We need bike lanes in my city, I want your thoughts
08-30-12, 06:57 AM
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To those vehicular cyclist believers (which I in part believe in too)
"Vehicular cycling (also known as bicycle driving) is the practice of riding bicycles on roads in a manner that is in accordance with the principles for driving in traffic.
The phrase vehicular cycling was coined by John Forester in the 1970s to characterize the style of cycling utilized in his native country, the United Kingdom, in contrast to the deferential-to-cars style of cycling and practices that he found to be typical in the United States. In his book Effective Cycling, Forester contends that "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles".[1]"
What should be noted is we are in no way anything like europe, we have bigger cars, younger and more naive drivers along with rednecks (who throw stuff at us). The theory is great but people in europe have long adopted cycling from the get go and do so because its more convenient. Owning a car in europe is very expensive compared to owning one here and not quite as convenient. If we want to be compared to the europeans then we need public transit to operate like europes, which would eliminate massive number of vehicles from our roads to begin with.
"Vehicular cycling (also known as bicycle driving) is the practice of riding bicycles on roads in a manner that is in accordance with the principles for driving in traffic.
The phrase vehicular cycling was coined by John Forester in the 1970s to characterize the style of cycling utilized in his native country, the United Kingdom, in contrast to the deferential-to-cars style of cycling and practices that he found to be typical in the United States. In his book Effective Cycling, Forester contends that "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles".[1]"
What should be noted is we are in no way anything like europe, we have bigger cars, younger and more naive drivers along with rednecks (who throw stuff at us). The theory is great but people in europe have long adopted cycling from the get go and do so because its more convenient. Owning a car in europe is very expensive compared to owning one here and not quite as convenient. If we want to be compared to the europeans then we need public transit to operate like europes, which would eliminate massive number of vehicles from our roads to begin with.
08-30-12, 07:21 AM
#52
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In my experience, ANY bike lane/marking/sharrows >>> no lane.
Cars are ALWAYS going to take advantage of the extra room at turns , marked on unmarked. We cyclists are well aware of that. Just because you have a 'bike lane' doesn't mean you can tune out cars, obviously.
Still, the odds of them paying attention are wayyy higher when they know they're at least in violation of a bike lane when they take your space. Without those markings, cars automatically assume you as a cyclist have no right to the road other than the reality that if they hit you, they have to deal with a possible lawsuit. I dare you to 'take the lane' on Wilshire Blvd in LA during rush hour as a cyclist, even in areas where you have full rights to since there are areas of ongoing construction and continuous parking/pulling out cars all along its path. It'll be one of the most hostile experiences of your life.
I definitely do not buy the arguments that 'they don't make you any safer' - theoretically they might sound legit, but go to a busy city and take roads that are heavily trafficked and those bike lanes, even a suboptimal one, are hugely helpful.
Cars are ALWAYS going to take advantage of the extra room at turns , marked on unmarked. We cyclists are well aware of that. Just because you have a 'bike lane' doesn't mean you can tune out cars, obviously.
Still, the odds of them paying attention are wayyy higher when they know they're at least in violation of a bike lane when they take your space. Without those markings, cars automatically assume you as a cyclist have no right to the road other than the reality that if they hit you, they have to deal with a possible lawsuit. I dare you to 'take the lane' on Wilshire Blvd in LA during rush hour as a cyclist, even in areas where you have full rights to since there are areas of ongoing construction and continuous parking/pulling out cars all along its path. It'll be one of the most hostile experiences of your life.
I definitely do not buy the arguments that 'they don't make you any safer' - theoretically they might sound legit, but go to a busy city and take roads that are heavily trafficked and those bike lanes, even a suboptimal one, are hugely helpful.
08-30-12, 07:28 AM
#53
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DDF,
Good, thoughtful thread, thank you for bring it up and to the mode for letting it stay in 41. We have some bike lanes in Pensacola, the trouble with ours are that most just end suddenly, where the road repaving project ended, usually. The biggest problem with the lanes out in the rural area I live in is they become a parking area for the garbage cans all the time. The usual trash and debris build up is here, too, so the pieces of blown tires, tree limbs and beer cans are there to effect the riding. I have better luck riding carefully in the traffic lane and using complete defensive riding, every car/truck/driver is a potential accident I am going to lose.
If you do want to advocate for the lanes you need to involve the shops and riders in your area and use good, positive advocacy and watch the image you project. In the deep south you and I are in this matters a lot as to how the general public will support any bicycling project like bike lanes. if there is/are a good club(s) they can be invaluable, but the ones here are just burnt out on any advocacy at all. Survival is the big issue here right now. Many cyclist hit and killed/injured lately. Best of Luck in what ever you attempt.
Bill
Good, thoughtful thread, thank you for bring it up and to the mode for letting it stay in 41. We have some bike lanes in Pensacola, the trouble with ours are that most just end suddenly, where the road repaving project ended, usually. The biggest problem with the lanes out in the rural area I live in is they become a parking area for the garbage cans all the time. The usual trash and debris build up is here, too, so the pieces of blown tires, tree limbs and beer cans are there to effect the riding. I have better luck riding carefully in the traffic lane and using complete defensive riding, every car/truck/driver is a potential accident I am going to lose.
If you do want to advocate for the lanes you need to involve the shops and riders in your area and use good, positive advocacy and watch the image you project. In the deep south you and I are in this matters a lot as to how the general public will support any bicycling project like bike lanes. if there is/are a good club(s) they can be invaluable, but the ones here are just burnt out on any advocacy at all. Survival is the big issue here right now. Many cyclist hit and killed/injured lately. Best of Luck in what ever you attempt.
Bill
__________________
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I Can Do All Things Through Him, Who Gives Me Strength. Philippians 4:13
Semper Fi, USMC, 1975-1977
I Can Do All Things Through Him, Who Gives Me Strength. Philippians 4:13
08-30-12, 07:43 AM
#54
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To those vehicular cyclist believers (which I in part believe in too)
"Vehicular cycling (also known as bicycle driving) is the practice of riding bicycles on roads in a manner that is in accordance with the principles for driving in traffic.
The phrase vehicular cycling was coined by John Forester in the 1970s to characterize the style of cycling utilized in his native country, the United Kingdom, in contrast to the deferential-to-cars style of cycling and practices that he found to be typical in the United States. In his book Effective Cycling, Forester contends that "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles".[1]"
What should be noted is we are in no way anything like europe, we have bigger cars, younger and more naive drivers along with rednecks (who throw stuff at us). The theory is great but people in europe have long adopted cycling from the get go and do so because its more convenient. Owning a car in europe is very expensive compared to owning one here and not quite as convenient. If we want to be compared to the europeans then we need public transit to operate like europes, which would eliminate massive number of vehicles from our roads to begin with.
"Vehicular cycling (also known as bicycle driving) is the practice of riding bicycles on roads in a manner that is in accordance with the principles for driving in traffic.
The phrase vehicular cycling was coined by John Forester in the 1970s to characterize the style of cycling utilized in his native country, the United Kingdom, in contrast to the deferential-to-cars style of cycling and practices that he found to be typical in the United States. In his book Effective Cycling, Forester contends that "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles".[1]"
What should be noted is we are in no way anything like europe, we have bigger cars, younger and more naive drivers along with rednecks (who throw stuff at us). The theory is great but people in europe have long adopted cycling from the get go and do so because its more convenient. Owning a car in europe is very expensive compared to owning one here and not quite as convenient. If we want to be compared to the europeans then we need public transit to operate like europes, which would eliminate massive number of vehicles from our roads to begin with.
In the US the impression I get (I've never cycled there) is that the vehicles are much bigger than ours, and the standard of driving is lower than in the UK. You also seem to have a lot of trucks in rural areas, far more than we have over here (we obviously have them, but in the US it seems you might have a single road that isn't very big that runs through a rural area, and all the trucks take it - must be an effect of the land mass being so much bigger).
Ironically the roads in the US generally seem to be so much wider than here in the UK I'd have thought it would be easy enough for cyclists and motor vehicles to share the space.
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08-30-12, 07:51 AM
#55
Descends like a rock
I have mixed feelings on bike lanes, but overall think they are a good thing. They do tend to relegate bikes to the broken glass/door zone and can create the idea in people's mind that if there's no bike lane, they cant ride their bike. On the other hand, when you put in bike lanes, more people get out and ride their bikes for transportation. I've seen that clearly demonstrated in my own neighborhood and around the city. The very best thing you can do to improve the safety of cyclists is to get more people out riding and bike lanes do that.
Putting in a bunch of bike lanes, particularly on major arteries where no good alternatives exist and the existing roads are dangerous, can really jump start cycling in a community. If nothing else it tells cyclists that the city is behind you and even willing to spend a little money for cycling. It also tells drivers that cycling is a legitimate means of transit and gets them used to the idea of cyclists being around even when there is no cyclist actually there riding by them.
Personally, I was out and riding before the bike lanes where there and I'll be out riding in and around the new lanes. They dont really have an effect on me either way.
Putting in a bunch of bike lanes, particularly on major arteries where no good alternatives exist and the existing roads are dangerous, can really jump start cycling in a community. If nothing else it tells cyclists that the city is behind you and even willing to spend a little money for cycling. It also tells drivers that cycling is a legitimate means of transit and gets them used to the idea of cyclists being around even when there is no cyclist actually there riding by them.
Personally, I was out and riding before the bike lanes where there and I'll be out riding in and around the new lanes. They dont really have an effect on me either way.
08-30-12, 08:33 AM
#56
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Over the last year or so Tampa has reworked some of the intercity roads for cycling purposes. They have used a mix of strategies mostly sharrows and bike lanes. What I think has been effective is they looked at the environment and tried to fit the cycling solution to the road conditions. I especially like it when they took a busy 4 lane road and made it a 3 lane with wider traffic lanes (with sharrows) and a middle turn lane. Not only did it calm traffic, but gave plenty of room for cycling.
So to answer the original question…I like and use well thought out bike lanes.
The dumbest thing I’ve seen around here are bike “paths” that are glorified sidewalks with a line painted down the middle. Why bother?
So to answer the original question…I like and use well thought out bike lanes.
The dumbest thing I’ve seen around here are bike “paths” that are glorified sidewalks with a line painted down the middle. Why bother?
08-30-12, 08:37 AM
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This thread is very interesting, thanks guys. I'm getting a master's degree in urban planning with a focus on transportation planning, and I'm about to start an internship with the guy who runs the Bike Pedestrian and Trails program for my city, so we'll be looking at exactly the sort of experiences you guys have shared to help decide on future bike infrastructure projects.
08-30-12, 09:16 AM
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That's a big deal.
08-30-12, 09:23 AM
#59
Descends like a rock
A pretty important benefit is that bike lanes mean more people on bikes, which means drivers are more aware of us, they're expecting bikes to be around and drive more carefully because of it. Most people in the 41 are avid cyclists, and we'll ride with or without a lane. But most cyclists aren't. Bike lanes coax people like my kid brother out onto the road.
That's a big deal.
That's a big deal.
08-30-12, 10:07 AM
#60
Portland Fred
Ride down Wilshire Boulevard in Los Angeles right around the UCLA area (which is a major throughfare, for peds cars and bikes) and I think you'd fine yourself wishing there were a bike lane as the cars try and squash you into the parked cars on the side. (There actually is enough room to ride a bike even with moving traffic and parked cars - but it's no fun whatsoever. A bike lane would be SO much better for that road.)
A pretty important benefit is that bike lanes mean more people on bikes, which means drivers are more aware of us, they're expecting bikes to be around and drive more carefully because of it. Most people in the 41 are avid cyclists, and we'll ride with or without a lane. But most cyclists aren't. Bike lanes coax people like my kid brother out onto the road.
That's a big deal.
That's a big deal.
I should say that when I'm intentionally taking the roads with no lanes, I come within a foot of cars pretty much every day and that most other people who ride out here think I'm nuts. But part of me likes playing in traffic and the drivers out here are especially considerate.
08-30-12, 10:28 AM
#61
SuperGimp
Well, this has been a very level headed thread so far - +1 to SeattleForrest's comment about bike lanes for less avid cyclists.
I'll ride with traffic any time but there are some roads i avoid like the plague - Imperial highway (east of the 605) has a 50 mph speed limit and no shoulder. It's not really a higyway, but it's 3 lanes each way of fast moving traffic with stop lights every few blocks, which means people are going 60 between the lights. I don't care how A+S you are, "vehicular cycling" on that road is going to get you killed. You just can't have that great of a spread in speeds and not expect danger. Cities should make an effort to provide a way to get across their city in a consistent way - if you check out google maps and turn on the bike lane feature and try to get from point A to point B on bike friendly streets, you're probably going to have a crazy zig-zag route. And as I mentioned in my first post, the bike lanes will appear and disappear with no predictability.
I've always wondered about the benefit of those little green signs that read "bike route" or something along those lines with no particular effort to stripe the road or provide a bike lane. We have plenty of them.
Santa Monica recently installed a class 1 bike lane on Santa Monica Blvd (I may have the names wrong) and it absolutely floored me how expensive it was to put paint on the road.
I'll ride with traffic any time but there are some roads i avoid like the plague - Imperial highway (east of the 605) has a 50 mph speed limit and no shoulder. It's not really a higyway, but it's 3 lanes each way of fast moving traffic with stop lights every few blocks, which means people are going 60 between the lights. I don't care how A+S you are, "vehicular cycling" on that road is going to get you killed. You just can't have that great of a spread in speeds and not expect danger. Cities should make an effort to provide a way to get across their city in a consistent way - if you check out google maps and turn on the bike lane feature and try to get from point A to point B on bike friendly streets, you're probably going to have a crazy zig-zag route. And as I mentioned in my first post, the bike lanes will appear and disappear with no predictability.
I've always wondered about the benefit of those little green signs that read "bike route" or something along those lines with no particular effort to stripe the road or provide a bike lane. We have plenty of them.
Santa Monica recently installed a class 1 bike lane on Santa Monica Blvd (I may have the names wrong) and it absolutely floored me how expensive it was to put paint on the road.
08-30-12, 11:08 AM
#62
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DDF,
Good, thoughtful thread, thank you for bring it up and to the mode for letting it stay in 41. We have some bike lanes in Pensacola, the trouble with ours are that most just end suddenly, where the road repaving project ended, usually. The biggest problem with the lanes out in the rural area I live in is they become a parking area for the garbage cans all the time. The usual trash and debris build up is here, too, so the pieces of blown tires, tree limbs and beer cans are there to effect the riding. I have better luck riding carefully in the traffic lane and using complete defensive riding, every car/truck/driver is a potential accident I am going to lose.
If you do want to advocate for the lanes you need to involve the shops and riders in your area and use good, positive advocacy and watch the image you project. In the deep south you and I are in this matters a lot as to how the general public will support any bicycling project like bike lanes. if there is/are a good club(s) they can be invaluable, but the ones here are just burnt out on any advocacy at all. Survival is the big issue here right now. Many cyclist hit and killed/injured lately. Best of Luck in what ever you attempt.
Bill
Good, thoughtful thread, thank you for bring it up and to the mode for letting it stay in 41. We have some bike lanes in Pensacola, the trouble with ours are that most just end suddenly, where the road repaving project ended, usually. The biggest problem with the lanes out in the rural area I live in is they become a parking area for the garbage cans all the time. The usual trash and debris build up is here, too, so the pieces of blown tires, tree limbs and beer cans are there to effect the riding. I have better luck riding carefully in the traffic lane and using complete defensive riding, every car/truck/driver is a potential accident I am going to lose.
If you do want to advocate for the lanes you need to involve the shops and riders in your area and use good, positive advocacy and watch the image you project. In the deep south you and I are in this matters a lot as to how the general public will support any bicycling project like bike lanes. if there is/are a good club(s) they can be invaluable, but the ones here are just burnt out on any advocacy at all. Survival is the big issue here right now. Many cyclist hit and killed/injured lately. Best of Luck in what ever you attempt.
Bill
This is a good point. For the most part I feel perfectly safe when cycling just about any of the streets of London and England in general, and I've ridden a few fast roads in the suburbs of London and a bunch of rural lanes that twist and wind but have a 60mph default speed limit on them. You get the odd moron who passes too close but for the most part we don't have a problem with that.
In the US the impression I get (I've never cycled there) is that the vehicles are much bigger than ours, and the standard of driving is lower than in the UK. You also seem to have a lot of trucks in rural areas, far more than we have over here (we obviously have them, but in the US it seems you might have a single road that isn't very big that runs through a rural area, and all the trucks take it - must be an effect of the land mass being so much bigger).
Ironically the roads in the US generally seem to be so much wider than here in the UK I'd have thought it would be easy enough for cyclists and motor vehicles to share the space.
In the US the impression I get (I've never cycled there) is that the vehicles are much bigger than ours, and the standard of driving is lower than in the UK. You also seem to have a lot of trucks in rural areas, far more than we have over here (we obviously have them, but in the US it seems you might have a single road that isn't very big that runs through a rural area, and all the trucks take it - must be an effect of the land mass being so much bigger).
Ironically the roads in the US generally seem to be so much wider than here in the UK I'd have thought it would be easy enough for cyclists and motor vehicles to share the space.
I have mixed feelings on bike lanes, but overall think they are a good thing. They do tend to relegate bikes to the broken glass/door zone and can create the idea in people's mind that if there's no bike lane, they cant ride their bike. On the other hand, when you put in bike lanes, more people get out and ride their bikes for transportation. I've seen that clearly demonstrated in my own neighborhood and around the city. The very best thing you can do to improve the safety of cyclists is to get more people out riding and bike lanes do that.
Putting in a bunch of bike lanes, particularly on major arteries where no good alternatives exist and the existing roads are dangerous, can really jump start cycling in a community. If nothing else it tells cyclists that the city is behind you and even willing to spend a little money for cycling. It also tells drivers that cycling is a legitimate means of transit and gets them used to the idea of cyclists being around even when there is no cyclist actually there riding by them.
Personally, I was out and riding before the bike lanes where there and I'll be out riding in and around the new lanes. They dont really have an effect on me either way.
Putting in a bunch of bike lanes, particularly on major arteries where no good alternatives exist and the existing roads are dangerous, can really jump start cycling in a community. If nothing else it tells cyclists that the city is behind you and even willing to spend a little money for cycling. It also tells drivers that cycling is a legitimate means of transit and gets them used to the idea of cyclists being around even when there is no cyclist actually there riding by them.
Personally, I was out and riding before the bike lanes where there and I'll be out riding in and around the new lanes. They dont really have an effect on me either way.
Over the last year or so Tampa has reworked some of the intercity roads for cycling purposes. They have used a mix of strategies mostly sharrows and bike lanes. What I think has been effective is they looked at the environment and tried to fit the cycling solution to the road conditions. I especially like it when they took a busy 4 lane road and made it a 3 lane with wider traffic lanes (with sharrows) and a middle turn lane. Not only did it calm traffic, but gave plenty of room for cycling.
So to answer the original question…I like and use well thought out bike lanes.
The dumbest thing I’ve seen around here are bike “paths” that are glorified sidewalks with a line painted down the middle. Why bother?
So to answer the original question…I like and use well thought out bike lanes.
The dumbest thing I’ve seen around here are bike “paths” that are glorified sidewalks with a line painted down the middle. Why bother?
This thread is very interesting, thanks guys. I'm getting a master's degree in urban planning with a focus on transportation planning, and I'm about to start an internship with the guy who runs the Bike Pedestrian and Trails program for my city, so we'll be looking at exactly the sort of experiences you guys have shared to help decide on future bike infrastructure projects.
08-30-12, 01:19 PM
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Just to be clear...most of the real MUP's are out on the edge of town. I don't mind an MUP every once in a while. The paths we have in the city really are sidewalks that have been painted on and called a bike path. They have all the inherent dangers of trying to navigate a crosswalk with car traffic. I think it does more harm to encourage people to use them by calling them bike paths.
08-30-12, 01:46 PM
#64
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Bike Lanes, adjacent to the car traffic lane are a much better idea because they don't increase intersection collisions.
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You could hit a tree and die.
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You could fall off a cliff and die.
You could get lost and die.
You could hit a tree and die.
OR YOU COULD STAY HOME AND FALL OFF THE COUCH AND DIE.
08-30-12, 02:43 PM
#65
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I just came back from a vacation in Vancouver, Canada, and rode a lot while there. It's like cycling in heaven, or at least how I imagine cycling in heaven would be. There are bike lanes, clearly marked signs for both roads and highways, and well thought-out entry and exit points for bikes. You can tell it's a long and concerted effort and commitment the entire community made to make cycling safe and viable, not just for roadies like us, but for everyone.
I wish more of our cities in the US would learn from that; alas, I can only dream.
I wish more of our cities in the US would learn from that; alas, I can only dream.
08-30-12, 03:03 PM
#66
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[QUOTE=DropDeadFred;14672249]I think there should be better enforcement to keep the lanes cleared...theyd get in trouble if the cans were in the road
Agreed completely and my thought I expressed to law enforcement. They are not going to hassle with this problem when there are more pressing matters, we are in the middle of a drive through shooting/murder epidemic right now. I'm waiting for a cyclist to swerve to miss a set of these large cans and get hit by a fast moving car. The law suit against the county, the home owner, county sanitation and anyone else they can bring in will be expensive and hate producing. I looked at these lanes coming home from the office today and all the glass, limbs, sanitation and recycling cans and right of way grass piles was closing many sections off forcing runners and cyclist into the road. Sad state of affairs.
Agreed completely and my thought I expressed to law enforcement. They are not going to hassle with this problem when there are more pressing matters, we are in the middle of a drive through shooting/murder epidemic right now. I'm waiting for a cyclist to swerve to miss a set of these large cans and get hit by a fast moving car. The law suit against the county, the home owner, county sanitation and anyone else they can bring in will be expensive and hate producing. I looked at these lanes coming home from the office today and all the glass, limbs, sanitation and recycling cans and right of way grass piles was closing many sections off forcing runners and cyclist into the road. Sad state of affairs.
__________________
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I Can Do All Things Through Him, Who Gives Me Strength. Philippians 4:13
Semper Fi, USMC, 1975-1977
I Can Do All Things Through Him, Who Gives Me Strength. Philippians 4:13
08-30-12, 03:57 PM
#67
Descends like a rock
As for planning, I would love to see cities require pedestrian and bike considerations with all road improvements. If you widen a road, or build or improve a big freeway, think about how cyclists are going to get across that thing and incorporate that into the planning. Around here, freeways are huge barriers to cycling. Finding a way across a freeway can be the greatest challenge of the ride. The same goes for river crossings and other natural or man-made obstacles to getting around by non-automobile means.
08-30-12, 04:05 PM
#68
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As for planning, I would love to see cities require pedestrian and bike considerations with all road improvements. If you widen a road, or build or improve a big freeway, think about how cyclists are going to get across that thing and incorporate that into the planning. Around here, freeways are huge barriers to cycling. Finding a way across a freeway can be the greatest challenge of the ride. The same goes for river crossings and other natural or man-made obstacles to getting around by non-automobile means.
The UK government showed its green credentials when they built the new bridge over the Severn. The old M4 bridge had a footpath/cyclepath so it could still be crossed by walkers and cyclists. The new one doesn't. Nice one guys.
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08-30-12, 04:37 PM
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We are in the south (columbus, ga) and full of rednecks who don't understand we pay taxes and have rights to the road as well.
thoughts?
Do you prefer riding on roads without bike lanes* or with??? (I'm not talking about deep downtown where there are tons of parked cars...
thoughts?
Do you prefer riding on roads without bike lanes* or with??? (I'm not talking about deep downtown where there are tons of parked cars...
Sorry i did not read each and every post in this thread, but I like the idea, though the bike lanes will not necessarily provide adequate safety they will help to make drivers aware of the cyclist.
I would start to collect some information for your mayor to help her to make a decisions. For example, approx how many cyclist in your area, is there any accidents, injuries, aggressive behavior happened due to the lack of bike lanes, etc.
May I also suggest to start with yellow bike signs first. It is cheaper that dedicated lanes and make the drivers aware of cyclists present.
08-30-12, 04:54 PM
#70
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just a quick update, I was on a local talk show today (for my site yerbid.com) and the mayor happened to also be a guest. This was our first person to person meeting, we go back and forth over the topic on facebook (were friends on there) and they called my name and her face got that "wtf" look and I introduced myself...shes actually quite nice and she was helpful to direct me to some of the meetings I should attend and who to get with and also informed me who was the group of people putting the idea down and what I should do to object them publicly and get some solid traction going. I also told her about this thread...I'm going to link it to her.
08-30-12, 04:57 PM
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Where new roads are built it makes sense to build them with infrastructure already there for cyclists and pedestrians. When working with existing roads it often seems that the best anyone can manage is a bit of paint at the roadside, leaving motor traffic with a space too narrow to fit down and then people wonder why drivers drive in the bike lane.
The UK government showed its green credentials when they built the new bridge over the Severn. The old M4 bridge had a footpath/cyclepath so it could still be crossed by walkers and cyclists. The new one doesn't. Nice one guys.
The UK government showed its green credentials when they built the new bridge over the Severn. The old M4 bridge had a footpath/cyclepath so it could still be crossed by walkers and cyclists. The new one doesn't. Nice one guys.
08-30-12, 05:20 PM
#72
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Run for a seat on the city planning commission, to advocate from the inside,
of local government.
Myself, for urban streets..
the parked cars should be next to the traffic flow
then the bike lane, then the sidewalk..
still nothing against taking the lane in the traffic flow,
but some people Pootle along and will be safer with that parked steel
as a barrier.
of local government.
Myself, for urban streets..
the parked cars should be next to the traffic flow
then the bike lane, then the sidewalk..
still nothing against taking the lane in the traffic flow,
but some people Pootle along and will be safer with that parked steel
as a barrier.
Last edited by fietsbob; 08-30-12 at 05:28 PM.
08-30-12, 05:46 PM
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I just came back from a vacation in Vancouver, Canada, and rode a lot while there. It's like cycling in heaven, or at least how I imagine cycling in heaven would be. There are bike lanes, clearly marked signs for both roads and highways, and well thought-out entry and exit points for bikes. You can tell it's a long and concerted effort and commitment the entire community made to make cycling safe and viable, not just for roadies like us, but for everyone.
I wish more of our cities in the US would learn from that; alas, I can only dream.
I wish more of our cities in the US would learn from that; alas, I can only dream.
I think biking in Vancouver, while perhaps not heaven, is reasonable and improving.
08-30-12, 05:50 PM
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That's what happens when you have a rapidly growing city with lots of water and bridges and limited capacity to expand roadways. They tend to focus on increasing the infrastructure for cyclists, pedestrians and public transit. In the downtown core there are a number of dedicated bike lanes separated from traffic. For example, one controversial project involved removing the parking lane on one busy street and using it for bikes only: 
I think biking in Vancouver, while perhaps not heaven, is reasonable and improving.
I think biking in Vancouver, while perhaps not heaven, is reasonable and improving.