Originally Posted by
veganbikes
Did not say anything about a super expensive wheel set. There are levels of quality.
If you are not willing to spend money on a custom frame, then clearly a custom frame is not for you at all. There is plenty of reasons why a unknown quantity is lesser than a known quantity. Moots, Firefly, Lynskey, Lightspeed, Merlin, Bingham Built, Ren/TiCycles, Independent Fabrications...are all known quantities who make high quality stuff, yes they cost money but they are custom frames built by experts in their field, the equipment, knowledge, skills...are what you are paying for and what you are getting. Some random company in China will make a frame to the lowest bidder they do it all the time but that is not a mark of quality or knowing what you are doing. Slapping a frame together isn't hard so long as the welds hold enough to put it into a box and send it via China Post. Geometry and all that stuff don't matter and you aren't paying for it you are buying whatever cheap ti tubing they can scrounge up and someone to weld it. A 94 Geo Metro and 94 Acura NSX are both cars but one is a lot more desirable and higher in quality (and it ain't the Geo Metro). T.G.I Fridays and The French Laundry are both restaurants but one has had 3 Michelin stars for years and the other is well T.G.I Fridays.
Like I said you seem to be best served with something off the shelf. Custom is not your thing clearly. Those who are looking at custom are saying "I am willing to spend money" those who are saying "cheap" are looking for something from closer to the bargain bin or at least something from pre-made to manufacturers spec. Not necessarily a bad thing, shoot my New Albion Privateer frame is fantastic and was not expensive at around $380 could be a great bones to start with. It is decent quality steel, not super light weight but a great ride and easy to do just about anything with. Budget but one I would recommend highly. Merry Sales Co. has been around a long long time and I know should I ever have any problems with my bike I can get support from them (granted I doubt it, it is steel and so far has taken a lot of abuse with no problems). There are times you can find the starving artists who can build up a cheaper frame out of UBI or some frame building school and they might be OK (everyone starts somewhere) but I would wait a bit till they grow and practice their craft.
Moots has been doing it since '81. Merlin started in '86 and spawned Indy Fab (and some of those folks worked before at Fat City Cycles in the 70s and early 80s), Seven Cycles and possibly also Firefly (amongst possibly others). Wheras Tiorays is on Alibaba and eBay and has little known history and poor spelling, They started in 2019 on eBay and 2020 on Alibaba and his 40 thieves and possibly in 2017 for their business license (according to what they gave to Alibaba). I cannot even find a proper website for them or contact info. Not someone I want to deal with.
I am always surprised by the attempt to romanticize the supposed art of frame building. As far as metalworking skills required it's really not that complex and tooling needs are minimal. Tig Welder, Mitering Machine (can be a milling machine or good quality drill press) cutting tools, some jigs and a few other odds and ends, tubing and fittings are easily sourced. Anyone who has worked with metal for a while can pick it up in a few days. Frame geometries are easily found and painting can be done at home with adequate results or outsourced if desired. All that needs to be done is welding some tubes together accurately and neatly not a huge ask. Sure, getting one of the last Tom Kellog frames would be a status symbol and beautiful addition to life's bucket list of achievements however implying there is some magical ride and tangible benefit to the bike is BS. Yes I have built my own frames in the past and still, have one of them, however, haven't ridden it for years.