Modifying old bikes for commuting
#1
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Modifying old bikes for commuting
Hey all,
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
Last edited by iamacat; 08-14-19 at 10:04 AM.
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656
Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,096 Times
in
742 Posts
Be sure you get a frame and fork that will indeed clear 700-30 tires with fenders. Many will not. You might consider a new bike specifically suitable for what you want such as the Surly Cross Check (rim brakes) or Straggler (disc brakes) both of which will accept up to 700-40 with fenders.
#3
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 8,688
Mentioned: 46 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1074 Post(s)
Liked 295 Times
in
222 Posts
While modern, long-reach, dual-pivot brakes are better than old single-pivot, they’re not as crisp as modern, short-reach brakes.
I replaced a pair of Saccon side-pulls with just that model Tektros.
Improvement - certainly.
”Fully updated” - hardly.
Depending on your comparison point, you may not be entirely pleased with the results.
I replaced a pair of Saccon side-pulls with just that model Tektros.
Improvement - certainly.
”Fully updated” - hardly.
Depending on your comparison point, you may not be entirely pleased with the results.
#4
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Be sure you get a frame and fork that will indeed clear 700-30 tires with fenders. Many will not. You might consider a new bike specifically suitable for what you want such as the Surly Cross Check (rim brakes) or Straggler (disc brakes) both of which will accept up to 700-40 with fenders.
While modern, long-reach, dual-pivot brakes are better than old single-pivot, they’re not as crisp as modern, short-reach brakes.
I replaced a pair of Saccon side-pulls with just that model Tektros.
Improvement - certainly.
”Fully updated” - hardly.
Depending on your comparison point, you may not be entirely pleased with the results.
I replaced a pair of Saccon side-pulls with just that model Tektros.
Improvement - certainly.
”Fully updated” - hardly.
Depending on your comparison point, you may not be entirely pleased with the results.
Last edited by iamacat; 08-14-19 at 10:42 AM.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656
Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,096 Times
in
742 Posts
Frankly, by the time you spend the money and effort retrofitting an old frame, something substantially more suitable and modern won't cost much more.
#6
Really Old Senior Member
"an old bike with 27" wheels" will likely have 120 or 126mm frame spacing.
Have you found suitable wheels that fit?
There are so many bugaboo's when doing this.
Find a more modern frame with 130mm spacing and life will be so much easier.
I spent way too much money upgrading my late brother's 72 Takara road bike. (2X5)
I never would have done it except for sentimental reasons.
It's on "permanent loan" to a much younger family friend with the understanding he passes it down to his off spring or returns it. Meanwhile, it's on the road again. I can't ride road bikes, so I think my brother would approve.
Have you found suitable wheels that fit?
There are so many bugaboo's when doing this.
Find a more modern frame with 130mm spacing and life will be so much easier.
I spent way too much money upgrading my late brother's 72 Takara road bike. (2X5)
I never would have done it except for sentimental reasons.
It's on "permanent loan" to a much younger family friend with the understanding he passes it down to his off spring or returns it. Meanwhile, it's on the road again. I can't ride road bikes, so I think my brother would approve.
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Montreal, Quebec
Posts: 5,923
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1818 Post(s)
Liked 1,693 Times
in
974 Posts
If you want wider tires, keep in mind that 27 x 1/4 is pretty much equivalent to 700 x 32. If you find a bike with 27" wheels in good condition that has room for mudguards as is, all you need is to add the fenders. There are lots of late 70's and early 80's bikes out there that fill your bill. You just have to look for them. To me, 27" wheels ride better than 700c wheels with equivalent width tires. Stands to reason, they have a larger diameter
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Bronx, NYC
Posts: 1,885
Bikes: '19 Fuji Gran Fondo 1.5, '72 Peugeot PX10, '71ish Gitane Super Corsa, '78 Fuji Newest, '89 Fuji Ace, '94 Cannondale R600, early '70s LeJeune Pro project
Mentioned: 87 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 293 Post(s)
Liked 218 Times
in
101 Posts
Hey all,
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
Untitled by irishbx4th, on Flickr
Likes For greg3rd48:
#9
Generally bewildered
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Eastern PA, USA
Posts: 3,037
Bikes: 2014 Trek Domane 6.9, 1999 LeMond Zurich, 1978 Schwinn Superior
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1152 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times
in
251 Posts
If you want wider tires, keep in mind that 27 x 1/4 is pretty much equivalent to 700 x 32. If you find a bike with 27" wheels in good condition that has room for mudguards as is, all you need is to add the fenders. There are lots of late 70's and early 80's bikes out there that fill your bill. You just have to look for them. To me, 27" wheels ride better than 700c wheels with equivalent width tires. Stands to reason, they have a larger diameter
If you must change, you'd be better off getting a modern 700c wheelset for around 125 or 150. But then you have to deal with long-reach (long-enough reach?) brakes and such. Building such a bike would be fun and interesting, but it wouldn't be cost effective unless the 27 inch bike you started with was pretty special.
But I'm a reactionary curmudgeon. Just relaced some Schwinn Superior 27 inch wheels (Normandy high-flange hubs, Weinman non-boxed rims) with new spokes and put new Panaracers on it. The bike rides great, but it wasn't cost effective. For the cost and time I'll have in it I could have bought a good used bike with more modern components.
Last edited by WizardOfBoz; 08-16-19 at 08:48 AM.
Likes For WizardOfBoz:
Likes For WizardOfBoz:
#11
Senior Member
I've done 2 conversions, no issues. And used the same teckros. The 700c are maybe 5? mm smaller. Look for a basic bike, the race bikes might have less room for bigger tires. I love giving new life to older bikes. A 126 rear spacing? Just pry it wider, stuff in the 130 hub. It's 2 mm on each side no biggie for a steel frame. Post back with results.
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Bloomington/Normal IL
Posts: 1,062
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 152 Post(s)
Liked 236 Times
in
138 Posts
I did exactly what you are thinking of doing and rode my Peugeot U08 happily and comfortably on hilly 10 mile each way daily commutes for over 4 years and 8K miles. I swapped out the original steel, cottered crank for a semi-compact 50/34, used Tektro 559 which worked very well, 32mm tires with plenty of room to spare and a rack. I loved the setup and tweaked it over time. This was the final setup that worked seamlessly. I did end up selling it a few months ago and now commute with another older frame built up with modern components.
Untitled by irishbx4th, on Flickr
Untitled by irishbx4th, on Flickr
#13
Generally bewildered
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Eastern PA, USA
Posts: 3,037
Bikes: 2014 Trek Domane 6.9, 1999 LeMond Zurich, 1978 Schwinn Superior
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1152 Post(s)
Liked 341 Times
in
251 Posts
I've done 2 conversions, no issues. And used the same teckros. The 700c are maybe 5? mm smaller. Look for a basic bike, the race bikes might have less room for bigger tires. I love giving new life to older bikes. A 126 rear spacing? Just pry it wider, stuff in the 130 hub. It's 2 mm on each side no biggie for a steel frame. Post back with results.
Agree that you CAN just spread the frame each time you replace the wheel, and if you don't do much maintenance or repair work, it would be fine, but I prefer to adjust the frame to fit the wheel, and to check the alignment. If you just pull em out each time, you may get a good ride. If you properly bend the things you don't have to worry about misaligment and such. My preference - you obviously get what you need without doing this. It is 2mm each side - easily adjusted with a length of 2x4 in, like, 5 minutes.
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 33,656
Bikes: '96 Litespeed Catalyst, '05 Litespeed Firenze, '06 Litespeed Tuscany, '20 Surly Midnight Special, All are 3x10. It is hilly around here!
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2026 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1,096 Times
in
742 Posts
I gather the OP is looking to buy and older 27" bike and retrofit it, not upgrade a bike he already has. Why not start with something more suitable?
Likes For HillRider:
#16
Half way there
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 2,956
Bikes: Many, and the list changes frequently
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 986 Post(s)
Liked 880 Times
in
527 Posts
My all-weather commuting bike was an old Raleigh Super Course. I decided to build new wheels with drum brakes (IGH) in the rear and found them to be a very nice solution, especially in wet weather. The fattest tires I could fit on the bike were 35-622 and they were real tight with fenders. When they wore out, I replaced them with 32-622s. Consider dropping down to 650b rims. You may be able to fit 40-42mm tires then, but this would make the brake reach a bit more difficult. I've found that Tektro R559 calipers do work on the road bike I converted to 650b.
When I was looking for frames that would work, I carried a "story stick" with measurements marked with the rim diameters. This allowed me to figure out where a particular size rim would be so I could assess both brake reach and tire clearance.
Good luck
When I was looking for frames that would work, I carried a "story stick" with measurements marked with the rim diameters. This allowed me to figure out where a particular size rim would be so I could assess both brake reach and tire clearance.
Good luck
#17
Space Ghost
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,762
Bikes: Bridgestone, Fuji, Iro, Jamis, Gary Fisher, GT, Scott, Specialized and more
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 292 Post(s)
Liked 412 Times
in
318 Posts
Just as an aside, Velomine has got the 2013 Jamis Satellite Sport on closeout for two hundred and fifty bucks. Pretty good deal. Only catch is you gotta ride a 51. Only the one size available.
#18
Friendship is Magic
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Sacramento, CA
Posts: 22,984
Bikes: old ones
Mentioned: 304 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 26400 Post(s)
Liked 10,373 Times
in
7,202 Posts
Hey all,
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
My idea is to take an old bike with 27" wheels, replace the wheelset with 700c, swap out the old center-pull calipers for some long-reach dual-pivots like the Tektro R559 and thus gain more clearance for fatter tires and fenders. Does that sounds reasonable or am I missing something?
The reason I ask is that in my area (Seattle) there are a lot of old 70s and 80s bikes for sale. I like these old frames but in order to be a decent commuter bike for Seattle, I need slightly wider tires (at least 30mm, hopefully more for the potholes), fenders (rains all the time) and non-mushy brakes for all the hills. All of the old bikes I've tried have terrible (outright dangerous, IMO) brakes and they generally don't have clearance for much wider tires with fenders.
Thanks!
I commuted here for 20-30 years, on and off, on just such bicycles. If there's a lot of traffic you need to watch out for, in order to avoid death by driver, you're better off converting to a flat bar with a slightly shorter stem length to get a more upright riding position. This gives you better visibility. You can spend the money you save on the crank swap on new bar, stem, and levers.
#19
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 2,537
Bikes: yes
Mentioned: 18 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1281 Post(s)
Liked 643 Times
in
329 Posts
Yes they have and, with the exception of those who have a sentimental attachment to the old bike or those who have a substantial collection of useable parts already on hand and do their own work, most of them spent more than starting with a newer bike would have cost.
I gather the OP is looking to buy and older 27" bike and retrofit it, not upgrade a bike he already has. Why not start with something more suitable?
I gather the OP is looking to buy and older 27" bike and retrofit it, not upgrade a bike he already has. Why not start with something more suitable?
#20
Steel is real
Maybe a 26" old bike, this one got given to me & accepts 700c wheels, & shorter reach brakes meant for those wheels...no problemo
28mm tyres, but you could of course go way wider
28mm tyres, but you could of course go way wider
#21
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
That's correct. And really the main reason is that I don't see a lot of good, cheap steel 700c bikes with good clearance for ~30mm tires and fenders for sale in my area. There are a TON of 27" bikes though.
#22
Steel is real
.
#23
Steel is real
OK, What's the matter with centre pull brakes? They came with my GP, but i haven't restored the bike yet to try em out.
#24
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 3,893
Mentioned: 20 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1062 Post(s)
Liked 665 Times
in
421 Posts
I've done this with 80's lugged steel Schwinn frames, which seem to be plentiful and similar to the other Japanese / Taiwanese frames of the day. My 1982 "Traveler" easily accommodates 700c x 35 mm tires, though I didn't check for fender clearance. My "World Tourist" has 27" x 32 mm tires, and fenders, so I see no reason why it wouldn't also clear the slightly smaller diameter of 700c.
The cost picture depends entirely on how many "keeper" parts are on the used bike. I look for bikes that have a square taper crank with bolt-on chainrings, and horizontal dropouts per my preference for IGH and single speed builds. Some Schwinn frames have a derailler mount, others require the "claw" mount which limits your drivetrain options. There's about a 50% chance the bottom bracket will have been neglected to its detriment.
If the bike has good 27" wheels, I'd at least ride them until the tires wear out. I have a rule never to replace a tire until I've used up the rubber that I paid for.
The cost picture depends entirely on how many "keeper" parts are on the used bike. I look for bikes that have a square taper crank with bolt-on chainrings, and horizontal dropouts per my preference for IGH and single speed builds. Some Schwinn frames have a derailler mount, others require the "claw" mount which limits your drivetrain options. There's about a 50% chance the bottom bracket will have been neglected to its detriment.
If the bike has good 27" wheels, I'd at least ride them until the tires wear out. I have a rule never to replace a tire until I've used up the rubber that I paid for.
#25
Junior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 23
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Center pulls do have a bit more clearance it seems. Maybe not more than the Tektros that I mentioned.