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Stan's Grail from Performance Bikes

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Stan's Grail from Performance Bikes

Old 01-07-19, 10:30 AM
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Gladius
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Stan's Grail from Performance Bikes

Searched, but unfortunately 'grail' comes up in a lot of threads...
After the third busted spoke on my Bontragers, I'm looking at the Stan's Grail MK3 wheelset to replace my current wheels on my Boone. As Performance is going out of business my local outlet has a set of their version of the Grail MK3 at a great price, but it's got different hubs and a different spoke count than the Grail MK3 on Stan's website 32 spokes vs the 28 on Stans' site). While I actually like the higher spoke count, I'm concerned that the hubs are low quality.

Has anyone purchased the Performance version of these wheels? Any feedback on the hubs? They are non-branded.

Additionally, the Stans rear wheel is a 12x142 thru axle, while my bike has a rear QR skewer. I see some adapters on the Stans site; am I correct that these adapters can be used on these wheels? Anyone with experience doing this?

Last edited by Gladius; 01-07-19 at 10:31 AM. Reason: typo
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Old 01-07-19, 10:46 AM
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Is it even for sale any more? The adapters are hub specific so make sure you have the right ones.

edit: How much was it at your store?
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Old 01-07-19, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Elvo View Post
Is it even for sale any more? The adapters are hub specific so make sure you have the right ones.

edit: How much was it at your store?
The Grail MK3 is for sale all over the place.
This Performance store is having a store closing sale. Everything is 30% off so they are 30% off the in-store price of $599. I'm sure this is the only set of these wheels they have, I'd have to buy off the shelf.
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Old 01-07-19, 11:52 AM
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You can convert the axle or use a thru axle QR https://www.jensonusa.com/DT-Swiss-R...-Quick-Release
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Old 01-07-19, 12:23 PM
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Make sure that they actually ring up as $599 before you decide to buy. I have gone to two difference PB closing sales and both times the items I wanted to purchase were ringing up more than the price on the tag before the discount was applied. For example I got a replacement camelbak insulated hose and the tag said 17.99 before the 30% off discount but when I went to pay for it the register was ringing it up at 21.99 before discount. Then they fed me some BS that it's 30% off the full price which is nowhere to be found on any tag. I still got the hose for $15 after tax which is cheaper than the original price sure but it's no where near the 30% off they advertise.

Their whole store closing "deals" are just one huge ripoff IMO.

Also I saw those Grails at a the shop. They basically use cheap hubs to have it at that price. For $600 you are in custom wheel territory with dt swiss rims, spokes and hubs of choice like Hopes.
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Old 01-07-19, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by gus6464 View Post
Make sure that they actually ring up as $599 before you decide to buy. I have gone to two difference PB closing sales and both times the items I wanted to purchase were ringing up more than the price on the tag before the discount was applied. For example I got a replacement camelbak insulated hose and the tag said 17.99 before the 30% off discount but when I went to pay for it the register was ringing it up at 21.99 before discount. Then they fed me some BS that it's 30% off the full price which is nowhere to be found on any tag. I still got the hose for $15 after tax which is cheaper than the original price sure but it's no where near the 30% off they advertise.

Their whole store closing "deals" are just one huge ripoff IMO.

Also I saw those Grails at a the shop. They basically use cheap hubs to have it at that price. For $600 you are in custom wheel territory with dt swiss rims, spokes and hubs of choice like Hopes.
Do you have a suggested place to look at custom wheel building? Or do I need to find someone local?
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Old 01-07-19, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
Do you have a suggested place to look at custom wheel building? Or do I need to find someone local?
Find a local shop. I have found local shops in my area that charge as little as $60 per wheel to build.
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Old 01-07-19, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
Do you have a suggested place to look at custom wheel building? Or do I need to find someone local?
prowheelbuilder.com

you can choose the rim, hub, spokes, and nipples. The wheels will arrive a few weeks later.
Excellent build- properly trued and tensioned and very well packed for shipping. I have a set of road wheels from them with Bitex hubs, double butted spokes, and Archetype rims and love em. I intended to build the wheels myself, but it cost no more for them to be built. Cant say enough about them.

Bitex hubs are really good quality for the price. Good weight, good bearings, good price. Get some Sapim Laser double butted spokes and whatever rim(H Plus Son Hydra for example) you want and you are gold!
https://www.prowheelbuilder.com/bite...t-package.html

-----Bitex 6 bolt QR hubs, Sapim Laser spokes, brass nipples, and Hydra rims in 28f/32r end up costing $480 and weigh 1600g. You can change the spoke count on both wheels too so it fits your size and riding need. A cursory look shows thats slightly lighter and cheaper than the Stans set you are considering.

There is this set for $410 too. Not sure the weight and no experience with the rim, but call them and they will go over all that. Really easy to work with. https://www.prowheelbuilder.com/bite...t-package.html
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Old 01-07-19, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
Do you have a suggested place to look at custom wheel building? Or do I need to find someone local?
If you need a reference, I used this guy. He is an independent wheel builder (small business) who has a passion for the sport. He knows what he is doing and treated me right.
https://www.facebook.com/millcitycycle/
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Old 01-07-19, 02:03 PM
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prowheelbuilder.com

DT Swiss XR361 rims 28H both (3x front and rear)
Hope Pro4 front and rear hubs
DT Swiss competition spokes and nipples

$674.88 before 8% off coupon

That's not bad. Although I would call them up about the XR361 as the rims come with Squorx nipples in the box so they don't need to charge you extra for them. The XR361 is an asymmetric rim.
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Old 01-07-19, 04:14 PM
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Now that you guys have me looking at custom wheels, is there any reason I wouldn't go with centerlock disc rotor? My current wheels are 6-bolt, but I intend to keep those discs on those wheels and get new ones for these wheels. I assume other than the mounting points on the hub, that both types of discs would fit in my calipers the same way? Or is that not true?
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Old 01-07-19, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
Now that you guys have me looking at custom wheels, is there any reason I wouldn't go with centerlock disc rotor? My current wheels are 6-bolt, but I intend to keep those discs on those wheels and get new ones for these wheels. I assume other than the mounting points on the hub, that both types of discs would fit in my calipers the same way? Or is that not true?
Yeah you can go with centerlock no problem. CL hubs also come with adapters in case you want to use 6-bolt as well.
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Old 01-07-19, 05:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
Now that you guys have me looking at custom wheels, is there any reason I wouldn't go with centerlock disc rotor? My current wheels are 6-bolt, but I intend to keep those discs on those wheels and get new ones for these wheels. I assume other than the mounting points on the hub, that both types of discs would fit in my calipers the same way? Or is that not true?
Centerlock seems more elegant in my opinion and you can always use a 6 bolt to CL adapter because 6 bolt tends to be cheaper. They are designed to fit exactly the same. If you have a 15mm or bigger front axle, you will need the "bottom bracket" type wrench to operate the lock ring.
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Old 01-08-19, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by gus6464 View Post
prowheelbuilder.com

DT Swiss XR361 rims 28H both (3x front and rear)
Hope Pro4 front and rear hubs
DT Swiss competition spokes and nipples

$674.88 before 8% off coupon

That's not bad. Although I would call them up about the XR361 as the rims come with Squorx nipples in the box so they don't need to charge you extra for them. The XR361 is an asymmetric rim.
I live about an hour away from ProWheelBuilder.

The owner Richard and his partner are the only people I let touch my wheels.


-Tim-
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Old 01-08-19, 10:18 AM
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The PBS wheelset is of good quality and I'd recommend them having built my own set of Grails with Bitex hubs. I believe they're built by Sta-Tru in Santa Ana, CA. I'm not sure of the hubs manufacturing origins, but I'd put their quality around that of the Bitex hubs I'm using on mine - Similar weight, Enduro bearings, Shimano/SRAM XD freehub body, serviceable, 4 pawls, modular to any axle format.

https://speedtunedwheels.com/product/super-6-2-0-hub/

Besides that, I believe they use DT comp spokes. All their wheels have always come in true and evenly tensioned. Again, would recommend, especially as they're probably going for around $400 now.

Edit: To answer one of your original questions, you would not use the Stan's endcaps. Rather, you'd have to purchase them from the above link I provided.

Last edited by tayguer; 01-08-19 at 10:27 AM.
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Old 01-08-19, 11:27 AM
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Based on recommendations here's what I'm thinking, should stand up to my lard butt that keeps breaking spokes on my 24 spoke bontrager wheels.
$598 shipped with the 8% off coupon. A bit of bling to match other accents on the bike.

STAN'S NO TUBES ROAD DISC WHEEL SET PACKAGE

FRONT RIM1 x STANS NO TUBES GRAIL MK3 DISC 700C RIM $105.00
Drillings: 32
Rim Size: 700c/29er
Rim Tape Options: Tubeless Tape and Valve for 1 wheel Installed +$11.00FRONT HUB1 x BITEX BX 106 FRONT BLUE CENTERLOCK DISC HUB $79.00
Axle Width: Thru 15mm (Does Not Include Lockring)
Bearing Options: *No Bearing Upgrade
Centerlock Lockring Options: Shimano Centerlock Lockring (works with all axle types) +$13.00
Drillings: 32
Skewer Options: *No Skewer FRONT SPOKE32 x SAPIM LASER J BEND BLACK DOUBLE BUTTED 14 X 17 X 14G OR 2.0 X 1.5 X 2.0MM SPOKES $1.56FRONT NIPPLE32 x SAPIM POLYAX 14MM 14 GAUGE BLUE ALLOY NIPPLE $0.34REAR RIM1 x STANS NO TUBES GRAIL MK3 DISC 700C RIM $105.00
Drillings: 32
Rim Size: 700c/29er
Rim Tape Options: Tubeless Tape and Valve for 1 wheel Installed +$11.00REAR HUB1 x BITEX BX 106 REAR BLUE CENTERLOCK DISC HUB $130.00
Axle Width: *QR 135mm (Does Not Include Lockring)
Bearing Options: *No Bearing Upgrade
Centerlock Lockring Options: Shimano Centerlock Lockring (works with all axle types) +$13.00
Drillings: 32
Driver Type: *Shimano/SRAM ANTI BITE 8,9,10 or (ROAD 11spd)
Skewer Options: *No Skewer REAR SPOKE32 x SAPIM LASER J BEND BLACK DOUBLE BUTTED 14 X 17 X 14G OR 2.0 X 1.5 X 2.0MM SPOKES $1.56REAR NIPPLE32 x SAPIM POLYAX 14MM 14 GAUGE BLUE ALLOY NIPPLE $0.34options--Lacing Pattern: Three Cross
--Lacing Pattern Rear: Three Cross
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Old 01-08-19, 03:28 PM
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Are you dead set on the Grail? Stan's rims are soft in general. DT Swiss just makes a better rim overall. Look into the XR331 which is same width as the Grail or even the XR361 which is 2mm wider and also asymmetric. Plus they are both cheaper than Stan's.
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Old 01-09-19, 09:32 AM
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I just bought a set of Grails from Performance Bike - the salesman told me the hubs are Novatec. All I see is "Speed Tuned" decal, whatever that means. - I'm no expert. He also spoke highly of Stans warranty - so that might be a consideration.
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