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F H Grubb frame decals

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F H Grubb frame decals

Old 01-09-17, 05:57 PM
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VeloFelo54
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F H Grubb frame decals

In conjunction with the marque specialist of the V-C C, we are trying to resolve the confusion regarding downtube decals on F H Grubb machines that were used prior to the company liquidation in 1951. It seems that very few machines have survived with the original decals intact and we appear to now have 4 different designs of script style F H Grubb downtube decals. One of these at least (we think) may be spurious - a later creation.
We are therefore hoping for photos of frames showing the decals on pre Holdsworth Grubb machines, ideally with an indication of date and preferably with a frame number to help to sort out the chronology. Your help with this project is most appreciated.
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Old 01-09-17, 06:00 PM
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A noble effort! Sorry I can't help.
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Old 01-09-17, 06:32 PM
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-----

Thanks very much for this work!

Great to know you wish to do fine by Freddie.

-----
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Old 01-10-17, 12:17 AM
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there appear to be two versions in the 1949 catalogue
https://veterancycleclublibrary.org.u...20Library).pdf
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Old 01-10-17, 05:52 AM
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@1989Pre
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Old 01-10-17, 08:56 AM
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This closed auction may or may not be of help, but even if, as it appears, this frame has been re-coated and re-decaled in a restoration, you might be able to contact the previous owner who has kindly listed his name and address at the bottom of the page.
The frame number is stamped into the Chater Lea lug at top of steerer tube, front.

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Old 01-13-17, 10:30 AM
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Many thanks for the responses so far. It appears that after Freddie Grubbs' death they used the FREDDIE GRUBB decal but before that they were using F H Grubb (in script) decals. Several suppliers of frame decals have reproduced the design on the front of the 1950 catalogue (there is a link to this on this thread) - but, has anyone ever seen a machine with original decals in this design ? Our view is that this was never used on a frame and that the downtube script design was different from this. This is the question that we are trying to resolve.

The other link showing a Grubb track frame is odd. Firstly, it has Holdsworth period Grubb decals (by 1955 Holdsworth were badging almost identical frames with either companies head badge / decals - by 1960 the were doing the same with Claud Butler frames too !!)
Secondly, the frame number seems odd as the number points to mid 50's. Thirdly, the frame looks 50's also to my eyes although the forks look earlier.
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Old 01-13-17, 10:41 AM
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Upon further examination, the Grubb track frame refinished with later decals is probably a 1930's frame, but the frame number does not fit with the Grubb number system. In the early 30's they were using 5 number frame numbers. After the closure/restart in early 1935 the frame numbers started again from 0001 and were stamped into the head lug at the top. This frame may be from another manufacturer which has been refinished recently in Grubb livery.
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Old 02-15-17, 07:32 AM
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I have a copy of a sales receipt for a bicycle on my other computer, but I won't have access to it for another three weeks. I will show it then (and the picture of the machine, as-well, if I have it).
The F H. Grubb receipt is for a complete bicycle with the frame number 1979, and is dated twenty August, 1948. The complete bike commanded forty-two pounds sterling.
What may be significant is that at the top of the page, there is the same F. H. Grubb (script) logo as at-the-top-of Big Block's catalog page: Is this the logo that you are suggesting was never, actually, on any frames, Velo?
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Old 02-20-17, 12:29 AM
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A dated receipt showing a frame number is very useful as it helps to establish a timeline for frames enabling dating other machines. So posting an image (also for the V-C C files) would be great. The current decal that is commercially available for machines of this date was (we think) originated from the design used on the front of the Grubb catalogue - which indeed is likely to be the design used on the letterhead. We are trying to find examples of Grubb frames of this period that have not been restored using the replacement decal but with originals. A picture of the machine would be great also. In 1948 42 pounds was a small fortune !
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Old 04-24-17, 04:05 PM
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Hi. Sorry it took so long to reply and get this bill-of-sale posted. I don't have any photos of the actual bicycle.
If you would like a better, expandable photo of this document, message me and I can send it to your e-mail.
I have given it some thought, and it seems that you may be correct if you were saying that the scripted F. H. Grubb
on this letterhead was not used on factory bicycles. I can't remember ever seeing one. Usually, the F. H. Grubb is in somewhat bold, block letters.

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Old 04-24-17, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by VeloFelo54
In 1948 42 pounds was a small fortune!
Yes, I can imagine that the alloy components cost quite a bit extra.
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Old 05-01-17, 12:04 AM
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Thanks for posting the copies. These really are very interesting documents as they give us a date for a specific frame number. GBP42- was around the price for a top machine at that time. Great to see an original Freddie Grubb signature also. I have a Claud Butler Massed Start machine that was listed at a similar price in 1951 - a lot of money. After about 1952 prices declined enormously and by the late 50's it was all over for many manufacturers including Claud Butler. I suspect that bicycle sales were driven to a large degree by economics and as the post war austerity period ended and the population had more money to spend, cycle sales declined and motor cycle / car sales increased.

We still have not seen an original frame with the decal design as the letterhead. Looking at it, it does not lend itself very well to use as a down tube decal. The commercially available version has been 'stretched' to make it longer and narrower. I am in the process of having the decal on my frame (Grubb Perfection frame number 2584 Ca.1950) reproduced. I have attached an image of this also. The Grubb Perfection machines were 'launched' in late 1949 and only produced until early 1951 when Grubbs' sadly went into receivership. A few more frames were made by Holdsworth - presumably using up materials ? - the Perfection then disappeared. We have a good timeline for the introduction of new models during the 50's by Holdsworth, but they were treated as the 'budget' range of machines, the Holdsworth machines being the most expensive in the range. Holdsworth went on to own the Maclean and Claud Butler marques also.

I would love copies of these to pass on to John Davis. Jon is the marque enthusiast at the V-C C and he is currently developing a new website for Grubb machines. My email : Steve95480@sky.com
Thanks again for posting them. Invaluable evidence for those of us trying to write the history of these companies.
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Old 05-02-17, 08:10 PM
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Are you saying that the decal in your photo is on your Grubb Perfection and that you believe it to be original? Is that what inspired you to try to find other examples? I have only seen a couple of other Perfections, and they did not have this scripted decal. I can see what you mean about it being shorter and more compact than the currently-available versions.
The underline on mine travels almost to the F, and "limited" is placed inside that line, under the H.

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Old 05-02-17, 08:41 PM
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This Perfection appears to have a decal much the same as ours, but I can't be certain, because the photo was taken too far away from the bike to really give a good look. The bike has been repainted, so I am wondering: If you try to contact the owner, then maybe he can tell you why he opted for this transfer style.

F H Grubb bicycle
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Old 11-05-17, 10:52 PM
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Here are some pictures of our fathers tandem that might be of interest? Decals are original as is the paint which is not doing well at all...
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Old 11-05-17, 10:53 PM
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PS The Buffalo decal on the bottom is of course not original but was added on a cycle trip from Edmonton to Banff.
And the RBW decals were his initials which he added as well.
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Old 11-13-17, 03:28 PM
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That is a lovely tandem. It appears to have the original Resilion cantilever brakes and I feel sure that they are original Chater Lea pedals. I particularly like the decals also - particularly those on the downtube
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