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Road brifters + MTB hydro brake ?

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Road brifters + MTB hydro brake ?

Old 08-27-16, 01:59 PM
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Celika
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Road brifters + MTB hydro brake ?

Hello

I'm sure I'm not the 1st to think to this, but I wonder why there is no more exemples of it on the net. To connect the brake cable from road brifter to a MTB hydraulic brake, to have a powerfull an rather cheap brake upgrade on a disc road bike or gravel/CX. Like here:

https://www.lfgss.com/comments/9386609/
https://www.lfgss.com/conversations/246792/

There is 3 problem I see:
1-possibility that the MTB lever broke, or the cable connection
2-22.2 MTB bar diameter VS ~23.8 road (or 26/31.8 on central)
3-more weight than just a mechanical brake

But, for me (personnal opinion):
1-it's possible to made a connector without drill the lever (or with a lot of reinforcement), and if cable broke there is always the MTB lever to use (like CX additionnal lever), even if it's not really usefull on an emergency braking
2-it's just about ~1,6 mm at diameter, possible to grind with a dremel and I don't guess it will weaken that much the lever (depending of the model), sadly it would be hard to put it on central part of dropbar. There is some people using grinded MTB thumb****fter on road bar.
3-ehhh... more weight, yep , but not that much looking at the efficience of hydro brake

So, do you see others problems or cons-indications ? Some advice ? I would be happy to have others point of view .
I dislike to make Mcgyver-like hack on brakes, as it's pretty essential for safety, but have hydro brakes while keeping the normal brifters, and furthermore get additionnal levers, seems cool for me.
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Old 08-27-16, 02:22 PM
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There are adapters made for that purpose. Rather sleek boxes that go below the stem. The only one I remember straight off was called a "doppelmoppel".
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Old 08-27-16, 02:27 PM
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Yep, i've seen some cable => hydro adapter, but pretty expensive (~150-200€).
There is hybrid cable/hydro brake too, like the TRP (about 100€/brake). It's basicaly the same than a hydro sytem compacted into a caliper, actuated by the cable.
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Old 08-27-16, 02:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
I'm sure I'm not the 1st to think to this, but I wonder why there is no more exemples of it on the net.
Well, can think of a few reasons -

It's ugly - There are better looking commercially options available, Hope do a converter box to start with - V-Twin or mechanical to hydraulic calipers like TRP HY-RD

The levers need adapters / machining to get them to fit( the levers are 22.2mm, where they are clamped on the handlebar in the image looks to be at the 31.8mm section), that's more work than most riders are able to do with out access to a machine shop/power tools.

The components (the Shimano disc brakes) in the image are several generations old, pre-mainstream road disc acceptance/availability, and they aren't readily available anymore. Also, that generation of Shimano disc brakes had some issue with temps (below zero) and the lever going wooden.
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Old 08-28-16, 03:09 PM
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Thanks for your answer

Personnaly I rather like the look it gives to bike, some mad Max style , but taste and colours ...

Seems the bar on the pic is a 26mm (no OS at the center, and anyway grind the lever to 31.8 would be pretty hard/impossible), as tools a milling machine or a press drill + adapted bit would be top of course, but a dremel + some sand paper cylindres + about 1,5 hour should be enough.

I don't think the model of brakes are that important, as long as the lever is far enough from bar to place the cable stop behind. But thanks for information about this model.
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Old 08-28-16, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
There is hybrid cable/hydro brake too, like the TRP (about 100/brake). It's basicaly the same than a hydro sytem compacted into a caliper, actuated by the cable.
Sorry, but it's not basically the same. The selling point, of course, is to get near-full-hydraulic brake performance even if you are using brake levers with cables. The reality is that it's not much like a full hydraulic brake system in the way it performs, feels, etc. It's not necessarily a bad brake, but it's more like a cable actuated disc brake than a full hydraulic brake in regard to performance.
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Old 08-29-16, 01:52 AM
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Or you could just buy hydraulic levers...
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Old 08-29-16, 08:31 AM
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The main companies are now making a Brifter with a Master-cylander on them and the Mechanical shifter too.

So the Cable to Hydraulic Under the stem converters are getting phased out.

TRP has had one, Hope UK, and Trickstuff DE.
Now The Combination of Gevenalle modified TRP Hylex Hydraulic Masters and a Indexed lever on the front
is being offered .


https://gevenalle.com/product/hydraulic/



But if you are un willing to pay the Current Market costs of your desires, Quench those wishes




and get something else with in your Budget dropping the Hydro part, likely, would be the first to Go.


the Same company Makes a Regular set cable brake & Shifter ..














./.

Last edited by fietsbob; 08-31-16 at 07:44 AM.
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Old 08-30-16, 11:04 AM
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@well biked: of course it's not as good as a full hydro, but you get double piston system, better to tune.
@gsa103 and Fiesbob: it's the easyest way, but rather expensive (about 300 at least for the pair of brifters), while you can get a used pair of ultegra brifters + a brand new complete system of hydro deore for ~130: it's why I was thinking about this assembly.

Another way to have the MTB lever without grind them could be to use some extender like that

and put a MTB old handlebar in. But much more ugly, and less ergonomic (levers are more far from principal handlebar).

Last edited by Celika; 08-30-16 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 09-16-16, 01:34 PM
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Hello

No other point of view ?...
Thanks
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Old 09-16-16, 01:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
Hello

No other point of view ?...
Thanks
The thread is almost a month old now, and until you bumped it, was well off the 1st page, like most forums, once it's off the first page, it's not likely to get many/any more replys (till someone re-resurrects this thread in 10 years time).

I think it had all the comments it was going to get, it's a pretty unusual question (as in very few people are ever going to use this setup), which has been well answered in this post.
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Old 09-16-16, 01:48 PM
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Compile the Hydraulic Engineering data..You need the fluid displacement data on the Master Cylinder end

and the application volume requirement on the slave end.

Your turn, do the research.
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Old 09-16-16, 02:03 PM
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Originally Posted by well biked View Post
Sorry, but it's not basically the same. The selling point, of course, is to get near-full-hydraulic brake performance even if you are using brake levers with cables. The reality is that it's not much like a full hydraulic brake system in the way it performs, feels, etc. It's not necessarily a bad brake, but it's more like a cable actuated disc brake than a full hydraulic brake in regard to performance.
They are more like hydraulic brakes than cable actuated brakes if set up correctly with compressionless housing. I am currently using both on the gravel bike and cyclocross. The brake force required and modulation is more similar to full hydraulic road levers. The self adjusting pads are more similar to hydraulic. Those only real difference is in weight. Whereas mechanical discs need constant adjustment to get full stopping power and prevent noise.
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Old 09-16-16, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
I'm sure I'm not the 1st to think to this, but I wonder why there is no more exemples of it on the net.
A bike shop in Switzerland used to do that sort of conversion a few years back.

Archived web page: https://web.archive.org/web/20110908...konverter.html


Maybe they still do it: https://www.dbikes.de/?rub=11&id=29&pg=det

Last edited by cobba; 09-16-16 at 07:43 PM.
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Old 09-17-16, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
Hello

No other point of view ?...
Thanks
I didn't see what you had done the first time through. I like it, the cost of MTB hydro brakes is very reasonable.

How is the modulation?
Did you experiment with both pull ratios for the mechanical brake levers?
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Old 09-18-16, 02:49 AM
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Sorry, I guess there is a misunderstanding, I haven't done the sytem for yet, just planned to do it but I would like to be sure before sacrifice a pair of brake lever and possibly make something dangerous. The idea seems so "basic" that I wonder if there is not a problem that I haven't see.

@cobba: thanks for the link, it's interesting to see that a shop have done that (but right now it's better to buy a pair of hydro brifter looking at the price ).
Following it, I've found this page:Cannondale F4 frame equipped with Campagnolo/Shimano/Grimeca/Formula/Miche components and a carbon rigid disc fork on velospace, the place for bikes ; the result is pretty strange but look like it work (brakes actuated by derailleur cable ).

@jimc101: sometimes a topic fall far away from 1st page, and maybe people concerned with it not always search in other pages, so maybe an UP could be interesting.
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Old 09-18-16, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Celika View Post
@jimc101: sometimes a topic fall far away from 1st page, and maybe people concerned with it not always search in other pages, so maybe an UP could be interesting.
That's the nature of forums, that if a topic falls off the first page, there will be less interest, unless you can change this, that's the way it will be.
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Old 09-18-16, 09:55 AM
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Personally, I wouldn't do it. What happens in a panic if you grab the wrong brake levers (i.e., the road ones that have been disabled)? You can get hydraulic road levers for about $250 now.

Shimano RS685 Road Disc Brake | Chain Reaction Cycles
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Old 09-18-16, 10:39 AM
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Check Santana Tandems.

Way back in the late 90's Santana had a disc brake master cylinder that connected via a cable to a brifter brake lever. If they still have a supply of the parts, they are not going to be cheap and, if you like a clean minimalistic look, this ain't gonna be it.
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Old 09-18-16, 10:40 AM
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@wgscott: Why disable a brake lever ? The big idea is to use both the MTB and road lever (like a CX additionnal brake lever), depending on the position you have on the handlebar.

@Retro Grouch: it's near to the TRP Parabox and co ? Funny to see that the idea is not new !

Last edited by Celika; 09-18-16 at 10:47 AM.
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