mdilthey

Exactly. I'd add to that that going UL also usually comes with a lot of planning. If you're carrying less, you scrutinize every detail because you have less room for error.

Not only that, I am also very careful about getting wet, or overheating with too many layers. I'm careful about packing my shelter away from my sleeping bag. Because I only have one of some things, I take care not to needlessly waste anything, and I try not to end up soaking wet and cold.

Someone carrying four outfits may not be as careful, and may end up with wet, sweaty gear. The mentality that "carrying more makes you more comfortable" has less to do with what you're carrying and more to do with your touring mindset and habits. That's universal between gear weights.

Squeezebox

Did I say hilarous or perverted or both.

Buffalo Buff

Nice looking bike! Sounds like a great place to end a ride

Buffalo Buff

I used showers on the coastal beaches in Texas and other states one of my last tours. Didn't need any shoes.

andrewclaus

This statement baffled me. From my point of view, bringing less stuff is simple. Packing more stuff is more trouble. We all have different viewpoints, and that makes it interesting.

Doug64

+1

The way I interpret this thread is: One faction says if you bring more gear than I use, you are carrying too much. The other faction says if you bring less gear than I do, you are uncomfortable.

It seems like most of us carry the minimum amount of gear that will meet our needs for a specific tour.

There are so many variables between tours it is almost impossible to make generalizations.

psy

Oh yeah? I'm a pillow snob I'd love to know which one that is.

I have a sea to summit, exped, and a Kelty luxury. The Kelty is worth the 11 oz. and I don't bother with anything else.

nun

I find a UL Exped nestled into the hood of my sleeping bag is very comfortable

chrisx

I am thinking if I get a hammock that weighs 2 pounds I will be more comfortable. That extra 1/4 pound might slow me down though.

My wool shirt makes a beter pillow than my blow up pillow.
The rain jacket was extra weight for 33 days, then it rained a million drops.
Since I pedaled the pacific coast route 5 times everyone should do it my way.

To start with no songs over 3 minutes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0E1efv6mLA
extra pixels slow the rotaton of the earth

Do these 10 lines make since?
More or less than the last 10 pages?

chrisx

what if somebody figures out that my wool shirt is heavy
oh no
by the by, the fleece is warmer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4evy_IMFKQ
3:35 = minus points

hueyhoolihan

meh, more or less...

psy

A perfect example of my one and only point, we all have different comfort levels and many of us choose to carry a few extras because we want them. Not because they are poor/ uninformed/ cheap gear choices, as ul proponents often seem to imply. I have that pillow and I find it to be the least comfortable of the three I have. The cheapest and heaviest one is the I use on most trips.
Same with my sleeping bag. My winter bag is a Sierra designs backcountry bed 800 fill down 20 degree bag. For the same price I could have bought a traditional down mummy bag that weighs more than a third less. But I'm a side sleeper and toss and turn, and this is the only bag I've ever owned that I don't get tangled up in. It's really awesome and anyone who hates getting tangled up in their bag three times a night should try one out.
So these are examples of reasons I, and I imagine many others aren't as ultralight as we could be if we sacrificed our comfort, we all have different comfort levels and most of us fall towards the middle of the spectrum.

Happy Feet

I think just bringing less stuff would put one in the light weight category (if there are such categories). To go UL most people are investing in specific pieces of equipment or materials and adopting a very intentional mindset.

For example, one might tour with a small tent stored in panniers. To go UL they buy a tarp tent or hammock and use bikepacking bags. So the question is, if you are happy with the tent and panniers and can tour in comfort, why go lighter?

It's not something I need convincing about personally. I've done all this to death 30 years ago when I was climbing. I sold UL climbing gear and got wholesale pricing on all my own stuff. I have a bivy sac, thinsulite bag, climbing stove I can suspend in a tent etc... But, that is the sort of question I think many tourers would ask ie. "I'm happy doing what I'm doing with what I have, why do I need/want to go UL?" You would have to convince me that there are troves of tourers out there miserable doing what they are doing and looking for a solution but that doesn't seem to be the case. I don't mean any offense because I'm a nerd myself but it just seems like a subset of tourers that enjoy geeking out on seeing how light they can go.

rekmeyata

When I tour I bring my bed from the bedroom with all the linens and pillows, just certain creature comforts a person needs to have.

Buffalo Buff

For me its just about making the ride more fun. When I take my bike out for a quick pleasure ride witu no luggage on it, I love how it accelerates and handles. Packing lighter makes it feel closer to that.

Rowan

Loving this thread. It just keeps giving and giving!

elcruxio

Making actual fires should usually be reserved for emergencies, except of course if you're at a camping site with a dedicated fire making spot and provided fuel. Making fires for fun in the wild is irresponsible, inconsiderate and possibly dangerous.

However I use a woodgas stove, which isn't a fire and thus has a few more requirements than making a pile of sticks and lighting it up. Hence the axe/hatchet comes in really handy since it speeds up wood processing by maybe tenfold. Don'r really get the idea about a saw since it can't split soow. Cutting it is rarely an issue.
That said, even If I had a gas stove I'd still rather always take the axe/hatchet since it's such a multifunctional tool and can be useful for just about anything

imi

People all over the world make open fires every day, to cook, for warmth, to sit around and enjoy.

Squeezebox

Are you serious? Do you really bring an 11 oz pillow with you? That's really funny. Does it go in the trailer with the bath tub?

Rowan

Increasingly, open fires are being discouraged, and even outlawed in Australia because of the very real bushfire dangers they present, especially in summer. In World Heritage Areas such as the South-West of Tasmania, open fires are banned, and if you want to cook, take a stove; if you want to stay warm, take more clothing.

I've also been in one North American campground where the woodsmoke from a succession of campfires was disgusting. Like everything else, there are people who know how to build and burn fires with the right wood, and there are those who have a romantic idea, but have no clue.

Machka 

+1

Campfires are also banned in certain parts of Canada at certain times of the year ... because of the potential for forest fires.

bmike

You know that you can walk away from the keyboard at anytime. At this point your argument goes like this:

OP: I want to run a marathon. I need some gear and training advice.
PSY: Why do you want to run a marathon. People like me have been happy running 10ks.
OP: Becasue I really want to run a marathon.
PSY: I don't run marathons. I usually run a 5k and might do a 10k once a year.
OP: So, I think I have my training plan figured out. What do you experienced runners think?
PSY: Really, there's no need to run a marathon. A 10k is fine for most people.
OP: I'm not most people.
PSY: Well, you should be.

imi

My point was that making a fire in the wild does not per definition have to be irresponsible, inconsiderate and possibly dangerous...
Of course it can be, duh, which is why it is even illegal in many places or at certain times of the year... And totally legal in other places if done in a safe and responsible way.

nun

I don't believe anyone said that you have made inappropriate gear choices. The way I understood your point was that UL people could not take certain items and were therefore less comfortable. I now agree with what you are saying. We all have different comfort levels. Personally, I am just as comfortable with my UL equipment as heavier alternatives and I believe that many people could, and do, feel the same way. I do not lack functionality, (I carry shower shoes, pillow, umbrella etc) I just do it with lightweight gear.

nun

+1

I go lightweight as I can maintain camping comfort and improve cycling comfort and enjoyment. It has the added benefit of making travel very easy and if I ever have to lift my bike over an obstacle that is also very easy.