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New Canyon Gravel/Trail bike to be released tomorrow...

Cyclocross and Gravelbiking (Recreational) This has to be the most physically intense sport ever invented. It's high speed bicycle racing on a short off road course or riding the off pavement rides on gravel like :The Dirty Kanza". We also have a dedicated Racing forum for the Cyclocross Hard Core Racers.

New Canyon Gravel/Trail bike to be released tomorrow...

Old 03-14-18, 02:29 PM
  #1  
chas58
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New Canyon Gravel/Trail bike to be released tomorrow...

Lets wait and see?

650B?
Gravel specific handlebars?
Other funky Canyon innovations?

Gravel + Trail = GRAIL
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Old 03-14-18, 04:42 PM
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Links to pics and teaser videos here https://ridinggravel.forumchitchat.c...pid=1303561446
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Old 03-15-18, 05:56 AM
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Old 03-15-18, 06:04 AM
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Man, are those bars hideous. Deal killer, to me (not that I'm in the market for another bike at the moment).
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Old 03-15-18, 06:48 AM
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So they intentionally made a bike where you cannot use a different bar/stem combo. No real stack/reach adjustment. Idiots. Also at a wild guess you cannot use aerobars. I'm not even sure what Garmin out-front mount you could use with that bar. Also only 2 waterbottle holders

Just WTF.

Is that a 490mm class axle/crown fork too?
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Old 03-15-18, 08:06 AM
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I lol'd at the stem and bars. What a mess, I can see where they were going conceptually but it missed the mark by a lot. Looks especially ridiculous in the pictures with multiple bikes.



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Old 03-15-18, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Spoonrobot View Post
I lol'd at the stem and bars. What a mess, I can see where they were going conceptually but it missed the mark by a lot. Looks especially ridiculous in the pictures with multiple bikes.



http://cdn2.cyclist.co.uk/sites/cycl...?itok=F9MBMi1M
They totally remind of a sci-fi space fighter ship, but I can't put my finger on it.

Edit: Here we go - it's the damn Romulans!


Last edited by WhyFi; 03-15-18 at 08:14 AM.
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Old 03-15-18, 08:22 AM
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Cannondale, ages ago: Hey cycling world, we've made this weird one-sided fork that is super proprietary and needs a special wheel and only fits our frames. But it works.
Specialized, recently: Hey cycling world, we've "reinvented" the suspension stem, but made it proprietary. Also, ZERTZ® IN EVERYTHING! Some of the stuff works. Sort of.
Canyon, just now: Hold our beer.

But seriously, the 4" of aero section in the middle of the "top" bar? WHY!?
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Old 03-15-18, 08:46 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
Cannondale, ages ago: Hey cycling world, we've made this weird one-sided fork that is super proprietary and needs a special wheel and only fits our frames. But it works.
Specialized, recently: Hey cycling world, we've "reinvented" the suspension stem, but made it proprietary. Also, ZERTZ® IN EVERYTHING! Some of the stuff works. Sort of.
Canyon, just now: Hold our beer.

But seriously, the 4" of aero section in the middle of the "top" bar? WHY!?

To keep you from using any Garmin or Wahoo out-front computer.
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Old 03-15-18, 10:25 AM
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I don't know what to say other than, don't design a bike on lsd. The other manufacturers must be relieved. One less category where Canyon would have stolen sales.
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Old 03-15-18, 10:41 AM
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Old 03-15-18, 10:45 AM
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I like that they are trying something new and aiming for more of a road-gravel hybrid, but IMO gravel bikes are all about utility and this seems to fly in the face of that. It's more of a comfy carbon road bike. Definitely not for me.
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Old 03-15-18, 10:50 AM
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How long until they redesign it with more normal handlebars? Should we start a pool? (How long until someone breaks their wrists while holding the lower bar?)
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Old 03-15-18, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
How long until they redesign it with more normal handlebars? Should we start a pool? (How long until someone breaks their wrists while holding the lower bar?)
I give it one model year and it's done...out. I tried but I just don't get it, it looks painfull without even riding.
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Old 03-15-18, 10:24 PM
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Just for an FYI, I learned from a dude who would know that the bar has threaded inserts for attaching an out front mount. Proprietary, most likely. He also said the bar makes no sense to him, but the Germans (that is, Canyon) are crazy about it. If you could see an in-house breakdown of Canyon's model lineup, that handlebar would start to make sense.
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Old 03-16-18, 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by WhyFi View Post
Man, are those bars hideous. Deal killer, to me (not that I'm in the market for another bike at the moment).
Me too. You'd think they would have done a focus group or at least ask some riders to see what their reactions would be.
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Old 03-16-18, 03:04 AM
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Originally Posted by DrIsotope View Post
Just for an FYI, I learned from a dude who would know that the bar has threaded inserts for attaching an out front mount. Proprietary, most likely. He also said the bar makes no sense to him, but the Germans (that is, Canyon) are crazy about it. If you could see an in-house breakdown of Canyon's model lineup, that handlebar would start to make sense.
From the bikeradar video posted above:

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Old 03-16-18, 12:58 PM
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^^

A Barfly Spoon or any similar mount will work for that.

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Old 03-16-18, 02:58 PM
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A reasonable review of the bike with a good explanation of the bar.

First Ride: Canyon Grail CF and that unusual 'Hover Bar' | VeloNews.com


-Tim-
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Old 03-16-18, 03:42 PM
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I'd never be in the market to spend that much on a bike anyway but I see some high end models and can appreciate the design but I'm not that impressed with this one visually at least. I'm a strong believer in diminishing returns and this is well past the sweet spot for me on value vs performance. I've also heard reports of customer service being poor and their warranty is much shorter than lets say Giant and with lower rider weight limits. Lastly from what I've read Giant make superior carbon frames to Quest although Quest are very good. I guess my point is Giant seem a lot more premium to me in both product and customer service. I'd take a higher quality frame over a more innovative design I think especially when the innovation doesn't look that good. Saying that I really like the look of the bike until you get to the handlebars and stem which don't work for me and ruin it.
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Old 03-16-18, 08:12 PM
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I'm not opposed to trying out new technology. What I can't understand is why any new gravel bike to the market isn't make room for at least 45 wide tires. This one will only take 42's which would be a show a stopper for me.
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Old 03-16-18, 08:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Planemaker View Post
I'm not opposed to trying out new technology. What I can't understand is why any new gravel bike to the market isn't make room for at least 45 wide tires. This one will only take 42's which would be a show a stopper for me.
Wider than 45s start causing problems:

A) Frameset clearance

You have to get very creative with chainstay geometry to even get to 45mm. Either a yolk like my Carver, or a droopy stay like the OpenUP

B) Drivetrain compatibility

Due to the wide tires, chainline gets to be a problem (chain clearing the tire and FD cage clearing too). Also for crank arms to clear the wide stay, you need an MTB crankset. There's also gearing problems as 73mm std based cranks aren't geared higher than 42T

And there's also the "is it worth the effort?" question....on my Bigfoot rig, the times I've found 44-45mm tires inadequate, I honestly would have wanted a 4" tire to enjoy the pea gravel. Above 45mm tires, I'd want a fat-tire rigid MTB.
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Old 03-16-18, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
Wider than 45s start causing problems:

A) Frameset clearance

You have to get very creative with chainstay geometry to even get to 45mm. Either a yolk like my Carver, or a droopy stay like the OpenUP

B) Drivetrain compatibility

Due to the wide tires, chainline gets to be a problem (chain clearing the tire and FD cage clearing too). Also for crank arms to clear the wide stay, you need an MTB crankset. There's also gearing problems as 73mm std based cranks aren't geared higher than 42T

And there's also the "is it worth the effort?" question....on my Bigfoot rig, the times I've found 44-45mm tires inadequate, I honestly would have wanted a 4" tire to enjoy the pea gravel. Above 45mm tires, I'd want a fat-tire rigid MTB.
Thanks
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Old 03-17-18, 03:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
Wider than 45s start causing problems:

A) Frameset clearance

You have to get very creative with chainstay geometry to even get to 45mm. Either a yolk like my Carver, or a droopy stay like the OpenUP

B) Drivetrain compatibility

Due to the wide tires, chainline gets to be a problem (chain clearing the tire and FD cage clearing too). Also for crank arms to clear the wide stay, you need an MTB crankset. There's also gearing problems as 73mm std based cranks aren't geared higher than 42T

And there's also the "is it worth the effort?" question....on my Bigfoot rig, the times I've found 44-45mm tires inadequate, I honestly would have wanted a 4" tire to enjoy the pea gravel. Above 45mm tires, I'd want a fat-tire rigid MTB.
I know that's not racey and cool but you can just simply lengthen the chainstays...

I would like to run 45-47s. Where I live we don't really have gravel roads, mainly just dirt roads that are a bit rougher. I mix paved roads with offroad on my rides, and sometimes I would like a bit more plush than what my 37s give me. The "gravel" tyre selection is still the biggest in 38-40mm tho I think.

I would really like an MTB, but the terrain where I live is too boring for it, and I find a nice elevated drop bar much much more comfortable than a straight handlebar even on 1-1,5 hour rides.

Last edited by Facanh; 03-17-18 at 04:04 AM.
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Old 03-17-18, 06:17 AM
  #25  
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That bar would be a deal breaker for me, even if the height were more adjustable. You only get bump absorption when you're in the tops, and I'm hardly ever in the tops. I grab the tops when I want to take a quick breather. A suspension stem would be 100x better.
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