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Cromovelato Celeste?

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Cromovelato Celeste?

Old 08-14-19, 01:28 PM
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Cromovelato Celeste?

OK, not really. But, also kind of, maybe?

It's well-established that there is no single Bianchi celeste. I think it's also established that Bianchi more or less invented celeste as a color, at least as a color anywhere near what theirs is. So would it be too much of a stretch to claim that any vaguely blue-green Bianchi is celeste?

Last November when @jyl was trying to decide on a color for his Phat Bianchi, @crank_addict suggested cromovelato celeste. In a subsequent discussion, @Lascauxcaveman (who, among his many talents, is a proficient artist) asserted that it's not possible to have a cromovelato celeste because the creamy base is essential to the color and necessarily opaque. Well, depending on your answer to my question about "any vaguely blue-green Bianchi" I can now definitely either prove or disprove the Caveman's claim.

Because this happened today.



which led to this:



which led to this:



By the way, I should mention at this point that either my camera is stubbornly lying about how blue this bike is or my eyes are stubbornly lying about how green it is, because I can't get a picture that looks like the same color I'm seeing in person. I took it outside, trying to correct this problem, but like I said it's a stubborn problem.

In the shade:



In direct sunlight:



Judging from the scratched areas (of which there are many) I think the painter achieved this effect by applying semi-transparent blue over a layer of yellow, and maybe the sensitivity of the camera causes the blue to overwhelm the yellow more than my poor eyes can perceive. Here's a scratch to show what I'm talking about.



Also, while I suspect there was little doubt about this, evidence suggests this is not the original color. The bike seems to have actually been celeste at some point in its life.



So....what have I got here? I have confirmed that the stickers aren't lying about the Columbus SLX tubing (splines are present, steerer and downtube). If the decals are correct (far from a given) I'm think 1985 or 1986? More detail pics to follow...
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Old 08-14-19, 01:32 PM
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As promised, details...

















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Old 08-14-19, 01:56 PM
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Definitely a tricky color, even without cromovelato. I still say, turquoise is what they were originally trying for, but even that leaves a lot of options. 😉 I recently bought a ring with 2 small turquoise stones, and one stone is definitely the right one. 🤔😉 Good luck.
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Old 08-14-19, 02:40 PM
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It occurs to me that the bottom bracket shell being tapped for a plastic guide probably means this is later than 1986 and the decals are lying to me. Could the "N 9" on the shell indicate 1989? Or is that a "6 N"?
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Old 08-14-19, 05:21 PM
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On my monitors, it looks like a medium blue with the slightest teal hue, while the undercoat appears Celeste.

-Kurt
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Old 08-14-19, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by cudak888
On my monitors, it looks like a medium blue with the slightest teal hue, while the undercoat appears Celeste.

-Kurt
I see what you're talking about with the Celeste undercoat. The bottom bracket shell and the front derailleur braze-on definitely show that. I hadn't noticed that. Most of the scrapes strike me as yellow, but there's definitely a layer between that and the outer coat.

To me, in person, in a poorly lit room it looks extremely teal. Outside in direct sunlight it looks very blue with at most a hint of teal. In good artificial light, it's somewhere in between.

Anyway, I see that I've made a mess of my intentions, starting a thread that is about the color but trying to also get any information anyone might have about what this bike is. I suppose an exact ID might not be terribly meaningful. I've read that in the mid-80s Bianchi often had several models with basically the same frame. I just like to resolve things like that and have something to call it. Any guesses? Paging @Bianchigirll
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Old 08-14-19, 05:56 PM
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I can't help with model ID (I barely ID'd my own), but I like! The color is striking - it would look awful nice with a bunch of shiny, old-fashioned parts hanging off it

DD
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Old 08-14-19, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Drillium Dude
I can't help with model ID (I barely ID'd my own), but I like! The color is striking - it would look awful nice with a bunch of shiny, old-fashioned parts hanging off it
Or.... Maybe some slightly less shiny new-fangled parts? I'm not sure if I told you about my plans for this. I like old frames like this that have already been "customized" because I feel less guilty further defiling them myself. In this case, I don't have a lot of hope that I'll be able to touch up all of the scratches, so I think I'm going to have to embrace the patina. Right after I bought this frame, I was looking around a shelf in my garage for some part and I noticed a set of Daytona shifters and derailleurs that I got on eBay a while ago just because they were cheap. I had completely forgotten that I had them. I also have a Racing T crankset that @nlerner gave me as thanks for letting him borrow one of my bikes for a PNW tour this spring. So, I'm thinking that will be the core of the build. I like indexing.
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Old 08-14-19, 08:37 PM
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I have to admit I really like the colour regardless of the fact that it is a repaint ... I have had a few frames with the main colour sprayed over yellow and all of them have been eye catching . That said it's hard to beat Celeste ... good luck with your project .
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Old 08-15-19, 06:35 AM
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I don’t know Andy, looks blue to me - nice though. That has all the features of the ‘89 frame I used to have, replaced with a smaller similar ‘88 or ‘89 frame which I just sold to rccardr - Gipiemme dropouts, same fork crown, no other pantograph. The holes above the rear dropouts had little round “Bianchi” stickers and the seat stay caps and tops of BB shell had Bianchi stickers also.

Great riding frame. I like the color on yours. Regarding the Celeste, the two aforementioned frames and the ‘83 Specialissima that replaced them all had different color shades. When doing touch up on them I was able to make Celeste by using white base, green base, and I think maybe even once using yellow base (or light blue?) . Painting frames is cool (and frustrating) by the different effects and tones one can achieve by adjusting the undercoat.

BB pic attached for comparison and the serial # gurus. I bought this one from the original owner, ‘89 Giro. In this year, top three models, Mondiale, Superleggera, and Giro were all same frame set.



Drop me a line if you come up short on parts. I might have a set of Daytona brakes in the stash. I definitely have 10 speed cassettes in non hill-friendly gearing that would be better used in a triple set up.
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Old 08-15-19, 09:09 AM
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Recently discussed the color Celeste with some vintage guys who mentioned a display that was given by someone at a Cirque a number of years ago.
The presenter showed at least 18 different shades of Celeste that had been used by Bianchi over the years.
So, there's that.

BTW, that Mondiale I picked up from SpagoLegs in May should be back from the painter soon. And it's no longer the color it once was...
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Old 08-15-19, 09:26 AM
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Here ya go. That blue one with inlays is from the Sleeping Beauty mine, and closest to the old Persian turquoise, from U. S. mines. That one rock on the two-stoner, is the real celeste, lol, definitely greener. 🤔😉
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Old 08-15-19, 10:35 AM
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Pretty color, but Celeste?

I'd think Celeste is like British Racing Green: "I know it when I see it".
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Old 08-15-19, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Spaghetti Legs
I don’t know Andy, looks blue to me - nice though.
I swear it's got a green tint to it in person. Blue wouldn't be so bad though, in light of the original color of jyl's '61 Phat Bianchi.

Thanks for the BB pic, that firmly convinces me this is an '89. Now I just need to decide if it's a Mondiale, Superleggera, or Giro. I think Superleggera sounds cooler, but it's an awful lot of letters to type. Maybe Giro.

The attachment of the plastic guide is interesting -- it looks more like a rivet than a screw or bolt. I discovered last night that the hole in mine isn't actually threaded, but I think it's small enough that I'll be able to have @gugie tap it for me to the standard size. The serial number on yours is also interesting. I thought the 553 on mine was a size measurement (seat tube CTC is pretty close to that), but I guess I've actually got 5530 as a serial number? I would have thought Bianchi would need more than four digits, even resetting every fortnight. I guess maybe not for the ones that were still made in Italy in the 80's?

I'll definitely be hitting you up for some brakes if you have them. As for the cassette, I use hill friendly ratios even with a triple. I find that whenever I need 30x23 I really need 30x29.
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Old 08-15-19, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964
Pretty color, but Celeste?

I'd think Celeste is like British Racing Green: "I know it when I see it".
Yeah, I'm afraid you're right. Personally, I have a problem accepting that some of the more robin's egg blue shades are Celeste. This one would be a major stretch. I feel like a Bianchi decal buys you several shades closer to Celeste, but that's still not enough here.

An odd thing happened with this, though. I was showing the new acquisition to my wife last night, and she mentioned that she liked the color so much that she thought I should consider having it repainted in this color. I hadn't even brought up the possibility of having it repainted, and she put it out there! I think if I do end up repainting it though it will have to be a real Celeste. I think.... This color is really growing on me.
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Old 08-15-19, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by rccardr
Recently discussed the color Celeste with some vintage guys who mentioned a display that was given by someone at a Cirque a number of years ago.
The presenter showed at least 18 different shades of Celeste that had been used by Bianchi over the years.
So, there's that.
That sounds awesome. Did he have 18 bikes to show or just color samples?
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Old 08-15-19, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by rccardr

BTW, that Mondiale I picked up from SpagoLegs in May should be back from the painter soon. And it's no longer the color it once was...
Oh boy - I tell ya Doc, nobody throws out C+V tease like you.
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Old 08-15-19, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K

The attachment of the plastic guide is interesting -- it looks more like a rivet than a screw or bolt. I discovered last night that the hole in mine isn't actually threaded, but I think it's small enough that I'll be able to have @gugie tap it for me to the standard size.
The "standard" plastic guide is threaded M5. I always use the screw that comes with the guide. They're the right length to engage all the threads without hitting a sealed BB.
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Old 08-15-19, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by tiger1964
Pretty color, but Celeste?

I'd think Celeste is like British Racing Green: "I know it when I see it".
The blue of Persian turquoise is what they were trying to replicate, many believe. Most likely, a combination of odd things like aging and different ingredients in the paint (?) gave it a greenish color.
That stone that's highest in the pic, is just the right amount of green & blue, just needs the paint mixed a touch darker, to be celeste. 😉
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Old 08-15-19, 01:57 PM
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Nice blue frame, Andy.
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Old 08-15-19, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by nlerner
Nice blue frame, Andy.
Here's a pic from the eBay ad, which captures the green better than I've been able to. I swear, it often looks like this.

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Old 08-15-19, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by stardognine

Here ya go. That blue one with inlays is from the Sleeping Beauty mine, and closest to the old Persian turquoise, from U. S. mines. That one rock on the two-stoner, is the real celeste, lol, definitely greener. ����
Those are definitely among the shades of Celeste I've seen. I agree that the uppermost stone is most like the "real" Celeste.
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Old 08-15-19, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K
Here's a pic from the eBay ad, which captures the green better than I've been able to. I swear, it often looks like this.
Reminds me of the teal green metallic on the late-1980's Waterford Paramounts.

-Kurt
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Old 08-15-19, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K
Or.... Maybe some slightly less shiny new-fangled parts? I'm not sure if I told you about my plans for this. I like old frames like this that have already been "customized" because I feel less guilty further defiling them myself. In this case, I don't have a lot of hope that I'll be able to touch up all of the scratches, so I think I'm going to have to embrace the patina. Right after I bought this frame, I was looking around a shelf in my garage for some part and I noticed a set of Daytona shifters and derailleurs that I got on eBay a while ago just because they were cheap. I had completely forgotten that I had them. I also have a Racing T crankset that @nlerner gave me as thanks for letting him borrow one of my bikes for a PNW tour this spring. So, I'm thinking that will be the core of the build. I like indexing.
Oh, yeah - we talked about it on the ride; I was kidding about the old parts because you'd indicated it would get a modern build-out

Although I must admit, that color really does scream out for shiny parts! And the patina doesn't look all that bad - heck, one of the worst scrapes appears to be underneath the down tube, so nobody's going to see that, right?

No ID on the model yet?

DD
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Old 08-15-19, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Andy_K
Here's a pic from the eBay ad, which captures the green better than I've been able to. I swear, it often looks like this.
Did you ask the seller why you didn’t get the one in the ad?
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