1simplexnut

thanks ah well its something different

1simplexnut

darn good question ! oh the horror of it ! .. Just spotted a catalogue on peugeot.com with a PX10SH (sh=shimano ?) shows a picture of shimano 600 shifters and 531 pro tube decal .
Might have to strip it of all the italian and french equipment and do a build with 600 group set ?
all good fun .

Thanks to everyone for their input

verktyg 

Why ask why?

Shimano probably cut some kind of deal with bike makers to use them???

Fortunately Shimano only used those mounts for a few years - 1982 to 1984???

The only bike I have with those mounts is a 1982 Motobecane Grand Record. I had to dig through the junk boxes at a LBS to find the half moon adapters to use modern SIS levers.



That was a time when Shimano was aggressively going after Campagnolo's mid range to top of the line business with their 600 and DuraAce gruppos.

At the same time, Campy was lost from lack of direction and leadership... Tullio was in his final years and couldn't see past Nuovo Record/Super Record designs that kept them on top from the 1960s on.

Valentino Campagnolo was pushing for new designs to fend off Shimano in the mid range market with Grand Sport, Triomphe and Victory gruppos plus the new top model Record products that were quickly renamed Record C (which didn't take off until the late 80s). But... buyers of top end bikes still wanted Campy NR/SR components.

In 1984 Shimano introduced SIS Index shifting. Campy completely disregarded indexing until the late 80s saying/thinking it was just a marketing fad for Freds.

Shimano probably thought that the the proprietary lever mounts would give them an edge against competitors who used de facto standard lever bosses. No one else's levers would fit them. Later Shimano came out with adapters so that standard levers could be used on their bosses.

Shimano still uses their wonky Type A features on insides of their down tube shifters except they're supplied with the adapters for standard Campy style bosses. At one time SIS levers came with the half moons for both styles of bosses.

verktyg


Chas.

verktyg 

Chombi,

Shimano made the adapters not Peugeot, see pictures above... and post below...

verktyg


Carlos

verktyg 

Hi all,

Here's a link to the Classic Rendezvous website with a section on the history of PX-10s plus some information on serial numbers.

PX-10_History

verktyg

Carlos

Chombi

Oh, I wouldn't be surprised with an adaptor, but that last pic sows an actual Shimano spec shifter boss brazed on to the frame by the factory..... so why would Peugeot limit shifter choice to Shimano??....Especially as I don't remember Peugeot coming out with a special race bike model back then, featuring a Shimano group. That's why this is unusual for me...

1simplexnut

Hi Chombi , spotted this which I think explains the braze-on ??

Chombi

Well that explains things. Must be a Euro market only model as I don't think that bike was sold here in the US. That's why we find the Shimano braze on bosses a bit strange....
Thanks for clearing things up 1simplexnut!

verktyg 

Chombi, et al...

Peugeot, Motobecane, Gitane and Raleigh all made bikes for specific markets, e.g. France, The UK, Netherlands, Germany, the US, Canada, Australia and the "East Block" (Hungary, Poland and so on).

Sometimes they used the same model names on completely different bikes. For example, The 1988 Peugeot Aravis was a high end model with a Reynolds 531P frame and Shimano 105 gruppo. At the same time, Aravis was the name of an entry level model in Canada!



I have a 1979 Raleigh "Record" that was made for the French market but somehow slipped into the US. It's actually a 1979 Raleigh Competition in Team kit with Japanese components.



My US model 1988 Peugeot Chorus has a Reynolds 753 frame and Campy Chorus gruppo. It's different from the French version which is all white and has a Reynolds 531P frame .



BTW, Moto was one of the worst offenders.

mssr. verktyg


Chas.

verktyg 

You'll find SGDG on the back of most Simplex derailleurs. SGDG means "sans garantie du gouvernement" - without guarantee of the government.

"Brevete" is the French equivalent of Patent in US English.

The complete wording is "Brevete sans garantie du gouvernement meaning: the claims of the patent are not backed in any way by a guarantee of the [French] government.

Just as in the US where "Patent Pending" means nothing!

verktyg

Chas.

gioscinelli 

Hi @verktyg, I found the date code on the Simplex derailleur on the jockey holder "2/71" which gbi suggested. Oh, by the way, the PX 10 is one hellofa bike to ride! Thanks, Mike

verktyg 

As far as I could tell, my 1967 PX-10 barn bike find was all original except for tires and it had a replacement Simplex Criterium RD dated 1972 or 73. The original may have gotten sucked into the spokes which was common on bikes that weren't regularly maintained.

BTW, not all Simplex RDs had a date code stamped into the pulley cages. Probably less than half of the ones that I've seen were dated. The practice may have ended during the Bike Boom as a time/money saving step.

verktyg

Chas.

crank_addict

Have a Q for the Peugeot pro's. Spotted a Peugeot with Italian brand Giubilato on the fork crown and stay caps. Anyone familiar with these?

verktyg 

Most likely someone put Peugeot decals on a Giubilato frame. It's usually the opposite where someone puts Colnago or whatever decals on a lesser quality make.

Here's a mid 70s "Peugeot" track bike that was actually a repainted Gitane Super Pista. The owner worked at a large Peugeot dealer in Boston where he had access to PX-10 decals and did the transformation. It had all Campy components except for a Weinmann front brake. A Peugeot from that era would have been all French!



We had a Gitane Super Pista at our shop. One day the ersatz Peugeot owner stopped by to buy something. We dragged the Gitane out and compared the two. The Peugeot owner fessed up and told us the whole story.

There was a Peugeot dealer a few blocks from our shop. They put PX-10 decals on a gas pipe Huffy that they used as a shop bike!!!


verktyg


Chas.

crank_addict

Thanks verktyg-
I'm sure there's some faux repaint / rebadged out there. Forgot to take a few pics but the one I looked at was rough. Seems the only others I've seen online are in the same ratty condition. Also was difficult determining if it was a repaint. Paint was nice laid and smooth but scored like it was cleaned with a Brillo pad. Scratches and chips too. Just like the sample depicted below, its a metalflake black painted frameset but has a Stronglight headset (A9?) and Stronglight bb. Derailleur dropout / chainstay looks slightly outward compared to the opposite side. Not sure if it was intentionally done. No tubing label either.

Curiosity led me to some other listings. The CL posting looks whacked and incorrectly described. The other posted in France looks like it but I don't recall the bb shell cutout. Did Ganna / Giubilato make some special team bikes for the Peugeot label? If its something rare, I'm willing to go for it and get the frame pro aligned.

gioscinelli 

Update to my 71 Peugeot PX 10 with original wheels Normandy Hub, AVA Tubular Rims and Adom QR. I wonder what purpose the left rear dropout with a flared style has to do, or just a style?



Now for the update!







If anyone has the half Mafac Hoods or whole hood, I'll be interested in buying. Email a photo and cost.
Thank you, Mike

auchencrow

@gioscinelli Mike, the forged "flared style" hook was there as a thumb rest to assist seating the axle in the DO. (But as soon as the French discovered that it was a good idea, they eliminated it ).

PS- MAFAC half-hoods in good condition will likely be expensive IF they even exist anymore!

gioscinelli 

@auchencrow, Thank you for such an interesting explanation for the rear dropout, (But as soon as the French discovered that it was a good idea, they eliminated it )" "les Français, vont chiffre"! As for the Mafac, I guess I wait for a complete Peugeot to popup on CL.

qd-s

.
Early 1966 Eddy-Merckx-replica (Eddy Merckx (1966)):




More pics:
Klassiker des Monats Jänner 2015

auchencrow

velofinds

May I ask what kind of bottle cage adapter you are using? It looks fabulous

qd-s

Thanks!

Apart from the clamps that hold the cage to the downtube there is no adapter to speak of.



The shape of the cage itself might give the impression of an adapter present. The cage's circle at the top is raised about half an inch from its basis (parallel to the downtube) resulting in an slightly angled position of the bottle.

It's this "REG" bottle cage: VeloBase.com - Component: REG water bottle cage (Frame Mount)

Very nice design, cleverly bent from one length of steel rod (the weld is where the mounting rails meet the circle at the top).

Kactus

Mon Dieu. Magnifique!

CMAW 

Fabulous restoration qd-s, the mother of them all.

dddd

I agree, it looks like a (if I may be so bold) "grail" sort of PX10 that I would so enjoy riding (as fast as possible).