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So, the Salsa Cutthroat Apex...N+1?

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Cyclocross and Gravelbiking (Recreational) This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like : "Unbound Gravel". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

So, the Salsa Cutthroat Apex...N+1?

Old 09-03-18, 10:01 PM
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zaxmalloy
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So, the Salsa Cutthroat Apex...N+1?

Anyone here using a Cutthroat for road and gravel?
Stopped into my local bike store on my year old Vaya Claris yesterday to just look around and lust after a 20 mile jaunt. A salesperson I've worked with before brought over a Salsa Cutthroat Apex and says here, take this for a spin in the parking lot.

So I took it around the parking lot...and down the street...around the block....and up a short but steep gravel hill. The hill on the Vaya woud have meant a lot gear changing and maximum power...with the Apex, it just ate it. The bike was fast, handled great, was supremely comfortable and...I like the orange color.

The sales guy explained all about the Divide Map on the down tube and how it's set-up for all kinds of touring bags to support all that. I'm beginning to wonder..I'm not the camping type....and then he says "and yet, a lot of people buy it because they have a bike like the Vaya that's heavy and...the Cutthroat also puts you in an upright position, has fantastic gearing, you can go anywhere and it flies. Like the Vaya on steroids...without the weight."

Yeah, I like it. I've been thinking about replacing my carbon road bike which is a little small. Thought I might look to replace it with something like the Giant Defy 2 but not sure I want to sink a lot of money into a road bike. I ride 40-100 miles a week, enjoy all types of surface. Not sure the Cutthroat is an all-arounder...

Anyone here using a Cutthroat for road and gravel? Is it worth it? Or am I buying a Winnebago so I can go to the grocery store?
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Old 09-03-18, 10:24 PM
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Originally Posted by zaxmalloy
Anyone here using a Cutthroat for road and gravel?
Stopped into my local bike store on my year old Vaya Claris yesterday to just look around and lust after a 20 mile jaunt. A salesperson I've worked with before brought over a Salsa Cutthroat Apex and says here, take this for a spin in the parking lot.

So I took it around the parking lot...and down the street...around the block....and up a short but steep gravel hill. The hill on the Vaya woud have meant a lot gear changing and maximum power...with the Apex, it just ate it. The bike was fast, handled great, was supremely comfortable and...I like the orange color.

The sales guy explained all about the Divide Map on the down tube and how it's set-up for all kinds of touring bags to support all that. I'm beginning to wonder..I'm not the camping type....and then he says "and yet, a lot of people buy it because they have a bike like the Vaya that's heavy and...the Cutthroat also puts you in an upright position, has fantastic gearing, you can go anywhere and it flies. Like the Vaya on steroids...without the weight."

Yeah, I like it. I've been thinking about replacing my carbon road bike which is a little small. Thought I might look to replace it with something like the Giant Defy 2 but not sure I want to sink a lot of money into a road bike. I ride 40-100 miles a week, enjoy all types of surface. Not sure the Cutthroat is an all-arounder...

Anyone here using a Cutthroat for road and gravel? Is it worth it? Or am I buying a Winnebago so I can go to the grocery store?
Consider that a 2018 Vaja with carbon fork is only 3 lbs heavier, and that's with a double up front vs the Cuthroat's single chain ring. So, an alternate plan would be to invest 4 bills in a new fork, ride a lot of hills, lose 3 lbs of fat, and take the wifey, or the GF, (or both!) on a nice vacay with the two grand you've saved!
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Old 09-03-18, 11:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Wattsup
Consider that a 2018 Vaja with carbon fork is only 3 lbs heavier, and that's with a double up front vs the Cuthroat's single chain ring. So, an alternate plan would be to invest 4 bills in a new fork, ride a lot of hills, lose 3 lbs of fat, and take the wifey, or the GF, (or both!) on a nice vacay with the two grand you've saved!
The cutthroat also has 3" tyre clearance
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Old 09-04-18, 03:26 AM
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Originally Posted by zaxmalloy
Yeah, I like it. I've been thinking about replacing my carbon road bike which is a little small. Thought I might look to replace it with something like the Giant Defy 2 but not sure I want to sink a lot of money into a road bike. I ride 40-100 miles a week, enjoy all types of surface. Not sure the Cutthroat is an all-arounder...

Anyone here using a Cutthroat for road and gravel? Is it worth it? Or am I buying a Winnebago so I can go to the grocery store?
then look at the 2019 Giant Revolt. Carbon, light, gravel all rounder, plus made for racks for grocery getting.
And the Giant 2019 Giant revolt 105 version comes in metallic orange.


https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/re...dvanced-2-2019
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Old 09-04-18, 05:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Wattsup
Consider that a 2018 Vaja with carbon fork is only 3 lbs heavier, and that's with a double up front vs the Cuthroat's single chain ring. So, an alternate plan would be to invest 4 bills in a new fork, ride a lot of hills, lose 3 lbs of fat, and take the wifey, or the GF, (or both!) on a nice vacay with the two grand you've saved!
Good suggestion on the fork and suppose going tubeless (another $100) might save some more weight. See your point regarding the double-up....though must say that the 1x set-up is nice and uncomplicated. Would need a longer test ride to evaluate the 1x.

I also like the Vaya for it's weight if that makes any sense - the ride is very planted and for 20 miles out and back to the brewery works great. The Cutthroat was a different experience - that's why I'm wondering if it could replace the road bike which the Vaya can't...plus if I made those changes, would I lose my plush steel ride quality...

As far as weight I'm already at the low-end of my BMI (so much so that a recent weight gain as actually improved performance). And vacation travel is always a good idea.
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Old 09-04-18, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Metieval
then look at the 2019 Giant Revolt. Carbon, light, gravel all rounder, plus made for racks for grocery getting.
And the Giant 2019 Giant revolt 105 version comes in metallic orange.


https://www.giant-bicycles.com/us/re...dvanced-2-2019
Wow - didn't know about this. And I love Giant bikes - had an Escape as my first real adult bike bike purchased back in 2013 and it was a warrior until it (and I) got t-boned by a car last year. I escaped but the Escape did not not...
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Old 09-04-18, 06:00 AM
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Originally Posted by zaxmalloy
Wow - didn't know about this. And I love Giant bikes - had an Escape as my first real adult bike bike purchased back in 2013 and it was a warrior until it (and I) got t-boned by a car last year. I escaped but the Escape did not not...
When I first got back into cycling I'd bought a 2005 Giant Cypress SX which is anything but like the cypress line. In 04 it was a flat bar hybrid/road bike. in 05 they added a shock. Regardless @ $800 something in 05 it was disc brake 105 trekking triple x 9 I loved it all except the heavy coil shock. I ended up ditching it because finding a geo correct rigid disc fork at the time wasn't going to happen, regardless it was a fun whatever bike. yet it being flat bar was also restricted in milage (for me anyways)

I had interest in the original revolt, Except it seemed heavy and dull. The anyroad ,perked my interest except it rode like a 29er on less tire, but with drop bars. I am dying to ride this new Revolt. the toughroad was high on my list except flat bar. I had no interest in the Toughroad GX with the drop bar (heavy).

I want to merge the line between a road endurance (Defy) and a gravel bike, and add purpose to it via front/rear rack capability. This 2019 Revolt is the first that seems to check all my boxes. Not to take away from the Salsa Cutthroat. It is what it is, and the 2019 Revolt is what it is. I don't need racks all the time. But I do want performance all the time. I also want comfort too. however comfort/performance is something that I can compromise on depending.

there is this article too.

and all the pictures show the orange 105 as a duller copper colored orange, yet 1 picture that eludes me shows it as a brighter orange.

https://www.bikeexchange.com.au/blog...things-to-know
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Old 09-04-18, 09:38 AM
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The OP implies by one of his comments that he enjoys the relaxed geometry of his Vaya, and is appreciative that the Cutthroat shares similar geometry. The Cutthroat in fact is a bit more relaxed than the Vaya, more along the lines of the Fargo. The Revolt on the other hand is less relaxed, lower stack and higher reach, and might not meet the OP's needs. The Giant Anyroad however has very similar geometry to his Vaya, but the stock wheels are boat anchors, (I know, I own an Anyroad CoMax,.). Even with those 2200g boat anchors, my large Anyroad weighs only 22.2 lbs, less than the Cutthroat Apex large's 23.25 lbs, and that's with two rings up front, vs the Salsa's one. As a another poster pointed out earlier, the Cutthroat does take up to 3" tires. My Anyroad will just fit 42mm.
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Old 09-04-18, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Wattsup
The OP implies by one of his comments that he enjoys the relaxed geometry of his Vaya, and is appreciative that the Cutthroat shares similar geometry. The Cutthroat in fact is a bit more relaxed than the Vaya, more along the lines of the Fargo. The Revolt on the other hand is less relaxed, lower stack and higher reach, and might not meet the OP's needs. The Giant Anyroad however has very similar geometry to his Vaya, but the stock wheels are boat anchors, (I know, I own an Anyroad CoMax,.). Even with those 2200g boat anchors, my large Anyroad weighs only 22.2 lbs, less than the Cutthroat Apex large's 23.25 lbs, and that's with two rings up front, vs the Salsa's one. As a another poster pointed out earlier, the Cutthroat does take up to 3" tires. My Anyroad will just fit 42mm.
he also said replacing his road bike with a Defy. and the 2019 Revolt would have a much larger head tube than the defy and also fit a 700x45 tire. for a nice all rounder bicycle

I've been thinking about replacing my carbon road bike which is a little small. Thought I might look to replace it with something like the Giant Defy 2 but not sure I want to sink a lot of money into a road bike. I ride 40-100 miles a week, enjoy all types of surface. Not sure the Cutthroat is an all-arounder...
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Old 09-04-18, 07:21 PM
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More like you are buying a Jeep 4x4 to go to the grocery store. The Cutthroat is a hardtail MTB designed for drop bars. The geometry is set up to allow the use of a 100mm suspension fork. A gravel bike is more a road bike built to take wider tires.
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Old 09-05-18, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Wattsup
The OP implies by one of his comments that he enjoys the relaxed geometry of his Vaya, and is appreciative that the Cutthroat shares similar geometry. The Cutthroat in fact is a bit more relaxed than the Vaya, more along the lines of the Fargo. The Revolt on the other hand is less relaxed, lower stack and higher reach, and might not meet the OP's needs. The Giant Anyroad however has very similar geometry to his Vaya, but the stock wheels are boat anchors, (I know, I own an Anyroad CoMax,.). Even with those 2200g boat anchors, my large Anyroad weighs only 22.2 lbs, less than the Cutthroat Apex large's 23.25 lbs, and that's with two rings up front, vs the Salsa's one. As a another poster pointed out earlier, the Cutthroat does take up to 3" tires. My Anyroad will just fit 42mm.
I shopped the Anyroad when buying the Vaya but unfortunately I could not get the shifting working reliably and I tried a couple of different models. Also, the color was...not my cup of tea. The Vaya had a different feel altogether - not what I was shopping for but different - and 20% off to boot - so it became more an impulse buy. So, comparing the Vaya to the Anyroad is a classic apples vs. oranges. As it turns out, a year later I am happy with the Vaya for what it is - but my original intent (an all-arounder bike that has enough speed to replace my road bike) has gone unfulfilled...
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Old 09-05-18, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by zaxmalloy
I shopped the Anyroad when buying the Vaya but unfortunately I could not get the shifting working reliably and I tried a couple of different models. Also, the color was...not my cup of tea. The Vaya had a different feel altogether - not what I was shopping for but different - and 20% off to boot - so it became more an impulse buy. So, comparing the Vaya to the Anyroad is a classic apples vs. oranges. As it turns out, a year later I am happy with the Vaya for what it is - but my original intent (an all-arounder bike that has enough speed to replace my road bike) has gone unfulfilled...

Enough speed? Have you worked out the top gearing of the 1x Cutthroat? You might find yourself spinning. The Cutthroat is no lightweight either, at a quoted 23 lbs 4 oz for a large, and that's even with the lighter one-ring crank. A road bike it is not.

Can you list your specific requirements in a list?
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Old 09-05-18, 11:35 AM
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The Giant has rebranded hydro brakes if that matters to you. It would to me. Who knows if they are just re-badged Shimanos or what but it would matter when it comes time to do maintenance.

This is for the 105 version.
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Old 09-05-18, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Wattsup
Enough speed? Have you worked out the top gearing of the 1x Cutthroat? You might find yourself spinning. The Cutthroat is no lightweight either, at a quoted 23 lbs 4 oz for a large, and that's even with the lighter one-ring crank. A road bike it is not.

Can you list your specific requirements in a list?
Good points on the weight and the spinning and I certainly realize it will not have the same nimble feeling or quick acceleration of my carbon roadie.

No, I don't have a list of requirements. Part of the problem I think - should probably put one together. That said, I got to see a couple of Surly Midnight Specials and All City Gorilla Monsoons early this year and that idea appealed to me - the road bike that could accommodate large tires - and handle trails and gravel. But that first impression didn't last long - both gone from the shops in a flash.

I also need to take some test rides longer than 10 minutes. Salsa and Surly have one locally this weekend where I can do a little more thrashing on the Cutthroat and Giant follows suit on the 23rd at which point I can try a Revolt and a Defy. A small 'risk' is the Cutthroat not being in stock if I wait that long but it's not on sale now and it's not like they won't make a 2019 version.
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Old 09-23-18, 11:21 PM
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So, as an update...the Cutthroat was rapidly sold by the LBS. So none are on the horizon in 2018 color combo and that may be that.

I participated in the Surly/Salsa & All City ride event. No Cuthroat or Surly Midnight Express present, but did get to ride an All City Gorilla Monsoon which was interesting but not in a take-me-home sort of way. If I did more actual mountain biking it might make sense.

Went to the Giant event today. The Revolt was awesome - it was the Revolt Advanced 0 version, so it should be 'all that' with its $3,300 price tag. It was light and fast yet planted on any and every surface and an instant smile-making machine. Relatively relaxed geometry yet it clocked within 1 mph of a TCR for average speed over a 20 minute test ride and it was a lot more fun to boot. First time I've ever been on a bike with tubeless tires, carbon wheels and an Ultrega group set. I didn't get a chance to try a Defy unfortunately....

So, will wait for Revolts to come into stock (which apparently will be awhile) and try the 105 edition...but today's adventure may have spoiled me. $3,300 is more than I wanted to spend and the dull black color lacks any character at all, but I've never ridden anything quite like that sleek machine...
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