Hooked wheel question
12-12-23, 10:02 PM
#51
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12-12-23, 10:14 PM
#52
ignominious poltroon
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I just sent them a long email 😁 I hope they respond with a clear and concise explanation and not some technical mumbo-jumbo that will only leave me doubting my safety on descends. For now, I firmly believe that even a "semi hooked wheel" is a lot safer than a hookless. Again, I'll keep you all posted.
I wound up getting fully hooked carbon rims for my wife from LightBicycle, but then got her gravel rims for half price from Reserve.
12-12-23, 10:15 PM
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I get that some posters feel a need to describe their vast cycling experience to the rest of us. But how can such a person not know that the answer to the second question is “it depends”? He’s being disingenuous.
12-12-23, 10:19 PM
#54
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Oh that's right you mentioned you lived by their Showroom! Where is that by the way? I live in Oakland. If they aren't too far from here I'd love to go and check it out.
12-12-23, 10:26 PM
#55
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It is in Santa Cruz, on the West Side, very close to Wilder Ranch State Park. You can demo bikes and ride them in Wilder.
12-12-23, 10:29 PM
#56
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12-12-23, 10:31 PM
#57
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12-12-23, 10:34 PM
#58
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Huh? The glued on tires I'm referring to are what I ride. Sewups. Yes I am perfectly aware tubeless tires are not glued on. Hence my question - can a well ridden tubeless tire come off a semi-hooked rim if it blows out while the rider is going mountain descent fast? I'm not asking about glued tires at all. Properly glued, they simply don't come off. Hence I ride them. Care to answer my question?
12-12-23, 11:07 PM
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I know there are a lot of people that have never had issues with hookless. There are, however, enough people that have had issues for me to stay away from them. One guy on YouTube made a perfect point about why hookless don't belong on road bikes. He said that airplane tires and car tires have been tubeless for a long time, but the beads they use are so strong and stiff that you need a huge machine to put them on and they don't go in with your hands like road bike tires. He also said that those huge tires have a metal wire in their beads to further strengthen the bead and make them safe.
More power to you for trusting hookless but in the mean time, I don't.
More power to you for trusting hookless but in the mean time, I don't.
Unfortunately while taking that hammer to some tire/rim combos would be very therapeutic in the short term to beat a carbon rim into submission, there might be some regrets later
12-12-23, 11:15 PM
#60
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12-12-23, 11:19 PM
#61
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I ended up with some hookless MTB rims by accident, the price was cheap enough they weren't worth sending back. My distrust of hookless involves a lot of tire blow offs that left my ears ringing every time, but I figured I'd try them. For my kid's bike I installed the plain factory tires since they were new enough figuring the steel bead wouldn't stretch. I had to run a tube since they're no tubeless compatible but the tire remaining in place hasn't mattered, but I would agree, what works well at 25psi on a mtb isn't something I'm willing to trust either at 80psi on a road bike.
Unfortunately while taking that hammer to some tire/rim combos would be very therapeutic in the short term to beat a carbon rim into submission, there might be some regrets later
Unfortunately while taking that hammer to some tire/rim combos would be very therapeutic in the short term to beat a carbon rim into submission, there might be some regrets later
And yes, I'm sure it'd be nice to beat the hell out of some carbon rims and have the hammer be the one that needed replacement instead. We can't be weight weenies and have things be indestructible too though 🤣
12-12-23, 11:41 PM
#62
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The Reserve 35|35 is your ultra-reliable training partner, your KOM-grabber, and your week in, week out workhorse wheelset. Deep enough to offer aerodynamic advantages but still shallow enough for predictable handling on blustery spring days, it truly is one of Reserve's most versatile wheelsets. The 21mm internal width will work equally well with 25mm race tires and or 35mm training tires, and the traditional bead hook means the wheels can happily be set up tubeless or with tubes
12-12-23, 11:44 PM
#63
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12-12-23, 11:56 PM
#64
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If semi-hooked is as blowout proof as hooked, then I made an excellent choice in buying these wheels 😁
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12-13-23, 04:04 AM
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Huh? The glued on tires I'm referring to are what I ride. Sewups. Yes I am perfectly aware tubeless tires are not glued on. Hence my question - can a well ridden tubeless tire come off a semi-hooked rim if it blows out while the rider is going mountain descent fast? I'm not asking about glued tires at all. Properly glued, they simply don't come off. Hence I ride them. Care to answer my question?
You could always run liners for extra run-flat protection like some of the pros now do for races like Paris Roubaix.
12-13-23, 05:17 AM
#66
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I have the same wheelset, and run 32 Conti GP5000s tubeless without worry. Enjoy your new bike!
Untitled by Jeff Walther, on Flickr
Untitled by Jeff Walther, on Flickr
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12-13-23, 05:40 AM
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Huh? The glued on tires I'm referring to are what I ride. Sewups. Yes I am perfectly aware tubeless tires are not glued on. Hence my question - can a well ridden tubeless tire come off a semi-hooked rim if it blows out while the rider is going mountain descent fast? I'm not asking about glued tires at all. Properly glued, they simply don't come off. Hence I ride them. Care to answer my question?
That was in 1967, though, years before you started racing, and was a one-off, just like your clincher that came off the rim. It didn't put me off riding tubulars forever.
About 15 years ago, I hit a raised metal expansion joint on a bridge at stupid speed and flatted both clinchers. I tried to ride on the flat tires to get to the nearest phone, half a mile away, but the rear tire rolled off the rim after 100 yards or so. No big deal.
The likelihood that I would eventually split another tubular tire was approximately zero. Never happened again, in the subsequent 20-plus years of racing and training before I moved on from tubulars. I could have sworn off tubulars forever, of course, but I knew that many thousands of racers had been riding tubular tires for decades, so I went with the percentages.
Many millions---if not billions---of riders have used clincher tires to ride many, many billions of miles---far more than the total miles ridden on tubulars. The number of riders who have rolled clinchers off a rim at speed with catastrophic results must be vanishingly small.
How did I arrive at that conclusion? Given the propensity of Bike Forums posters to repeat themselves ad infinitum whenever a topic is broached that reminds them of their favorite bugbear, if there are any here who have had it happen---besides you, I mean---we'd hear no end of it.
You could argue that some or most of those who rolled their clinchers off the rim were killed and thus were unable to complain. Of course, the same argument could be made regarding catastrophic failures of tubulars.
Yes, it's theoretically possible that you could lose another clincher. My guess, based on my experience, is that a catastrophic failure of one of your tubulars is just as likely. Once-in-a-lifetime occurrences are just that.
By the way, aren't you the guy who had a steel fork fail and consequently decided never to trust a carbon fork? Apologies if I'm remembering that incorrectly.
Last edited by Trakhak; 12-13-23 at 07:15 AM.
12-13-23, 08:48 AM
#68
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I had a Pirelli Gran Premio tubular tire whose stitching failed---a section of the tire blew apart and immediately jammed in the brake. Luckily for me, I was walking the bike at the time. Had I been on a mountain descent---!!!
That was in 1967, though, years before you started racing, and was a one-off, just like your clincher that came off the rim. It didn't put me off riding tubulars forever.
About 15 years ago, I hit a raised metal expansion joint on a bridge at stupid speed and flatted both clinchers. I tried to ride on the flat tires to get to the nearest phone, half a mile away, but the rear tire rolled off the rim after 100 yards or so. No big deal.
The likelihood that I would eventually split another tubular tire was approximately zero. Never happened again, in the subsequent 20-plus years of racing and training before I moved on from tubulars. I could have sworn off tubulars forever, of course, but I knew that many thousands of racers had been riding tubular tires for decades, so I went with the percentages.
Many millions---if not billions---of riders have used clincher tires to ride many, many billions of miles---far more than the total miles ridden on tubulars. The number of riders who have rolled clinchers off a rim at speed with catastrophic results must be vanishingly small.
How did I arrive at that conclusion? Given the propensity of Bike Forums posters to repeat themselves ad infinitum whenever a topic is broached that reminds them of their favorite bugbear, if there are any here who have had it happen---besides you, I mean---we'd hear no end of it.
You could argue that some or most of those who rolled their clinchers off the rim were killed and thus were unable to complain. Of course, the same argument could be made regarding catastrophic failures of tubulars.
Yes, it's theoretically possible that you could lose another clincher. My guess, based on my experience, is that a catastrophic failure of one of your tubulars is just as likely. Once-in-a-lifetime occurrences are just that.
By the way, aren't you the guy who had a steel fork fail and consequently decided never to trust a carbon fork? Apologies if I'm remembering that incorrectly.
That was in 1967, though, years before you started racing, and was a one-off, just like your clincher that came off the rim. It didn't put me off riding tubulars forever.
About 15 years ago, I hit a raised metal expansion joint on a bridge at stupid speed and flatted both clinchers. I tried to ride on the flat tires to get to the nearest phone, half a mile away, but the rear tire rolled off the rim after 100 yards or so. No big deal.
The likelihood that I would eventually split another tubular tire was approximately zero. Never happened again, in the subsequent 20-plus years of racing and training before I moved on from tubulars. I could have sworn off tubulars forever, of course, but I knew that many thousands of racers had been riding tubular tires for decades, so I went with the percentages.
Many millions---if not billions---of riders have used clincher tires to ride many, many billions of miles---far more than the total miles ridden on tubulars. The number of riders who have rolled clinchers off a rim at speed with catastrophic results must be vanishingly small.
How did I arrive at that conclusion? Given the propensity of Bike Forums posters to repeat themselves ad infinitum whenever a topic is broached that reminds them of their favorite bugbear, if there are any here who have had it happen---besides you, I mean---we'd hear no end of it.
You could argue that some or most of those who rolled their clinchers off the rim were killed and thus were unable to complain. Of course, the same argument could be made regarding catastrophic failures of tubulars.
Yes, it's theoretically possible that you could lose another clincher. My guess, based on my experience, is that a catastrophic failure of one of your tubulars is just as likely. Once-in-a-lifetime occurrences are just that.
By the way, aren't you the guy who had a steel fork fail and consequently decided never to trust a carbon fork? Apologies if I'm remembering that incorrectly.
12-13-23, 08:56 AM
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I was drafted to do it once, and found that about every fifth tire was barely glued. One guy had glued his front tire on just that morning. He whined about it when the official pulled him from the race.
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12-13-23, 08:58 AM
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12-13-23, 09:39 AM
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Yea the only wider than a 28 is a 30 is the tan wall
12-13-23, 11:19 AM
#72
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I had a Pirelli Gran Premio tubular tire whose stitching failed---a section of the tire blew apart and immediately jammed in the brake. Luckily for me, I was walking the bike at the time. Had I been on a mountain descent---!!!
That was in 1967, though, years before you started racing, and was a one-off, just like your clincher that came off the rim. It didn't put me off riding tubulars forever.
About 15 years ago, I hit a raised metal expansion joint on a bridge at stupid speed and flatted both clinchers. I tried to ride on the flat tires to get to the nearest phone, half a mile away, but the rear tire rolled off the rim after 100 yards or so. No big deal.
The likelihood that I would eventually split another tubular tire was approximately zero. Never happened again, in the subsequent 20-plus years of racing and training before I moved on from tubulars. I could have sworn off tubulars forever, of course, but I knew that many thousands of racers had been riding tubular tires for decades, so I went with the percentages.
Many millions---if not billions---of riders have used clincher tires to ride many, many billions of miles---far more than the total miles ridden on tubulars. The number of riders who have rolled clinchers off a rim at speed with catastrophic results must be vanishingly small.
How did I arrive at that conclusion? Given the propensity of Bike Forums posters to repeat themselves ad infinitum whenever a topic is broached that reminds them of their favorite bugbear, if there are any here who have had it happen---besides you, I mean---we'd hear no end of it.
You could argue that some or most of those who rolled their clinchers off the rim were killed and thus were unable to complain. Of course, the same argument could be made regarding catastrophic failures of tubulars.
Yes, it's theoretically possible that you could lose another clincher. My guess, based on my experience, is that a catastrophic failure of one of your tubulars is just as likely. Once-in-a-lifetime occurrences are just that.
By the way, aren't you the guy who had a steel fork fail and consequently decided never to trust a carbon fork? Apologies if I'm remembering that incorrectly.
That was in 1967, though, years before you started racing, and was a one-off, just like your clincher that came off the rim. It didn't put me off riding tubulars forever.
About 15 years ago, I hit a raised metal expansion joint on a bridge at stupid speed and flatted both clinchers. I tried to ride on the flat tires to get to the nearest phone, half a mile away, but the rear tire rolled off the rim after 100 yards or so. No big deal.
The likelihood that I would eventually split another tubular tire was approximately zero. Never happened again, in the subsequent 20-plus years of racing and training before I moved on from tubulars. I could have sworn off tubulars forever, of course, but I knew that many thousands of racers had been riding tubular tires for decades, so I went with the percentages.
Many millions---if not billions---of riders have used clincher tires to ride many, many billions of miles---far more than the total miles ridden on tubulars. The number of riders who have rolled clinchers off a rim at speed with catastrophic results must be vanishingly small.
How did I arrive at that conclusion? Given the propensity of Bike Forums posters to repeat themselves ad infinitum whenever a topic is broached that reminds them of their favorite bugbear, if there are any here who have had it happen---besides you, I mean---we'd hear no end of it.
You could argue that some or most of those who rolled their clinchers off the rim were killed and thus were unable to complain. Of course, the same argument could be made regarding catastrophic failures of tubulars.
Yes, it's theoretically possible that you could lose another clincher. My guess, based on my experience, is that a catastrophic failure of one of your tubulars is just as likely. Once-in-a-lifetime occurrences are just that.
By the way, aren't you the guy who had a steel fork fail and consequently decided never to trust a carbon fork? Apologies if I'm remembering that incorrectly.
I may be unique or simply a coward but bad crashes from equipment failure leave me unable to enjoy similar equipment later without the constant "what if ..." running through my mind. Forks. That second failure; caused by a combination of Columbus SL blades, a crown without scallops and nickle plating without a post-plating heat treat, not a mistake I will ever make again. Still, I feel much more secure on a painted 531 fork with a deeply scalloped crown. And CF where an unseen crack could be, either from quality issues at manufacture or an event later in its life - well, after losing 10 years of my life and most of my profession from that crack in the aluminum fork - no thanks.
Another aspect is that I am getting older. I break bones more easily. (And my many hours on a bike are certainly a major factor in the bone density loss I am reminded by every X-ray technician.) Also the consequences of a major life-changing crash I know way too well. I do not want to live through the next. My inquiries here are to best inform myself of options going forward should the tubulars that have served me so well disappear. What I have gathered so far is that the very skinny tired early 80s race bike I love probably is not a candidate for tubeless and peace of mind. Shame. It is the best downhill bike I have ever ridden.
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12-13-23, 11:54 AM
#73
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I used to crawl into burning buildings wearing a Carbon Fiber SCBA air tank, running around 5000 PSI. Yes, we had them inspected regularly. You can have a fork inspected as well. Or buy from a reputable manufacturer. I have zero concerns about the quality of the carbon fork on my Time.
12-13-23, 12:35 PM
#74
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12-13-23, 12:43 PM
#75
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