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Ok... judge my purchase... Gunnar w/ Ultegra

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Ok... judge my purchase... Gunnar w/ Ultegra

Old 11-17-08, 08:59 PM
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PetesDustyVolvo
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Ok... judge my purchase... Gunnar w/ Ultegra

I have been riding on a 54cm Motobecane. About 100-200 miles a week. Its too small for me. I'm 5'11" with a 34" inseam... So I finally went out and got a bike thats more my size. I found a 58cm Gunnar Crosshairs on craig's list for $700. Wow this is such a better bike than my early 80s bike... Everything spins so smooth and nice...

Ultegra hubs, brifters, rear derailer, 11-24 cassette

105 cranks... Funny thing is it has a 3 speed left brifter, and a dura-ace front derailer, and the inner chain ring is TSA haha...

Rear wheel and hub are new and supposedly the chain and chain ring have about 500 miles on them... wheels are Mavic Open Pro

It also has this 110mm stem. Which makes it too long for me so I have the saddle all the way forward for now... I should probably go get fitted and get a shorter stem. Oh yeah and its geared for a stronger rider than me. Easy fix is to get stronger...

Also came with 38 width Armadillos and a fairly beat down fizik saddle

So how did I do? I think it can definitely fit me very well. Flame away


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Old 11-17-08, 09:01 PM
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It's an 853 steel frame?
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Old 11-17-08, 09:38 PM
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It's an 853. Nice bike, great frame and decent components. Frame was built for cyclocross and with those 38's, I'm sure its a tad heavy. If your plans call for road only, change out the tires to something 23 and you are good to go.

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Old 11-17-08, 09:47 PM
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Yeah its all 853. You're right tires are too wide for my intentions. I do like their reputation for toughness though. One of the bike's duties is my 7 mile commute so not getting flats on the way to work has a lot of value...

I wish there were bike junkyards. I need to get a shorter stem on there so I can start getting comfortable on it. The gearing is going to kick my ass too...
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Old 11-17-08, 09:52 PM
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Nice all-round, do-everything bike. Good score!

These are aesthetic comments:

-- The stem is ugly.

-- Are you Swedish? Because I've only ever seen that much yellow and blue on a Swedish hockey or soccer jersey worn by their international teams. (This is a minor insignificant complaint.)

[Edit: I'm not surprised you needed a bigger bike than a 54 with your long inseam... Now you can really ride. PS -- it might be nice to throw a thinner tire on those wheels: try a 700 x 28 Gatorskin, that'll make you a lot faster.]

-- You COULD raise your hoods slightly: i.e., change the angle of your handlebars a bit.
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Old 11-17-08, 10:06 PM
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Originally Posted by PetesDustyVolvo View Post
Yeah its all 853. You're right tires are too wide for my intentions. I do like their reputation for toughness though. One of the bike's duties is my 7 mile commute so not getting flats on the way to work has a lot of value...

I wish there were bike junkyards. I need to get a shorter stem on there so I can start getting comfortable on it. The gearing is going to kick my ass too...
i dont know about san diego, but you might be able to find a friendly neighborhood bike collective/co-op. here in denver we have two, the one i frequent has tons of used parts and its all free.
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Old 11-17-08, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by PetesDustyVolvo View Post
I have been riding on a 54cm Motobecane. About 100-200 miles a week. Its too small for me. I'm 5'11" with a 34" inseam... So I finally went out and got a bike thats more my size. I found a 58cm Gunnar Crosshairs on craig's list for $700. Wow this is such a better bike than my early 80s bike... Everything spins so smooth and nice...

Ultegra hubs, brifters, rear derailer, 11-24 cassette

105 cranks... Funny thing is it has a 3 speed left brifter, and a dura-ace front derailer, and the inner chain ring is TSA haha...

Rear wheel and hub are new and supposedly the chain and chain ring have about 500 miles on them... wheels are Mavic Open Pro

It also has this 110mm stem. Which makes it too long for me so I have the saddle all the way forward for now... I should probably go get fitted and get a shorter stem. Oh yeah and its geared for a stronger rider than me. Easy fix is to get stronger...

Also came with 38 width Armadillos and a fairly beat down fizik saddle

So how did I do? I think it can definitely fit me very well. Flame away



I don't even know where to start.

Let's start with your body.

5'11" equals...... 71 inches
subtract inseam...34 inches

Leaves ....................37 inches
subtract neck and head......13 inches

Leaves you with a ........24 torso or trunk convert to cm. 24x2.54= 60.9cm

You really should be on a 56cm NOT a 58cm. based on the measurements you provided.

Next

11-24? Is that home made. Should be 11-23 , 12-23 or 12-25

Next

the 110 stem exasperates the wrong size bike by making it even longer and moving the saddle all the way forward should give you another clue. If the bike was even close to the right size you could get away with a 110 with the saddle just slightly moved forward. 90mm-110mm stems are "typical" stems for the correct fitting bike. Yes I know "you have a friend that..." Yes we all know someone that rides a 140cm and a 70cm but that doesn't make it right for everyone else.

Next

The reach to the shifters must be agonizing. MOVE those shifter WAY up. The bars are fine where they are the drops are parallel to the deck.

Next

Armadillo tires ride like crap. I mean really bad. The only saving grace is that being 38's there is a lot of air you are riding on. "Normal" tires will be fine. You're only commuting 7 miles. Just leave 5 minutes earlier if you are worried about flatting.

and finally

Ignore everything I said and in the end do what ever makes you HAPPY!!
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Old 11-18-08, 01:21 AM
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OP, we have a bike kitchen in San Diego.

About the purchase - awesome find. They're fantastic frames, and fit me better than anything else I've ever ridden. Gunnar Crosshairs are $900 or so new, that plus Ultegra for $700 is a steal.

PS Vireo, you mean 'exacerbates', right?
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Old 11-18-08, 02:42 AM
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nice find!

i'd swap out the seat for a brooks, throw some honjos on it (does it have clearance?), and white handlebar tape.

and armadillos really do ride like crap - nothing wrong with wider tires, but armadillos are quite the tradeoff.. (flats vs rolling)

anyway, congrats!
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Old 11-18-08, 05:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
I don't even know where to start.

Let's start with your body.

5'11" equals...... 71 inches
subtract inseam...34 inches

Leaves ....................37 inches
subtract neck and head......13 inches

Leaves you with a ........24 torso or trunk convert to cm. 24x2.54= 60.9cm

You really should be on a 56cm NOT a 58cm. based on the measurements you provided.
Where did you get that backwards math for bike fitting?

Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
Next

11-24? Is that home made. Should be 11-23 , 12-23 or 12-25
It "shouldnt" be anything. He can run whatever cassette he wants.

Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
Next

the 110 stem exasperates the wrong size bike by making it even longer and moving the saddle all the way forward should give you another clue. If the bike was even close to the right size you could get away with a 110 with the saddle just slightly moved forward. 90mm-110mm stems are "typical" stems for the correct fitting bike. Yes I know "you have a friend that..." Yes we all know someone that rides a 140cm and a 70cm but that doesn't make it right for everyone else.
Where did you get this info? 110mm is not excessively long. Most properly fitting bikes have a 110mm to 130mm stem.


Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
Next

The reach to the shifters must be agonizing. MOVE those shifter WAY up. The bars are fine where they are the drops are parallel to the deck.
No. Those bars are best set up like that. The shifters would be unusable in the drops if you moved them all the way up. These bars are not ergo bars meant to be set up like that.


Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
and finally

Ignore everything I said and in the end do what ever makes you HAPPY!!
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Old 11-18-08, 06:20 AM
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Save the tires, everything on that bike is ugly.
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Old 11-18-08, 07:41 AM
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I would venture to say that this bike is very close to the correct size for you except for the stem length.

If I was you, I would have gone with a 55 and kept the longer stem. It's too late for that now anyway, but you get the picture.
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Old 11-18-08, 07:45 AM
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Very cool bike.
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Old 11-18-08, 08:21 AM
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OP: You need to get fitting help from someone who knows what they are doing. You adjust saddle fore-aft to position yourself over the pedals properly, NOT to adjust the reach to the handlebar. You need to start with the correct saddle position, THEN choose a new stem length.

If, when you get the saddle properly positioned, you really do need a shorter stem, then you probably are still on a bike that is too large -- Vireo will be right, a 56 will be better. I have a longer torso than you by a couple inches and I would be on a 58 if I had a Gunnar, so you probably need the smaller frame. But it's too late for that.

PS: You can ignore pretty much everything Jynx wrote -- it's all nonsense. He either misunderstands Vireo's comments (e.g., Vireo is just stating that your cassette is probably not 11-24, as no one makes a standard cassette in that size), or is just plain wrong (e.g., about the fit info, the position of the shifters, etc.).

Last edited by Coyote2; 11-18-08 at 08:47 AM.
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Old 11-18-08, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by schnee View Post
OP, we have a bike kitchen in San Diego.

About the purchase - awesome find. They're fantastic frames, and fit me better than anything else I've ever ridden. Gunnar Crosshairs are $900 or so new, that plus Ultegra for $700 is a steal.

PS Vireo, you mean 'exacerbates', right?
ex·as·per·ate
To increase the gravity or intensity of

ex·ac·er·bate
To increase the severity, violence, or bitterness of

I couldn't decide

Last edited by Vireo; 11-18-08 at 08:45 AM.
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Old 11-18-08, 08:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Jynx View Post
Where did you get that backwards math for bike fitting?

This math is more than correct. Did you even look at it? Look at it again it will make sense. The only assumption I made was neck and head of 13 inches- pretty typical and measured from sternum notch to top of head.

It "shouldnt" be anything. He can run whatever cassette he wants.

Should-- as in Shimano only makes 11-23 or 12-23 or 12-25. So the question was 11-24 is that homemade? Read what was posted.


Where did you get this info? 110mm is not excessively long. Most properly fitting bikes have a 110mm to 130mm stem.

Wrong. I also didn't say a stem was excessively long. I said most fits are 90-110. Did you even read my post? I don't even have to justify my answer.

No. Those bars are best set up like that. The shifters would be unusable in the drops if you moved them all the way up. These bars are not ergo bars meant to be set up like that.

Again you are not reading posts? I said leave bars where they are BUT move the shifter WAY up not "all the way up" as you say. I agree with you that the bars are not the type of bars where they would be optimal but they are too low for someone who should be on a 56cm and is riding a 58 (wrong size) and a 110 stem AND has the shifter even further down.


yep
I agree with you there.

Please read my post BEFORE replying to it.
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Old 11-18-08, 09:19 AM
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OK well

1) I guess I wrote the wrong number here for my inseam haha.... I am sorry about that. I actually have 35.5" written down on the piece of paper where I measured everything and checked a few online calculators

2) Guess I got the wrong number for the cassette.... Either way its freaking tall.... I have to stand up and mash on steep grades.

3) I tried rotating the bars back and I didn't like it that much... I really think this will be perfect for me with an 80mm stem.
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Old 11-18-08, 09:35 AM
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Originally Posted by PetesDustyVolvo View Post

I wish there were bike junkyards.
I think you're riding one.
.
.
.
(Don't get bent out of shape; the bike is not junk at all. It just seems to be built from someone's parts bin.)
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Old 11-18-08, 09:38 AM
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This math is more than correct. Did you even look at it? Look at it again it will make sense. The only assumption I made was neck and head of 13 inches- pretty typical and measured from sternum notch to top of head.

I looked at it. "24 torso or trunk convert to cm. 24x2.54= 60.9cm" How does 60.9cm torso convert to a frame size? Where is this chart showing this cm number corresponding to a frame size?

Should-- as in Shimano only makes 11-23 or 12-23 or 12-25. So the question was 11-24 is that homemade? Read what was posted.

My misunderstanding.

Wrong. I also didn't say a stem was excessively long. I said most fits are 90-110. Did you even read my post? I don't even have to justify my answer.

Most fits have a stem 110mm to 130mm. Under 110mm is going to the short side.

Again you are not reading posts? I said leave bars where they are BUT move the shifter WAY up not "all the way up" as you say. I agree with you that the bars are not the type of bars where they would be optimal but they are too low for someone who should be on a 56cm and is riding a 58 (wrong size) and a 110 stem AND has the shifter even further down.

I don't agree they should be moved way up. maybe a little bit but everyone has different preferences for bar setups.
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Old 11-18-08, 10:07 AM
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Regardless.... I posted an incorrect measurement! 58 is the right size! It feels too long for me!
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Old 11-18-08, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by PetesDustyVolvo View Post
Regardless.... I posted an incorrect measurement! 58 is the right size! It feels too long for me!
I'm 6'1 with VERY long arms and my CX race bike has a 57.5 tt. It might be on the big side for cross, or off road riding, but ok for touring, or road.
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Old 11-18-08, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Jynx View Post

Wrong. I also didn't say a stem was excessively long. I said most fits are 90-110. Did you even read my post? I don't even have to justify my answer.

Most fits have a stem 110mm to 130mm. Under 110mm is going to the short side.
Jynx, while I think you're spot on most of the time, Vireo works at a shop and fits people all the time. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that he does it correctly, and the numbers and relationships he's talking about are trends he has seen based on what he has done.
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Old 11-18-08, 10:27 AM
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Vireo - something I've found, and I observe it in other cyclists, too. When I was younger and speed was more important than comfort, I'd use a smaller frame. Your frame measurement advice was what I would have used when I was 25 years old and racing.

Now - at 53 and a compromised neuro-skeletal system (more from injury/disease than age), I find myself migrating up to larger bikes. I'm just about exactly the measurements of the OP, and I'm migrating up to 58 and 59cm or 60 virtual TT frames if a sloping TT with longer head tube, or a 57-58 if more traditional geometry. Before that, I 'd use a 56-57 TT and 55-56 seat tube in a traditional geometry frame.

The older I get and less flexible and the more important comfort is to me, the more I want to ride in an upright position and the larger the frame I ride. Larger frame means I can get saddle more level with bars and that sorta thing.

It can't be calculated - it's more about what kind of riding one wants to do racing vs all day comfort, along with age and physical condition of rider. We don't all fit neatly into a formula.

Originally Posted by Vireo View Post
I don't even know where to start.

Let's start with your body.

5'11" equals...... 71 inches
subtract inseam...34 inches

Leaves ....................37 inches
subtract neck and head......13 inches

Leaves you with a ........24 torso or trunk convert to cm. 24x2.54= 60.9cm

You really should be on a 56cm NOT a 58cm. based on the measurements you provided.

Next

11-24? Is that home made. Should be 11-23 , 12-23 or 12-25

Next

the 110 stem exasperates the wrong size bike by making it even longer and moving the saddle all the way forward should give you another clue. If the bike was even close to the right size you could get away with a 110 with the saddle just slightly moved forward. 90mm-110mm stems are "typical" stems for the correct fitting bike. Yes I know "you have a friend that..." Yes we all know someone that rides a 140cm and a 70cm but that doesn't make it right for everyone else.

Next

The reach to the shifters must be agonizing. MOVE those shifter WAY up. The bars are fine where they are the drops are parallel to the deck.

Next

Armadillo tires ride like crap. I mean really bad. The only saving grace is that being 38's there is a lot of air you are riding on. "Normal" tires will be fine. You're only commuting 7 miles. Just leave 5 minutes earlier if you are worried about flatting.

and finally

Ignore everything I said and in the end do what ever makes you HAPPY!!
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Old 11-18-08, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
Jynx, while I think you're spot on most of the time, Vireo works at a shop and fits people all the time. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that he does it correctly, and the numbers and relationships he's talking about are trends he has seen based on what he has done.
+1 There are exceptions all the time.

You should also know I do quite a bit of "over the phone" fits for people that can't come into the shop. Many times I predict their bike set up from just a few measurements. Then I say " go measure this and this and call me back". When they call back I'm "almost always" right on. I'm not the perfect fitter but I have never had my bike fits questioned or bikes returned and I sell bikes to people all over the world. I have fitters and coaches call me when I sell bikes to their clients and they "almost always" agree with my calculations.
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Old 11-18-08, 10:39 AM
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So what do you think now that you know my inseam is 35.5"
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