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Fixing Reach

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Fixing Reach

Old 06-12-19, 10:11 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by jadocs View Post
You never adjust reach by moving the saddle.
...you try it if it's your first road bike and you don't understand fit,balance, and your ideal saddle position. Nice generalization, though. Kudos.
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Old 06-12-19, 10:20 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
Yes but that's not an option for me right now. Otherwise I wouldn't have started this thread. Most have been super helpful with advise so I was hoping someone who has done this before can give me a rough estimate of the most likely stem length/ angle to start with.
...if this is your first road bike (as stated), and you have never gotten used to the more forward lean position most people use when riding them, it's entirely possible that it will take you a while to figure this out. If you have another bicycle you find comfortable, measure the distances between your body points of contact on that bike. That would be saddle to bar distance, saddle height along the seat tube (from the top of the saddle to the contact surface of your foot with the pedal when it's at full downward extension), and the general saddle tilt that gives you a neutral fore and aft balance on the saddle.

Then figure out where the saddle and the bar need to be based on that to start. You'll probably need to further adjust that as well, but it gives you a place to begin that you've felt is comfortable for you. I don't think I figured out an ideal position on a road bike until I'd been riding one several years, and even now it changes gradually.
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Old 06-12-19, 01:17 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
...you try it if it's your first road bike and you don't understand fit,balance, and your ideal saddle position. Nice generalization, though. Kudos.
No you don’t. Saddle height/fore/aft/cleats are adjusted first. Everything else is adjusted off that position. That becomes the known point where reach can be adjusted. If someone doesn’t understand how to set the saddle, moving the saddle to adjust reach fixes nothing. There is no known point, you are throwing darts.
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Old 06-12-19, 02:48 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
Yes. When I called their customer service they said their top tube length is 64 on the XL ( mine) and 60 cm on the L ( appropriate size) so making for a 4 cm difference. Its just tough for me to judge positioning/ fit because its my first road bike and Im not sure what its supposed to feel like ( honestly can't even tell you if my shoulder blades are flexed forward. Some online sources suggested bringing them/ the scapula down as a test and I can do that but end up having to straighten my core/ adjust positioning). Ive already ordered a shorter stem to try like others suggested. Amazon has decent looking ones that weigh 120 grams and cost just 15 dollars with free returns so I can check out multiple sizes. Fiddling around becomes a low risk high reward situation I guess. Will keep you guys posted in case someone else ends up in a similar situation.
64 cm top tube changes everything. For me anyway. My 61cm bike has a 59cm top tube. I would not/could not go any longer than that. I hope you can get it figured out.
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Old 06-12-19, 04:22 PM
  #30  
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So I realize you guys can't properly help without seeing pics. I took some using a timer and tipitoeing to keep the bike up. I can't attach to this message because I'm too new to the forum but I put them in an album on my profile if any of you guys have a second to check it out.
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Old 06-12-19, 07:40 PM
  #31  
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Originally Posted by jadocs View Post
No you don’t. Saddle height/fore/aft/cleats are adjusted first. Everything else is adjusted off that position. That becomes the known point where reach can be adjusted. If someone doesn’t understand how to set the saddle, moving the saddle to adjust reach fixes nothing. There is no known point, you are throwing darts.
...let's go back and read the original situation:

First the situation: I'm just under 6 feet tall ( 182 cm) in height and the bike is a 61 cm frame roadbike. I can stand barefooted on top of the toptube without issues but can feel my nether parts barely touching. With shoes I am a tad higher. The saddle is lowered all the way down and feels perfect in comparison to the paddles. The main problem is that while I can easily reach the handlebar while steering/ shifting/ braking, the position feels a bit over extended and I am definitely having slight extension of the shoulders as was described in you-tube videos
You seem to be stuck back in time, from when you worked in some bike shop somewhere, or raced crits, or something. This is not a conventional fitting situation, and limiting your assistance to absolutes based on what you read or learned somewhere probably won't help this person much.

Just an observation on your general impression thus far. You might be perfectly well intentioned, and you might have great expertise in this area of cycling. Your reliance on absolutes is a little off putting on first encounter.
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Old 06-12-19, 07:49 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
So I realize you guys can't properly help without seeing pics. I took some using a timer and tipitoeing to keep the bike up. I can't attach to this message because I'm too new to the forum but I put them in an album on my profile if any of you guys have a second to check it out.
I've been to your profile twice, and can find no album. Why not just reply to this message twice and then you can post pics?
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Old 06-12-19, 09:09 PM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by seedsbelize View Post
I've been to your profile twice, and can find no album. Why not just reply to this message twice and then you can post pics?
Ok will do. Just didn't want to upset any moderators hehe
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Old 06-12-19, 09:13 PM
  #34  
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I think last one
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Old 06-12-19, 09:14 PM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
I think last one
Here goes





Trying to show knee position with pedals parallel to the floor to judge saddle position
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Old 06-13-19, 07:00 AM
  #36  
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Well we'll let the experts chime in. To me it doesn't look too big. But I'm no expert on bike fitting.
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Old 06-13-19, 10:01 AM
  #37  
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It actually looks a bit cramped to me. Invert the stem and get the bars farther forward and lower. Back should be flat and hinged at the pelvis. Roll pelvis forward. Bend elbows. Head neutral.

Do you have access to a trainer into which you can bolt the rear axle?
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Old 06-13-19, 10:15 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Phil_gretz View Post
It actually looks a bit cramped to me. Invert the stem and get the bars farther forward and lower. Back should be flat and hinged at the pelvis. Roll pelvis forward. Bend elbows. Head neutral.

Do you have access to a trainer into which you can bolt the rear axle?
Oh wow. I don't have a trainer. I had the stem down at first but it was too far out and I felt too stretched so this was my solution to get the bar closer to me cheaply. With three stem down my back was hurting and it was almost impossible to leave the hoods
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Old 06-13-19, 10:23 AM
  #39  
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How is your flexibility and spine health, particularly lumbar and beneath? How do you maintain your core?
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Old 06-13-19, 10:25 AM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
Oh wow. I don't have a trainer. I had the stem down at first but it was too far out and I felt too stretched so this was my solution to get the bar closer to me cheaply. With three stem down my back was hurting and it was almost impossible to leave the hoods
...I have no advice at this point. I think (but do not know for certain)what you are experiencing is the process of adapting to a new riding position that is much different than what you've attempted before, mixed with what your body has become over the years in terms of flexibility and balance.

You can certainly relieve some of that feeling of being thrust too far forward by adjusting saddle tilt for more neutral balance. But you can't magically fix any personal flexibility issues you might have that make it harder to lean forward from the hips, and straighten the back more.

It's a process. Don't be afraid to experiment. When you come to a bike forum for fit advice, a lot of it will not consider what you find a position of comfort. It's just the way it is.....I can't feel what's comfortable for you.
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Old 06-13-19, 10:38 AM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by 3alarmer View Post
...I have no advice at this point. I think (but do not know for certain)what you are experiencing is the process of adapting to a new riding position that is much different than what you've attempted before, mixed with what your body has become over the years in terms of flexibility and balance.

You can certainly relieve some of that feeling of being thrust too far forward by adjusting saddle tilt for more neutral balance. But you can't magically fix any personal flexibility issues you might have that make it harder to lean forward from the hips, and straighten the back more.

It's a process. Don't be afraid to experiment. When you come to a bike forum for fit advice, a lot of it will not consider what you find a position of comfort. It's just the way it is.....I can't feel what's comfortable for you.
Got it ... So atleast I know from you guys now that it's not too big and I will just have to get used to bending down more and experiment for the time being I guess.
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Old 06-13-19, 10:52 AM
  #42  
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I would say that the saddle looks a little high, and that you might read saddle height threads, simple heel on the pedal, spin backwards is one place to start. After that, you might feel better stretching farther forward. Really best DIY is to find a good fitting vid and follow it all the way through. One that mentions how to measure inseam properly (Not Pants!) by using a book against your pubic bone, would get you into a better position , then come back to this thread!
Best regards, Eric
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Old 06-13-19, 03:58 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
Got it ... So atleast I know from you guys now that it's not too big and I will just have to get used to bending down more and experiment for the time being I guess.
...I'm not certain "bending down more" is exactly what I meant. If your back hurts when you ride this, there's a very good reason for it. And if your back hurts every time you ride it, you won't ride it much. there are a whole complex of muscles and ligaments involved in your hip and pelvic regions.

If you are doing anything for the first time, you often need to discover what your body is capable of, and sometimes how to improve on that.

So for assuming a proper road position on a bicycle with drops, there are some areas that you will probably need to stretch regularly to improve flexion. There are a lot of recommended stretches for cyclists pages floating around on the web, and yoga will definitely clue you in on how far off yoga normal you are in the tight places. I personally have lifetime issues with the psoas muscle. It's my personal cross in life.

Anyway the general "feeling" you want to encourage is bending from low down, in the hips. And keep your back relatively straight, sometimes even reversing the curve so you are stretching the spine a little in reverse curve, not a forward curve.

Your current body position in the photos will continue to cause back pain, if I had to guess. But yes..adapt gradually to this new endeavor.
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Old 06-14-19, 05:41 AM
  #44  
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The bike looks a bit small for you, not too big!
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Old 06-14-19, 05:48 AM
  #45  
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Old 06-14-19, 05:51 AM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by le mans View Post
The bike looks a bit small for you, not too big!
It's an XL reportedly and I'm just 6 feet tall ... It had the stem going down at first and I brought it up ... Do you think that's the issue? It really felt like my shoulders were having to lean forward a lot when I first got it.

Honestly I'm starting to think this was all about me not being used to the riding positions .... I think I will make minor adjustments and just keep riding for a while and then come back to determine whether something needs to be done after I haveore experience / flexibility ECT
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Old 06-14-19, 05:57 AM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by oik01 View Post
It's an XL reportedly and I'm just 6 feet tall ... It had the stem going down at first and I brought it up ... Do you think that's the issue? It really felt like my shoulders were having to lean forward a lot when I first got it.

Honestly I'm starting to think this was all about me not being used to the riding positions .... I think I will make minor adjustments and just keep riding for a while and then come back to determine whether something needs to be done after I haveore experience / flexibility ECT
Measure the seat tube as i illustrated in that picture

Personally, i think you'd be better off putting the original stem back on.. as it shouldn't bend down.. it would probably be level, and bend your hip to reach the hoods not arch your back or your shoulders

Last edited by le mans; 06-14-19 at 06:01 AM.
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Old 06-14-19, 06:03 AM
  #48  
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Old 06-18-19, 06:42 AM
  #49  
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The bike does not look too big to me. I would not change anything (except maybe seat adjustment) until you ride it for a while. I rode mountain bikes for decades before owning a road bike. Completely different riding position, technique, etc! Took a while for me to feel comfortable on my road bike (I did put on a shorter stem-from what I've read LeMond bikes may have a longer than avg.top tube?) Anyway, after a while, I became comfortable on it. Now my mtn.bike feels odd! Probably just need to increase flexibility and maybe some core strength--not uncommon if you haven't been riding a road bike. Go out, ride, and enjoy your new bike, before going about changing a lot out-you might not need to.
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