610662)
Got notification today that I passed the PE national exam and both California civil exams

Congratulations! That's a big accomplishment. I hear California can be really tough and really specific.

carpediemracing 05-25-17 08:00 PM


Originally Posted by globecanvas (Post 19608685)
Nation,

If a race is all together at the finish, what's the best way to help out a teammate who has no sprint? All I can think of is to get on the front for the last 3-5 minutes or so and try to drill it all the way to the finish. A sprinter will still win but at least that will weed out the tired sprinters and minimize the number of non-sprinters who pass him. Or maybe try to slingshot him off the front with 1-2k to go? Except that seems just as likely to do nothing useful, if he can't get separation from the field (see the part where he has no sprint, above). ???

First thought is that I bet he'd do well with a massive leadout. You go at least 35 mph, he stays on your wheel, and you go as far as you can to the line. If you can go faster that's better. You start sort of early - I know you can go about 600 meters, realistically. The deal is you need to create some separation, either by sheer speed (like into a crosswind and you and your teammate are in the gutter), by a rider blowing up, a corner you two hit particularly fast, whatever. Then it's down to 2 or 3 riders and your teammate will podium.

I'd try to set up for a counter for him. Meaning you launch a lot, at some point he counter launches.

Also it would really, really, really help if your teammate did ZERO work until he went. Like ZERO work. Avg wattage under 200w and hopefully under 180w for example, until whatever to go, like 5 to go or something. Then when he went it'd be a stunner.

He also needs to work on top speed in a 60 second effort. Not sprint top speed, more like "how fast can you roll a 53x12 seated?" top speed. If he can hold 35 mph for a bit then that's enough, most sprints won't go much faster and if he has a gap then 35 mph would probably win him a race handily.

I think of the 2015 Aetna NSS "sprint". I barely exceeded 900w max once in the last 30s of the race and won by a couple seconds. My efforts were 900w peak, 800w peak, 700w peak, 600w peak, and 500w peak. Absolutely within the realm of any normal rider out there. My sprint was absolutely pathetic. Key was the distraction in second wheel, appropriately initialed "KO". KO jumped way early, drew me out, then kept going fast enough so everyone waited for him to do something. By the time everyone realized they had to go it was too late.

If you could be KO for your teammate then you could lead him out of the group (or the front) then let him ease away in the last whatever 400 meters as he goes a steady 35 mph and you're going 32 then 30 then 29 whatever.

I bet if he did zero in the race he could place well in any tough sprint with just a normal leadout. There are a lot of guys too afraid to put it on the line for one effort so they're constantly attacking or chasing or closing gaps or whatever, and by the time the sprint rolls around they're cooked.

spdntrxi 05-25-17 08:05 PM


Originally Posted by aaronmcd (Post 19610662)
Got notification today that I passed the PE national exam and both California civil exams

been out of school so looooong... no way in hell I pass that now. I don't really need it anyhow lucky for me.

Congrats indeed...

Flatballer 05-25-17 08:18 PM


Originally Posted by spdntrxi (Post 19610765)
been out of school so looooong... no way in hell I pass that now. I don't really need it anyhow lucky for me.

Congrats indeed...

Well, you have to be out a few years just to sit for it anyway. So basically everyone has to study their ass off for a while. I think I studied like 10 hours a week for 6 months or something.

hack 05-25-17 09:05 PM


Originally Posted by aaronmcd (Post 19610662)
Got notification today that I passed the PE national exam and both California civil exams

Congrats!


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