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Genesis Croix de Fer for loaded touring

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Genesis Croix de Fer for loaded touring

Old 06-18-19, 12:26 PM
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NeoY2k
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Genesis Croix de Fer for loaded touring

Hello,
I am having issues with my current frame, and need replacing it (quickly as I leave in 3 weeks for 4 weeks on the road).

I am considering the Genesis Croix de fer and Tour de fer framesets because I can get them on time and they were the only ones I could test ride. Wanted a Disc Trucker but they start in 700 wheels at size 56 which is too large and I can't test ride it.)

The Tour de Fer is designed for loaded touring, but it feels really too long in size M. Size S is definately too short. Its handling seems better suited though.
The Croix de Fer is not designed for loaded touring. It fits me well in size M. Concerned about its handling when loaded (bike) and tired (rider).

Would you tour with front and rear racks, a 17-20kg carried load and 80kg rider, on a Croix de Fer?
Won't its short 430mm chainstays be too short handling wise?
I'm especially concerned by its geometry/road handling. Durability, heck, with all that 3,7kg of steel it better be strong.

On a side note: I test rode both for about an hour each and to me both just feel dull, uninspiring, and they weight a ton. The only less-inspiring bike I rode was a VSF TX400 I quickly sold. My messed-up-kinda-Kona Rove-Al feels much more spirited. I'm pretty shocked by the price they ask for what seems to me basic utility frames, unless I'm missing something...
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Old 06-18-19, 04:29 PM
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djb
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I take it you have never done any loaded touring? I ask that because you say both bikes felt dull and weighing a ton (unloaded)
I looked at the prices and found the prices shocking also, basically double what a good touring bike with proper gearing (the tour de fer is still over geared for loaded touring, 50/39/30 and a 11-32)

the price of 1600 pounds is about 1000 canadian dollars more than a good touring bike here--but I know Rip Off Britain is still a reality for you guys and has been for a long time.

it seems to me that there are dawes and other available models in the UK for less than that, but lets face it, you've got 3 weeks to sort out it all, so I wish I could help, but don't know these bikes.

clearly the roadie isnt an option for loaded touring, but perhaps on british touring forums you can find proper opinions from people who have the tour de fer.

the tour de fer with stock gearing has a low gear of about 25-26 gear inches, which from my experience going back a while has shown me from bad experiences that this is not low enough, especially when you get into lots of steep hills.

and also, I know that the tiagra crankset of 50/39/30 has a bolt pattern than doesnt allow putting a smaller granny gear on, ie you are stuck with the 30t--this traditionally has been the easy, inexpensive way to get lower gearing.
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Old 06-19-19, 04:01 AM
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NeoY2k
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I have already quite reasonable touring experience. And I have all the components for touring, which were on a first bike, then the second which has problems, so just looking for a frame.
And even for loaded touring, the genesis bikes felt dull and weighting a ton by themselves!
Their price is pretty ridicule for gas pipe bikes (might be Reynolds 725 but come on, 3.8kg a frame? Even Surly LHTs are closer to 3kg and they are targeted to heavier RTW use!)

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Old 06-19-19, 07:23 AM
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Originally Posted by NeoY2k View Post
I have already quite reasonable touring experience. And I have all the components for touring, which were on a first bike, then the second which has problems, so just looking for a frame.
And even for loaded touring, the genesis bikes felt dull and weighting a ton by themselves!
Their price is pretty ridicule for gas pipe bikes (might be Reynolds 725 but come on, 3.8kg a frame? Even Surly LHTs are closer to 3kg and they are targeted to heavier RTW use!)
I understand about the "feel" of a bike. This is an important part of the pleasure of riding a bike.
As an example, I purposely got a Surly Troll rather than a LHT, and one of the main reasons was because I very much prefer the nimble, quick handling characteristic of the essentially mountain bike Troll--I even switched mine to dropbars. I also chose it for the much larger fatter tire possibilities.

re the Troll, even loaded up, it steers reasonbly quickly on downhills, so at 30, 40, 50kph, it is faster steering than my other bikes loaded, --yes, it is still slow, but its better than other bikes in my opinion, and I REALLY like this, especially for skirting potholes or whatever on descents.

so I guess you have your answer there, if the bike feels dull already and you have an informed, capable observation of this (opposed to someone who has only ever ridden light, super responsive road bikes), then this aspect of the genesis bikes would bug the heck out of you.

as another example, I replaced an old tourer of mine about 10 years ago. I ended up gettng a cyclocross bike with cantis, alum frame and a triple drivetrain. From the get go, I liked how much more responsive it was than my old steel tourer unloaded, and yet with panniers it is still pretty good for handling a load--sure, it is not as sturdy as a LHT or other heavy tourer, but its not bad.
Its just not the best for heavily loaded riding, and the cf has to be careful of.

again, good luck
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Old 06-19-19, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by NeoY2k View Post
I have already quite reasonable touring experience. And I have all the components for touring, which were on a first bike, then the second which has problems, so just looking for a frame.
And even for loaded touring, the genesis bikes felt dull and weighting a ton by themselves!
Their price is pretty ridicule for gas pipe bikes (might be Reynolds 725 but come on, 3.8kg a frame? Even Surly LHTs are closer to 3kg and they are targeted to heavier RTW use!)
https://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bike/tour-de-fer-fs

The 3.8kg is for frame, fork, headset, and seatpost collar. The headset and collar will be 150g.
So the frame and fork weigh about 3.65g together. That isn't light, but its right in line with a 58cm Surly DT frame and fork.

As for calling the tubing gaspipe...its HT 725. Get some perspective and stop throwing a fit on a forum. Good lord. They clearly used thicker gauge tubing, given the purpose.

And the frameset sells for 500pounds which is $634usd. Seriously- what do you expect a new frame, fork, headset, and collar from an established brand to cost? That listed price seems quite reasonable.



The frame doesnt fit, you dislike the weight, and you think it cost a too much.
Why are you considering it?
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Old 06-19-19, 08:56 PM
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Neo
Where are you? Uk? And why not look at dedicated touring bikes you can see in stores.
What issue with your existing bike?
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