Intelligent Speed Assistance
#151
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#152
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Why should anyone expect to be allowed to drive at a speed limit? Why is it that we feel the need to operate right at a limit and not a tad under it? It seems that we've lost the notion of what "limit" means. We've shifted it to mean "recommended speed."
My main wish is that cars would operate at slower speeds because they are much less likely to cause harm when they do. KE=1/2 mv² and all that.
And I've been part of dragging this off-topic bit on for too long, so that's the last I'll say on it.
My main wish is that cars would operate at slower speeds because they are much less likely to cause harm when they do. KE=1/2 mv² and all that.
And I've been part of dragging this off-topic bit on for too long, so that's the last I'll say on it.
The discrepancy leads to what speeding occurs and not a small amount of the road rage that results from letter of the law types juxtaposed with doing what comes naturally types. Strict adherence to 65 or 70mph on a road that is begging a driver to open up a bit ... well you see the results of that every evening on your local news channels. Driving through town you can be on a 15mph residential cul-de-sac one minute, A 25mph business district main street or a 20mph school zone (wut) or a 45 mph two lane blacktop in the next minute. Automated sytems can keep up with that but a human driver is cued by externals that inform how fast it is safe to operate!
Let's really get a grip and observe that even though the road you are on has a 35mph speed limit, the presence of road work crews, and accident, slower traffic ... any or all of these will have an effect on the speed that you can actually drive that stretch right now. My phone always knows what the speed limit is of streets that I am on. It is NOT reading the traffic signs. It is working off map data stored in a database and this information does go out of date. It's going to take a quantum leap forward in artificial intelligence before any automated driving system can govern the dynamics of the constantly changing environment a car (or bicycle) operates in. Honestly, I don't see it happening in our lifetimes.
Tesla's and Waymo's efforts notwithstanding, they aren't winning the race to actually put a self-driving car on the road that can pass the Turing Test. Not even close. Chat GPT is about what we've got and when Chat GPT 'hallucinates' the results are humorous. When a Model 3 hallucinates, the results can be dire. I'm a musician. A Classical Musician. The distinction is important. Classical musicians work from ... classics. Your success is built on how exactly you interpret the OG. Every now and then someone comes along that has the nervous system of a Hamster on Methamphetamine and can flat out destroy any existing speed record for the Chopin Etude in Ab, and instead of praise they are going to get serious hate from the cadre of concert pianists of 'standard' ability who just can't hang it over the edge like that.
Everyone in this thread that wants cars governed to the 'speed limit' is acting on those kinds of not wanting to see others go faster than they are able to, petty jealousy. IMO its not how fast you are going but how fast can you stop. When Diane Bish tears through the Bach Sinfonia to Cantata #29, I'm cheering her on. If it was full of slips and mistakes that would be one thing. But if its clean and perfectly executed, well good on her. Its the carelessness that kills, not the speed. Look at the length of this thread. Who knew there was so much to say on the issue of speed. Speed and speed limits are arbitrary. One city's 20mph is another city's 30mph.
In the part of Northwest Oregon, where I live, most of I5 has 55mph posted. At 60mph (56?) you are speeding. At 65 you are seriously hanging it out!! I took my wife, MIL and a friend up to Mt. St. Helen's up in Washington and we just couldn't understand why everyone was driving so fast! Oh ... 70mph speed limit, 75mph prevailing speed of traffic. That'll do it. When the governors come in, what speed would you want them set to? It's a serious question. I'd love to hear what speed should ALL of us drive on: Interstates, State Routes, Two Lane Blacktop, Business Arterials, Expressways ... etc. Let's see where we all come down on this. Should be interesting.
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#153
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You clearly have no sense of irony. You throw sarcasm at me but you don't equate your "everybody should feel the way I do about cars" with a sense of 'holier than thou"? You may not have a 'need for speed' but you MUST know that not all of your fellow mouth-breathers are so evolved, right? Well, even if you don't know, the trained professionals whose job it is to know, already do. So it will never happen. Speed governing of cars will only happen once they are fully autonomous.
#154
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I don't?
I don't?
How is "everybody should feel the way I do about X" different than "I think X is correct"?
Correcter than though at least, holier would depend on if there's a moral component. I'm pretty sure I've got less 'holier than thou' going on than thou. Would that make you " 'holier than thou' than thou" ?
Yes. That's why I started this thread, to spread the word.
Evolution hasn't happened yet, so it will never happen?
I'm fine with that too, but that's kind of another thread. If you want to continue teaming up with ILTB to **** on me about that, you can go over here.
You throw sarcasm at me but you don't equate
your "everybody should feel the way I do about cars"
with a sense of 'holier than thou"?
You may not have a 'need for speed' but you MUST know that not all of your fellow mouth-breathers are so evolved, right?
Well, even if you don't know, the trained professionals whose job it is to know, already do. So it will never happen.
Speed governing of cars will only happen once they are fully autonomous.
Last edited by RubeRad; 12-22-23 at 12:54 PM.
#155
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When the governors come in, what speed would you want them set to? It's a serious question. I'd love to hear what speed should ALL of us drive on: Interstates, State Routes, Two Lane Blacktop, Business Arterials, Expressways ... etc. Let's see where we all come down on this. Should be interesting.
#156
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I don't?
I don't?
How is "everybody should feel the way I do about X" different than "I think X is correct"?
Correcter than though at least, holier would depend on if there's a moral component. I'm pretty sure I've got less 'holier than thou' going on than thou. Would that make you " 'holier than thou' than thou" ?
Yes. That's why I started this thread, to spread the word.
Evolution hasn't happened yet, so it will never happen?
I'm fine with that too, but that's kind of another thread. If you want to continue teaming up with ILTB to **** on me about that, you can go over here.
I don't?
How is "everybody should feel the way I do about X" different than "I think X is correct"?
Correcter than though at least, holier would depend on if there's a moral component. I'm pretty sure I've got less 'holier than thou' going on than thou. Would that make you " 'holier than thou' than thou" ?
Yes. That's why I started this thread, to spread the word.
Evolution hasn't happened yet, so it will never happen?
I'm fine with that too, but that's kind of another thread. If you want to continue teaming up with ILTB to **** on me about that, you can go over here.
This thread is long overdue (about since post one) to be redirected to Foo or P&R oblivion.
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You used the word “nonsense” earlier and what you have said here is indeed nonsense.
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This has the law of unintended consequences written all over it.
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even if a police officer were to pull over someone, take extra time to conduct business, that is driving less than 5 mph in going over the posted speed limit to issue a warning might bring about some benefits to the local area.
If enough time is "wasted" issuing that warning, the speeders might either slow it down or gain a bigger offense to try & battle in court.
If enough time is "wasted" issuing that warning, the speeders might either slow it down or gain a bigger offense to try & battle in court.
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even if a police officer were to pull over someone, take extra time to conduct business, that is driving less than 5 mph in going over the posted speed limit to issue a warning might bring about some benefits to the local area.
If enough time is "wasted" issuing that warning, the speeders might either slow it down or gain a bigger offense to try & battle in court.
If enough time is "wasted" issuing that warning, the speeders might either slow it down or gain a bigger offense to try & battle in court.
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rather than let the folks that drive 5 to 10 over keep doing what they do, pull them over & take 20 minutes or longer to issue the warning before the traffic stop is wrapped up. If the perp decides to be a bag of Ds, issue a ticket instead of the warning.
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#162
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Okay. Is the goal to waste the driver's time or the cop's time?
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Over here the tickets are issued by mail. There is no stopping involved unless you are doing something reckless. If you drive 5 over in a 30 zone you get a ticket. I set my adaptive cruise max at 10% over, so 33 in a 30. I do dial it down to 30 or less when approaching pedestrians etc out of respect for the limit.
It’s not a bad system overall and you can’t really complain if you get a speeding ticket because you would have to be clearly over the limit by 10% +2.
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That sounds like 20 minutes of wasted police time.
Over here the tickets are issued by mail. There is no stopping involved unless you are doing something reckless. If you drive 5 over in a 30 zone you get a ticket. I set my adaptive cruise max at 10% over, so 33 in a 30. I do dial it down to 30 or less when approaching pedestrians etc out of respect for the limit.
It’s not a bad system overall and you can’t really complain if you get a speeding ticket because you would have to be clearly over the limit by 10% +2.
Over here the tickets are issued by mail. There is no stopping involved unless you are doing something reckless. If you drive 5 over in a 30 zone you get a ticket. I set my adaptive cruise max at 10% over, so 33 in a 30. I do dial it down to 30 or less when approaching pedestrians etc out of respect for the limit.
It’s not a bad system overall and you can’t really complain if you get a speeding ticket because you would have to be clearly over the limit by 10% +2.
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Speed limit enforcement is more of a technical challenge. Cameras have proven to be far more effective than humans in this task. That's why cameras are now literally everywhere across the UK and most of Europe and you are far more likely to get a speeding ticket than 30 years ago. They are getting ever more sophisticated with smart average speed cameras, so you can't just hit the brakes as you pass them. Come and drive across London or any other big city here and see how it works.
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Actually it is more of a recruitment/available worker issue than funding. All big cities are finding that there simply aren't enough people willing to do ANYTHING in the numbers that they were pre-Covid. My transit system has had a signing bonus of $7500 (up from $2500) and they have raised the hourly wage three times. It's now $28/hr. and they still are short of bus/train operators. Critically short. The police dept. is short hundreds of officers and there simply aren't enough people without criminal records and/or the willingness to work among the increasingly violent and unhinged populace (same reason bus/train operators shy away) to staff the system properly.
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I've been easily influenced by this thread apparently. Today on the highway, I tried setting my cruise control to 10% over the posted limit. I was still getting passed, just not as much as when I set it to the limit.
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#173
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Speed limit enforcement is more of a technical challenge. Cameras have proven to be far more effective than humans in this task. That's why cameras are now literally everywhere across the UK and most of Europe and you are far more likely to get a speeding ticket than 30 years ago. They are getting ever more sophisticated with smart average speed cameras, so you can't just hit the brakes as you pass them. Come and drive across London or any other big city here and see how it works.
#174
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Awareness does influence behaviors. That's why they put unmanned, non-ticket-giving, information-only speed-gun mph signs on the sides of roads. Just seeing their speed shown to them from an external source makes drivers slow down.
#175
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Last year driving around Florida (after a long gap) was educational - some drivers with their fancy sports cars go around criss-crossing lanes like they are in a Hollywood movie. Fortunately, you ca hear them coming because of the very loud buzzing sounds. And hope that they will change lane at least a few yards from rear end… not much you can do about it. There are rarely any cops around when that happens. May be it’s my age speaking…