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Cyclist Rear Ended at 55mph

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Cyclist Rear Ended at 55mph

Old 09-11-19, 03:12 PM
  #201  
Moe Zhoost
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
Seriously, with as little follow-up (did the driver stop?!) as there has been to this story a person should be forgiven for wondering if it wasn't some elaborate stunt.
There has not been much followup, which is a bit surprising since the victim did post the video. Perhaps litigation is suppressing information. One can know that it was not an elaborate stunt by the news broadcast linked in the initial post. Don't even think that, mate.
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Old 09-11-19, 03:45 PM
  #202  
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Originally Posted by Moe Zhoost View Post
There has not been much followup, which is a bit surprising since the victim did post the video. Perhaps litigation is suppressing information. One can know that it was not an elaborate stunt by the news broadcast linked in the initial post. Don't even think that, mate.
I noticed the same pulling the information for our local cyclist killed from behind. State Highway Patrol was 'investigating the accident' and then nothing in the 3 months since. At least here, killing someone while operating a vehicle is enough to bring vehicular manslaughter charges, which is a misdemeanor .

Looking at the penalties applicable, if you kill someone while driving but not speeding, even if it's your fault, the worst you could see is a 3 year license suspension and 90 days in jail. This seems slightly inappropriate.
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Old 09-11-19, 04:00 PM
  #203  
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Originally Posted by Unca_Sam View Post
Please share?
Post #6
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Old 09-11-19, 04:14 PM
  #204  
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
You’ve heard of Zwift?

Unforgivable.

-mr. bill
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Old 09-11-19, 04:18 PM
  #205  
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A few years ago I quit giving my opinion of things on internet forums, because there are always people that make things up to support an argument, or eventually throw smart ass remarks out to tick you off or because they know their argument is lame. Don't have no idea why I ever came on here again to give my opinion, because its no different here than any other forum. I even read one post where the poster said the car was on the rumble strip. Or the car was on the shoulder. Some of you have posted pictures of the car, but I really didn't see one where I would call the car on the shoulder or on the rumble strip. Anyway you all can ride on whatever road you want, where you want. Heck why not ride in the middle of the lane? You certainly have the right to. Then when you get run over by a driver that isn't paying attention, there will never be enough blame passed around on an internet forum, courthouse, or elsewhere, thats going to get you out of a wheelchair or casket.
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Old 09-11-19, 05:00 PM
  #206  
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If you're that thin-skinned then it's best you quit right now, or stop giving your opinion.🙄
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Old 09-11-19, 05:24 PM
  #207  
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Originally Posted by Alzerbster View Post
A few years ago I quit giving my opinion of things on internet forums, because there are always people that make things up to support an argument, or eventually throw smart ass remarks out to tick you off or because they know their argument is lame. Don't have no idea why I ever came on here again to give my opinion, because its no different here than any other forum. I even read one post where the poster said the car was on the rumble strip. Or the car was on the shoulder. Some of you have posted pictures of the car, but I really didn't see one where I would call the car on the shoulder or on the rumble strip. Anyway you all can ride on whatever road you want, where you want. Heck why not ride in the middle of the lane? You certainly have the right to. Then when you get run over by a driver that isn't paying attention, there will never be enough blame passed around on an internet forum, courthouse, or elsewhere, thats going to get you out of a wheelchair or casket.
You might be referring to a different incident I mentioned that left me scratching my head. That cyclist was on the shoulder, with lights, moving with traffic, and was killed when the driver drifted right. I was illustrating that the shoulder is no safer, and potentially more hazardous because you will be ignored by drivers.

Functionally, there is no reason to avoid this road. Aside from the posted limit, this is a "safe" road to ride on. If you take the precautions of making yourself visible, many drivers will have no problem using the left lane to avoid you and go about their business.
I can think of other roads where you would appear "magically" in front of a driver traveling at the posted speed because of the width of the road, vegetation, curves, and blind crests. Generally these roads have culverts instead of shoulders, so they're isn't really an escape route. Do you hug the fog line there to help bewildered drivers dodge you? Do you hang your bike on the wall and stay home?
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Old 09-11-19, 07:21 PM
  #208  
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Originally Posted by Alzerbster View Post
A few years ago I quit giving my opinion of things on internet forums, because there are always people that make things up to support an argument, or eventually throw smart ass remarks out to tick you off or because they know their argument is lame. Don't have no idea why I ever came on here again to give my opinion, because its no different here than any other forum. I even read one post where the poster said the car was on the rumble strip. Or the car was on the shoulder. Some of you have posted pictures of the car, but I really didn't see one where I would call the car on the shoulder or on the rumble strip. Anyway you all can ride on whatever road you want, where you want. Heck why not ride in the middle of the lane? You certainly have the right to. Then when you get run over by a driver that isn't paying attention, there will never be enough blame passed around on an internet forum, courthouse, or elsewhere, thats going to get you out of a wheelchair or casket.
You should choose not to let them tick you off!
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Old 09-11-19, 09:00 PM
  #209  
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Even the most stringent of laws will not prevent this.
Society as a whole is less respecting of human life, many just don't care. The courts have cheapened life by slap-on-the-hand punishment for homicides, and vehicular homicide.
Notice while riding, how many motorists fly by you at high speeds, and or don't make any attempt to leave a safe gap while passing you, even when no oncoming cars are coming.
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Old 09-11-19, 10:25 PM
  #210  
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Originally Posted by Celticgirl View Post
Even the most stringent of laws will not prevent this.
Society as a whole is less respecting of human life, many just don't care. The courts have cheapened life by slap-on-the-hand punishment for homicides, and vehicular homicide.

Notice while riding, how many motorists fly by you at high speeds, and or don't make any attempt to leave a safe gap while passing you, even when no oncoming cars are coming.
I have previously posted about the respect of motorists for cyclists:
Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
I get angry for a bit and then quickly remind myself of the much larger percentage of motorists who safely and quietly interacted with me on my ride.

Ignoring the harassers is the best. They are upset and hoping to get you upset. Don't give them the satisfaction.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
"Do you ever confront bad drivers?"

…How to get the message out? I find threads about what to say to a driver futile, since these are brief, often emotion laden encounters, and often the cyclist makes a bad impression

I have in the past posted about giving “bicyclist curses,” and “bicyclist blessings”; about 5 blessings a day, and about 3 curses a week.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I always think those self-absorbed cagers are only restrained by the thought of scratching their cars, or the hassle of filing police reports.

My only satisfactory retribution is to give them my previously-described Bicyclist Curse. (I repeatedly jab my pointed right index finger in their direction, while shouting an accusatory, ”You, you, you…”). The possibility of metaphysical retribution is more satisfying than the middle finger.

I do also bestow Bicyclist Blessings on drivers who show even a modicum of respect, with a wave of the hand….
Originally Posted by Maelochs View Post
i tell good drivers they will be blessed by the Pope of Boyleston Avenue.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
...So, @Maelochs, tell the bad drivers, woe unto them, for they shall be cursed by the Pope of Boylston Street.

*https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boylston_Street
A couple weeks ago a nice lady patiently followed me on a steep narrow downhill run of about a quarter mile. At the bottom of the hill we both stopped at a red light and I told her I had given her a bicyclist blessing. She somewhat bewilderedly replied she was not in a hurry.

When I have caught up with an accursed driver I have not informed them, but did continue jabbing my finger to indicate "shame on you." To inform them of my curse may be too antagonistic, with repercussions.

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 09-12-19 at 03:30 AM.
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Old 09-12-19, 05:54 AM
  #211  
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Cyclist Rear Ended at 55mph

Earlier on this thread I posed this question (in red):
Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
...Also, a rear-view mirror is a lot more useful than a rear facing camera, although not nearly as illustrative after the fact.

I doubt that car would have hit me. I would have bailed with about 2 seconds to spare. Been there, done that.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
Perhaps, @JoeyBike
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Having been hit from behind by a vehicle not so far in the distant past that video brings back some unpleasant memories for me. Luckily the car was only going about half the speed.

For those of you who think that you could have avoided such as situation if you were monitoring the rearward traffic using a mirror, I highly doubt that. I was wearing a mirror at the time that I was hit. I saw the car coming up from behind me, but like every other car that has passed me in all of my riding up to that point, I expected it to move over.

Sometimes they move over early. Sometimes they move over later. But they always move...until they don't. And by the time you realize it it's too late to react. You can't swerve to the right every time a car is about to pass you either. That's no way to ride a bike. A mirror helps you in other ways, so I continue to use it...

We trust that cars are going to move over to pass us, and almost all of the time they do. If this makes you uncomfortable, then you have to find ways to avoid being in that situation in the first place.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I’m an ardent mirror advocate. Many naysayers disparage the use of the mirror for the rare event as depicted above, just to avoid a rear end collision.

IMO a mirror is more frequently used, and more valuable to monitor and anticipate road hazards:...

So as a bailout training video, I have to consider how I would react to [such] a quickly upcoming car, and make the decision to bail, especially with an inhospitable shoulder.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
At what point do you realize that the upcoming car ain't gonna swerve out of your line of travel?
I realized in a later post I suggested an answer (in red):
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I have posted to this thread about lane position, basically my position is...whatever.
Originally Posted by Hoopdriver View Post
It's all situational
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
So...it depends?

This is the answer to every question ever asked here on BF. :
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
… However, riding venues for me are situational, and I use my judgement”:
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
Regarding the question of taking the lane, I’ve always felt it is a question of pragmatism, though I probably too obsequiously favor keeping the drivers happy by staying FRAP. Recently I posted on this thread:
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
On a few rides over the past few days I have tried out the more aggressive position, in the right tire track, with very good results. I can easily monitor the driver's responses in my rearview mirror...so far no aggressive maneuvers or honking.

I also like your [@Paul Barnard (link)] strategy of gently nudging towards the center, then relenting towards the right. And I always give a wave to the cooperative driver, either before or after their pass….

It is still a bit unsettling to take the lane, though my rearview mirrors keep me aware, and I now scan them more frequently, a goodthing.

I soon determined that at about 30 yards behind me, the driver probably has noticed me, but is not yet impatient.

So at that point I veer rightward to acknowledege the car’s presence and show my cooperative “share the road” attitude…

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 09-12-19 at 07:07 AM. Reason: added citation and link to post by Paul Barnard
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Old 09-12-19, 08:49 AM
  #212  
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This is 30 yards. For the past several seconds, the driver moved from near the fog line to the lane divider lines. The driver has now just started drifting back to the shoulder, and you have 1.4 seconds:



-mr. bill
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Old 09-12-19, 09:35 AM
  #213  
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Originally Posted by mr_bill View Post
This is 30 yards. For the past several seconds, the driver moved from near the fog line to the lane divider lines. The driver has now just started drifting back to the shoulder, and you have 1.4 seconds:

-mr. bill
Right. I can't speak for others, but I already admitted that this particular crash would have been difficult to avoid in that final second. Also that it is rare.

The vast majority of overtaking traffic does so in a safe manner. The few that don't are usually easily mitigated, especially if one is paying proper attention. One could ride a lifetime and not have all their unlucky stars line up in the unfortunate manner they did in the OP video.

A whole lot of worrying about something that is extremely unlikely to take you out.
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Old 09-12-19, 09:54 AM
  #214  
Jim from Boston
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:
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
At what point do you realize that the upcoming car ain't gonna swerve out of your line of travel?
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I soon determined that at about 30 yards behind me, the driver probably has noticed me, but is not yet impatient.

So at that point I veer rightward to acknowledege the car’s presence
Originally Posted by mr_bill View Post
This is 30 yards. For the past several seconds, the driver moved from near the fog line to the lane divider lines. The driver has now just started drifting back to the shoulder, and you have 1.4 seconds:
Originally Posted by mr_bill View Post
Sigh. FWIW, the shoulder is covered with loose chip seal.

For those who proclaim that this couldn't happen to you because you'd be riding on the shoulder, see this thread by Metric Man.

For those who proclaim that by riding on the other side of the rumble strips you would hear the rumble strips and get out of the way, note that in Metric Man's crash (not accident) from the time the full size pickup touches the fog line at 25.28 to impact at 26.16 is 0.88 seconds. Your cat-like reflexes are much better than mine.

For those who wouldn't ride on such roads, good for you.
Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Right. I can't speak for others, but I already admitted that this particular crash would have been difficult to avoid in that final second. Also that it is rare.

The vast majority of overtaking traffic does so in a safe manner. The few that don't are usually easily mitigated, especially if one is paying proper attention. One could ride a lifetime and not have all their unlucky stars line up in the unfortunate manner they did in the OP video.

A whole lot of worrying about something that is extremely unlikely to take you out.
Thanks for your replies, @mr.bill and @AlmostTrick.

Rare but it does happen.
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Having been hit from behind by a vehicle not so far in the distant past that video brings back some unpleasant memories for me. Luckily the car was only going about half the speed.

For those of you who think that you could have avoided such as situation if you were monitoring the rearward traffic using a mirror, I highly doubt that...
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
When I was hit from behind, it was on a wide, low-volume, well-lit residential road at about 9 PM in June, by a “distracted driver.” The route was so calm that I was not closely monitoring my rearward view.

In fact, though perhaps I could have ditched the bike, I’m glad I didn’t see it coming if I was going to get hit anyways...
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Old 09-12-19, 12:45 PM
  #215  
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Rare, with a caveat

Thankfully rare, unfortunately lethal. Most statistics I see give you a coin-flip's chance of surviving. It looks a whole lot better once you stack the probabilities, fortunately. I know that I'd have a significant epinephrine release if I saw it coming, though. Odds are only slightly worse for Schroedinger's cat...
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Old 09-12-19, 01:39 PM
  #216  
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Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
:Thanks for your replies, mr.bill and AlmostTrick.
Rare but it does happen.
You might find that replies to your comments, which you seem overjoyed to receive and acknowledge, would be less rare if your posts were presented in a more readable, less jumbled format without the superfluous quoting of old posts.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:08 PM
  #217  
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Yeah, there was an incident here last year. The road is 55 mph, 4 lanes + center left turn lane, and right turn lanes in the eastbound direction, and wide (10-12 foot) shoulders. The shoulders, which are clearly marked as bike lanes, double as fairly long right turn lanes on the south side (eastbound). A car, in fairly heavy traffic, pulled into the right turn lane without checking and probably closer to 60 mph. Struck the cyclist from behind and killed him.

Police reports indicate that the driver didn't start braking until after the impact. I've watched traffic on this road (and ride it about once/week) and this kind of situation is usually caused in heavy traffic, where the turning car is tailgating, and doesn't really have a way to look around the car ahead prior to shifting into the right turn lane. So, 100% the driver's fault. I really watch my rearview on this stretch, and that's what I look for: cars tailgating, and I tend to get a little further to the right to make it so they see me sooner if that's the case, and so I can ditch over the curb if needed.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:15 PM
  #218  
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Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Right. I can't speak for others, but I already admitted that this particular crash would have been difficult to avoid in that final second. Also that it is rare.

The vast majority of overtaking traffic does so in a safe manner. The few that don't are usually easily mitigated, especially if one is paying proper attention. One could ride a lifetime and not have all their unlucky stars line up in the unfortunate manner they did in the OP video.

A whole lot of worrying about something that is extremely unlikely to take you out.
Seriously? People are run down and injured or killed like this all the time. The only difference this time is there was (spectacular) video footage of the event. I have no way to prove this, but my years on BF and other forums have exposed me to a background drip, drip, drip of data on crashes like this and my very unscientific analysis is that there is a clear bias towards the victims being either competitive cyclists participating in open course road events or serious amateur cyclists on training rides. There is a natural paranoia among commuter and recreational cyclists that keeps them out of the flow of motor traffic as much as is possible. Some may argue with me, but I think the lack of fear of cars and/or the desire to clock in personal best elapsed times makes performance cyclists less likely to seek the safety of off road surfaces or use an out of the lane bike positioning.

On that road, whether the passing frequency of cars is one per hour or one per minute, I would be on the shoulder or on another road. On a different road with more curves and/or a lower speed limit I would risk the fog stripe. Those roads often have no shoulder anyway. It may be possible to ride for a long time like the cyclist that got hit and it may be possible to ride like I do and get hit in the first three years of riding. The conversations AFTER a hit where the cyclist(s) were shown to have done everything possible beforehand to forestall a crash take a very different angle of discussion. So do the legal inquiries. FWIW.

P.S. A great many, possibly the majority(!) of cyclists in America fear motor traffic so much that they restrict their riding to exclusively off-road environments. This is sad and unfortunate. The bicycle is an amazing transportation device. I literally could not live as I do without the use of a bicycle several times each day. Bicycles belong on the road but perhaps not all roads. "Take the lane" is unlikely to have saved this cyclist. Any motorist distracted (or triggered) enough not to see (or avoid) a cyclist in clear view ahead would not have moved over whether the cyclist was lane center, lane right, or lane left. What you are calling a 'rare event' has much less to do with driver behavior than to cyclist behavior. The majority of cyclists are not out there on the road to be hit, and even fewer are riding in (or near) the flight path of motor traffic on the roads.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:15 PM
  #219  
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@Notso_fastLane

What's your favorite tranquilizer after a ride on that road in traffic? Asking for a friend.
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Old 09-12-19, 02:19 PM
  #220  
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Originally Posted by Paul Barnard View Post
These exercises in hindsight and assumptions can be instructive and educational. If we assume every rider who was a victim of a careless motorist was infallible in their decision making, we wouldn't have many of the discussions we have here. Some riders summarily reject riding on the shoulder because there may be debris. Some reject the shoulder because it has debris even though that debris doesn't present a hazard. Some reject the shoulder because it's not a smooth as the primary road surface. Unless there was debris that presented a substantial hazard on that shoulder, I would have been on it. If there was such debris, I would NOT glue myself to the white line, and I would reenter the shoulder lane when the debris no longer presented a hazard, rumble strips be damned.

None of that disallows that the rider may have been completely just in where he was during the video.
I actually think these threads are worthless. Basically, the actual incident is being offered up as a hypothetical case in which we can discuss what we would do. The problem is we really never have enough information and end up just arguing about what the facts are. Also, I find the whole process of a bunch of self-appointed experts picking apart the actions of someone who just got hurt and filtering their perceptions of what "must have happened" through their own preconceived notions quite distasteful.

If we really want to do this, use fictional incidents. That way we can make up our own facts which will just be assumed to be true, discuss how we would react to the situation, and not have to assert our technical superiority to some real person who's this minute lying in a hospital bed maybe never to walk again (or whatever, this is a hypothetical victim). But this pretend NTSB nonsense process that is followed now is just designed to get a bunch of people with no special knowledge to assess blame and assert that it wouldn't happen to them.

Mostly, I think these threads have just become a big display of this: https://www.simplypsychology.org/fun...tribution.html
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Old 09-12-19, 02:26 PM
  #221  
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Originally Posted by Unca_Sam View Post
@Notso_fastLane

What's your favorite tranquilizer after a ride on that road in traffic? Asking for a friend.
Beer is always a good option.

I find drinking helps.
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Old 09-12-19, 03:42 PM
  #222  
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Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
Thanks for your replies, @mr.bill and @AlmostTrick.

Rare but it does happen.
Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
You might find that replies to your comments, which you seem overjoyed to receive and acknowledge, would be less rare if your posts were presented in a more readable, less jumbled format without the superfluous quoting of old posts.
And thank you too, @I-Like-To-Bike, for your response. I usually don’t reply in full about my posting style to such critiques until two or more syncophants have chimed in. But since you have read it all before on a few occasions, in brief, one element of my posting style in reference to the recent nested post above (link) is:
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
...I like to make my posts self-explanatory, as if someone reading from the last post in a thread forward could understand the context of my post, so I include quotes expressing the entire “conversation.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
So that’s why I used several quotes to express the totality of this conversation.
and as usual,
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I have been an avid cyclist, as a lifestyle since about 1972...I happened serendipitously on Bike Forums in 2008, and it was frankly incredible to find a community that shared so many concerns I had kept to myself as a lone cyclist.

This enthusiasm has definitely increased my enjoyment of cycling. As far as improving it, what I have gotten directly from BF [include]…the opportunity to post and literally "journal" my thoughts and activities about cycling and lifestyle (even if nobody else reads them), but which I wouldn't write down otherwise...
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
Now of course, I’m gratified that other subscribers do read, and indeed reply to my posts.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
By nesting quote boxes, I indicate to the quoted subscriber(s) that I have read the post(s), reflected on the content, and extracted meaningful point(s), that I worked into a [contrived] quote chain...
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
(from a now-closed thread) I think that the use of quote boxes, which I have not seen elsewhere is a remarkable way to graphically diagram a dialogue.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
...Nonetheless, some subscribers get my style:
Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Sometimes I do too. (tldr) Other times I'll quickly find and read the "new" unquoted thoughts in the post to see what he's writing about. Either way, it's hardly difficult to deal with.

But, if he's quoted me, I'll almost always read the entire post, just because I'm curious to see where I fit in his virtual conversation.
Originally Posted by wphamilton View Post
At last I'm enshrined in a Jim from Boston quote chain, feels like the big time! Thank you....
Anyways that’s my style, and I’m sticking to it (after 6800 posts). Of course I would much rather post about bicycling topics relevant to the contemporaneous thread, as below. ↓↓↓

PS: I just re-read @I-Like-To-Bike's response to:
Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Right. I can't speak for others, but I already admitted that this particular crash would have been difficult to avoid in that final second. Also that it is rare.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
:Thanks for your replies, @mr.bill and @AlmostTrick.

Rare but it does happen.
Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
You might find that replies to your comments, which you seem overjoyed to receive and acknowledge, would be less rare if your posts were presented in a more readable, less jumbled format without the superfluous quoting of old posts.
"Rare" refers to the frequency of rear end collisions to cyclists, not the frequency of replies to my posts.

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 09-12-19 at 08:20 PM. Reason: added PS
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Old 09-12-19, 03:43 PM
  #223  
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Cyclist Rear Ended at 55mph
Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Having been hit from behind by a vehicle not so far in the distant past that video brings back some unpleasant memories for me. Luckily the car was only going about half the speed.

For those of you who think that you could have avoided such as situation if you were monitoring the rearward traffic using a mirror, I highly doubt that...
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
When I was hit from behind, it was on a wide, low-volume, well-lit residential road at about 9 PM in June, by a “distracted driver.” The route was so calm that I was not closely monitoring my rearward view.

In fact, though perhaps I could have ditched the bike, I’m glad I didn’t see it coming if I was going to get hit anyways...
Originally Posted by Unca_Sam View Post
Thankfully rare, unfortunately lethal. Most statistics I see give you a coin-flip's chance of surviving. It looks a whole lot better once you stack the probabilities, fortunately.

I know that I'd have a significant epinephrine release if I saw it coming, though. Odds are only slightly worse for Schroedinger's cat...
Both the rear end hits cited above were non-lethal...obviously, although,
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
...My first recollection was the assemblage of first responders with their vehicles to put me on a board to the nearest Hospital, with vivid memories after that, including airlift to a major Medical Center, the six week Hospital stay, and three-month rehab until I returned to work.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
...My main injury besides a few minor broken bones was a fractured sacrum. Weight bearing activities such as walking a distance and prolonged sitting are [still] uncomfortable, but fortunately sitting on the bike seat is OK, even for a few hours.

I also lost some upper thigh muscle due to a soft tissue injury and had a draining wound that made me dependent on someone to change my dressing until October [five months later].
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
"Do you really enjoy riding a bike?"

I describe my riding experience similarly, as a cycling lifestyle (of 40 years). I once listed as my credentials: a carbon fiber bike, year-round cycle-commuting, a cross-country tour, and a serious car-bike accident.
But don't cry for me, Argentina.

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 09-12-19 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 09-12-19, 03:58 PM
  #224  
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Originally Posted by mcours2006 View Post
Whenever a cyclist dies from a collision with a vehicle, often when it is reported in the news they will say things like the cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet, or that he was wearing dark clothing, or he did not have adequate lighting. This is wholly ridiculous of course, because it implies that had the cyclist been wearing a helmet, or had lights and hi-vis clothing he would have not have died. When news is reported this way it takes the responsibility off of the driver and places it squarely on the cyclists' shoulders, which is ridiculous.
So the guy/gal who exercises free choice (no one is forcing them) to (basically) stand on a busy roadway and NOT try to be as visible as possible and wear some sort of protective gear is 100% absolved from ANY responsibility whatsoever if they get smacked? Anyone who understands how eyes and brains work "in harmony" together know that it is a vastly imperfect system for seeing and digesting information, or concentrating like a fighter pilot 100% of the time.

So KNOWING that human perception is imperfect, motorists are distracted and stupid, darkness and rising/setting suns are blinding, road surfaces and markings vary greatly, and by the way - cyclists are imperfect humans as well. Knowing all of this and someone still decides to camp out on a busy highway of their own free will and gets clobbered - they bear ZERO responsibility. Hmmm I ain't buying that.
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Old 09-12-19, 04:49 PM
  #225  
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Originally Posted by JoeyBike View Post
So the guy/gal who exercises free choice (no one is forcing them) to (basically) stand on a busy roadway and NOT try to be as visible as possible and wear some sort of protective gear is 100% absolved from ANY responsibility whatsoever if they get smacked? Anyone who understands how eyes and brains work "in harmony" together know that it is a vastly imperfect system for seeing and digesting information, or concentrating like a fighter pilot 100% of the time.

So KNOWING that human perception is imperfect, motorists are distracted and stupid, darkness and rising/setting suns are blinding, road surfaces and markings vary greatly, and by the way - cyclists are imperfect humans as well. Knowing all of this and someone still decides to camp out on a busy highway of their own free will and gets clobbered - they bear ZERO responsibility. Hmmm I ain't buying that.
Not sure how you interpreted my post as such, but sure, go ahead and create your strawman to make your case.
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