Radish_legs

I already have a dumb trainer. If I have about $1000, should I get an aluminum 105 cx bike and try cx racing or get a smart trainer for structured workouts over the winter?

I can do structured workouts with the dumb trainer (I have a power meter), but it's a bit more difficult to do.

furiousferret

I don't know what a smart trainer is compared to a dumb trainer, but you can just hook up Zwift or TrainerRoad to any trainer and be fine.

I'd go with CX, if anything it'll definitely help your bike handling skills.

carpediemracing 

If you have a trainer already and you'd go ride a cx bike then get the bike. Alum 105 is fine for most normal cross racing, wheels aside. Actually same goes for road racing as well.

As mentioned ^ cross will teach you something about bike handling and that's good.

Radish_legs

A smart trainer can control resistance. So you can do more precise intervals. On a dumb trainer it's much harder to hold steady wattage outputs. The guys at TrainerRoad say a smart trainer (ala Wahoo Kickr) is much better for training than a dumb trainer (fluid trainer).

himespau 

How about a slightly less nice CX bike and more race fees?

happybday29475

Bursty CX is good for crits are good for CX...

And really? Difficulty choosing between a trainer and a whole new world of adventure?

PepeM

Not sure I agree with that. Personally, I do not find ERG mode with an external power meter to be all that accurate in TrainerRoad (Zwift doesn't even allow that option.) I could hold a steady output on a dumb trainer as well as when using the smart one, especially shorter intervals as it takes the system some time to actually stabilize.

What I do like with the smart trainer is the ability to simulate the terrain. I do find quite enjoyable to do some climbing in Zwift. More of a toy though don't really think it does that much for me in terms of training.

jsk

If you have any interest in CX, it seems like a no-brainer to get the CX bike. Having said that I personally have no interest in CX and love my Wahoo Kickr. It really does take structured interval workouts to a new level.

topflightpro

I don't have a smart trainer, but I can tell you that a dumb trainer with a good PM is more than enough to hold set watts for an interval.

grolby

The guys at TrainerRoad have a bit of a vested interest in this theory. The flip side of the greater precision of a smart trainer is because it controls resistance for you, you don't get any practice holding a given power output yourself. And that's a useful skill to develop. With just a little bit of practice, holding a steady power output on a normal trainer isn't hard at all. After all, your resistance is totally constant. What's hard is doing it on the road, but you can at least start getting the hang of it indoors. There's no such thing as a smart PM for outdoor riding, so if you want to use that fancy power meter effectively you HAVE to learn how to meter your effort yourself.

I'm not anti smart trainer, they have value and there are some tasks for which they're almost essential (e.g. a ramp test). But smart trainer vs. a cyclocross bike given what you've presented is a no brainer, and not just because I'm the 33's resident 'cross nerd. It's an opportunity to try something new, to work on balance and handling skills by riding different terrain, and it's also a backup training bike. You've already got a trainer. You've already got a power meter. Get a 'cross bike, you won't regret it.

TheKillerPenguin

get a cross bike, and if you have any money left over buy winter gear.

hubcyclist

i've been trying out a kickr snap, still kind of kicking around the idea of getting a kickr or one of the elite models (also considering the cycleops magnus). what I like, having an 8 speed drivetrain, is that it seems a bit easier for intervals with erg mode because sometimes the jumps between cogs sometimes puts me in a weird spot of either trying to spin too fast to hit the wattage or mashing. but most people aren't in my situation with 10/11spd, I imagine.

Anyhow, given that I'm riding a lot inside these days, I am appreciating the value of a smart trainer and if you see yourself being primarily indoors for awhile I'd recommend that. But, as cross season is starting, and I'm itching to compete in something this year after not doing any road events, I'm definitely seeing a lot of value in having a cross bike (plus I'm considering doing some bike commuting, so it would be good for that sort of thing too).

PepeM

I'm glad to read someone has had good luck with this. I had a Snap for a couple of weeks and I could never get it to work in ERG mode with Trainer Road. 30 watt swings were all too common (even more in the first few seconds of an interval) which just drove me crazy. Now I have a Tacx Genius and while it is better it is still not great.

Actually, are you using an external power meter? I am sure my issue came from trying to control the resistance using the input from my actual power meter. Using the trainer's power meter should work better I guess, but then the numbers never matched my power meter's numbers.

hubcyclist

I have gotten some swings, so I totally get what you're talking about. Like the other day, I was doing some threshold intervals and I ramped up my cadence prior to the 100% portion started, but then the resistance wasn't adjusting to make it harder. So I had to stop and allow the resistance to catch up. I think it really comes down to maintaining a steady cadence for that powermatch to be at its most stable. I have a powertap, and really want to free my indoor dependence on it to make it easier to go outside without a big tire changing production, so I'll probably go with a trainer with a smaller margin of error, because in practice 5% is pretty big. Using ERG with just the trainer power meter is definitely better.

ancker

I have both a smart trainer and a CX bike. Here are arguments for both, pick the one you think is most relevant to your interests.

1) Smart trainer. Takes the thinking out of interval training indoors. Do Sufferfest videos (through their app) and it'll control the trainer. Follow one of their training plans (or make your own) and you'll definitely get faster/stronger. Things like Zwift are fun and help keep the boredom down. You can mix that in with Sufferfest or other intervals and not want to kill yourself. Also, you can ride it in any weather condition. Winter clothes are nice, but the 20 minutes for getting ready and cleaning up could be spent riding the trainer.

2) CX Bike. Does a ton for handling skills. Way less boring than a trainer. Keeps you interested in something competitive year round. You get to clean your bike more often. If you do some CX racing (and training/practice in between), you'll definitely learn a lot and get stronger/faster. You may meet new people who will get you riding more, which equals more training, which equals speed.

mattm

None of the above.

Save your money, keep training on your dumb trainer, and focus.

Spending money doesn't necessarily mean you'll get faster.

I've never done cx, but from what I gather the guys that do it aren't doing it for training, they're doing it for fun. If anything it seems to take away from their road season, because they're too busy/tired to do actual training during the winter. My $0.02.

mike868y

fixed your quote to represent new england.

himespau 

how did I know that was coming. oddly, I expected it from grolby though.

mike868y

lol, i'm a roadie at heart for sure, but there's no denying that cx is far more popular around here.

aaronmcd

Even with you east coasters talking about it, I still imagine CX as tough mudder on wheels, except I don't know anyone who's raced CX.

Someday I need to try it and see how much fun it is to change my mindset. Actually it does sound funish, except that it's a whole other bike to worry about and it sounds like it hurts immensely.

dz_nuzz

Who wants to open the "Cross before September" can-of-worms?

I dunno. I have tried cross for a number of years and just have never really found it to be something I enjoy. Honestly I am thinking about buying a smart trainer this winter, granted I already have a Cross bike.

Honestly if the idea of Cross sounds fun to you, it is a better investment. Just realize that cross is not like road. Handling skills are great and all but if you envision yourself doing anything that requires you to put out power beyond an hour, it won't make you better at that, a dedicated training plan will.

himespau 

Yeah, but for someone who has been talking about whether or not he should do his first race for over a year, it might be a way to get a first one (and then a few more) under his belt so it doesn't seem so intimidating. Especially if he's out on the west coast where I hear cx involves lots of beer hand ups and people wearing tutus.

mike868y

yeah, i'm not really convinced cross helps you on the road much. but it's fun and racing bikes is fun and if i can race for 4 more months out of the year i'm going to do it.

hack

I have a cross bike. I use it so little I loaned it out to a Jr teammate. If he didn't have it, I'd sell it. Lot's of cross out here ranging from the very serious to the costume wearing drunkards. I just don't have the energy for it after a full road season.

To answer the OP ... at this point in the game, it really doesn't matter. Keeping your legs moving in circles in any manner is better than not. Use your non-smart trainer (I used one all winter nursing a dislocated shoulder and hit the early races hard) if the weather is frightful and ride outside if it isn't. Save the money for reg fees and wheels and kits and tires and so on. With that said, if you want a cross bike, buy a cross bike.

Doge

Something that frees your mind.