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Light Bicycle Wheels

Road Cycling It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle. -- Ernest Hemingway

Light Bicycle Wheels

Old 03-10-19, 10:16 AM
  #76  
deepakvrao
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
I wanted to go wider(for my Domane Disc), and these aren't the old school V shape. Compare the LB profile to these from Enve.

https://www.enve.com/en/products/ses-4-5-ar/
Thanks again :-)

Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
You're still in Bangalore, India? It probably won't effect you. If you're in the USA--it is complicated.

A) The headline tariffs of "25%" on aluminum and steel....are for unfinished raw metal (as quantified by value/weight)--NOT finished or quasi-finished product. Meaning if you import a 500kg steel brick, you pay and extra 25%. If you import 500kg of steel spokes--you don't pay that particular tariff. If you order a set of bicycle wheels--you don't pay these either. UNFINISHED here is the key. There's an entire field in business called "tariff engineering" intended to find ways to bypass tariffs (see the Chicken Tax)

B) Lots of bicycle related tariffs got added--more likely to hit home that the raw metal tariffs. On things like ball bearings, bicycle components, etc.

D) It is up to the shipper to correctly file the bill of shipping as to what as in the box and to correctly ding it for tariffs. Something FedEx/UPS/DHL are renowned for not doing.

E) Now if you're in the USA and are ordering Light-Bicycle wheels...it depends on if you order from their US distributor, or are doing a custom order shipping from China. My set came from their USA warehouse, no extra tariffs. Cannot speak for direct-from-China.
Yes, I live in India, but ordering these from their global site to the US
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Old 03-10-19, 08:08 PM
  #77  
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Thanks everyone for the help and advise. Just ordered the 56mm with white decals.
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Old 03-10-19, 08:20 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
Didn't know how to tag a person, so quoted instead.

Any reason you guys didn't prefer to get the 45 and 55 rims which have the U shape? Isn't U supposed to be better in wind?
I also wanted the wider rims, so that I could run a 25mm tire and have it still be aero. It's not true to the 105% rule, but it's better than my other setup, the rim is slightly wider than the tire. I might try a 23mm up front and see if there's any noticeable difference, but for now I'm enjoying the 25mm. I haven't had any handling problems in the wind.


Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
Thanks everyone for the help and advise. Just ordered the 56mm with white decals.
Awesome, hope you like them!
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Old 03-11-19, 07:10 AM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
Thanks everyone for the help and advise. Just ordered the 56mm with white decals.
enjoy! And please post any thoughts and such when you get them
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Old 03-11-19, 05:39 PM
  #80  
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Wet braking performance report. I don't usually ride in the rain, but sometimes Mother Nature has other plans. I went out for my first century ride today, weather was absolutely perfect, there was a very slight chance of rain later in the day, but figured I'd be ok. Well that slight chance turned into 100%, and it was a downpour for the last 30 miles of my ride. Braking performance was slightly decreased, as I imagine it is with all carbon wheels, but with just a little extra pressure I had absolutely no trouble stopping and at no time did I feel unsafe. I don't plan to ride on them regularly in the rain (when the weather is bad I just go run instead of ride lol), but it's good to know that if I get caught out there again, that I don't have to worry.
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Old 03-12-19, 03:35 AM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
I got a reply from LB about the lack of progress(8 days in "sanding" process). They said the black/stealth decals I ordered were out of stock, but that they are now back, and the wheelset will ship out on Wednesday.
How many days from the preparation to the sanding?

Interesting the way one can follow the build.
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Old 03-12-19, 07:09 AM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
How many days from the preparation to the sanding?

Interesting the way one can follow the build.
It took 6 days to get to the sanding. When I placed the order, I asked them how long to expect the build to take. They said it would be 10-13 days to build, and 5-7 days for shipping.
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Old 03-12-19, 07:57 AM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
It took 6 days to get to the sanding. When I placed the order, I asked them how long to expect the build to take. They said it would be 10-13 days to build, and 5-7 days for shipping.
For me, the time is crucial. My wife is making a trip to Philly first week April. If I miss this, I can collect it only in Nov, when we will also be doing local flights in the US, and I'll have to pay for each local flight for the wheels. Keeping my fingers crossed.
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Old 03-12-19, 08:02 AM
  #84  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
For me, the time is crucial. My wife is making a trip to Philly first week April. If I miss this, I can collect it only in Nov, when we will also be doing local flights in the US, and I'll have to pay for each local flight for the wheels. Keeping my fingers crossed.
Have you asked if they'll ship direct to you? You risk paying 2X sets of import tariffs, in addition to shipping 2-3X.
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Old 03-12-19, 08:16 AM
  #85  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
Have you asked if they'll ship direct to you? You risk paying 2X sets of import tariffs, in addition to shipping 2-3X.
I thought that thereb is no import duty in the US upto 800 dollars? I often ship from bike24 to the US.

In India, the customs is over 50%, unreliable as to time, and the shipping to India is almost double of the shipping to the US. I might as well buy a big brand name wheelset ;-)
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Old 03-12-19, 08:33 AM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
I thought that thereb is no import duty in the US upto 800 dollars? I often ship from bike24 to the US.

In India, the customs is over 50%, unreliable as to time, and the shipping to India is almost double of the shipping to the US. I might as well buy a big brand name wheelset ;-)
Okay, now what you're doing, and your questions, make sense.

The duty "de minimis" value was raised to $800USD in 2016....now so much of this tariff war crap is being written practically on the back of a napkin, I cannot find accurate reporting as to what it is now. The USA bicycle industry has been pushing to lower the minimis value to 1/10 that since the trade war started.

People can tell you with US importing...even before the trade war--shipper like FedEx and UPS and DHL (from the EU) were routinely charging inapplicable tariffs when they shouldn't have--and demanding exhorbitant "convenience" and "brokerage fees" for doing so...and holding your goods hostage until you paid. It was fairly common internet knowledge if buying Campagnolo from the UK (cheap) to always ask for Royal Mail shipping and NOT UPS/FedEx/etc due to this.

Welcome to the wonderful world of import/export law.
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Old 03-12-19, 09:27 AM
  #87  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
Okay, now what you're doing, and your questions, make sense.

The duty "de minimis" value was raised to $800USD in 2016....now so much of this tariff war crap is being written practically on the back of a napkin, I cannot find accurate reporting as to what it is now. The USA bicycle industry has been pushing to lower the minimis value to 1/10 that since the trade war started.

People can tell you with US importing...even before the trade war--shipper like FedEx and UPS and DHL (from the EU) were routinely charging inapplicable tariffs when they shouldn't have--and demanding exhorbitant "convenience" and "brokerage fees" for doing so...and holding your goods hostage until you paid. It was fairly common internet knowledge if buying Campagnolo from the UK (cheap) to always ask for Royal Mail shipping and NOT UPS/FedEx/etc due to this.

Welcome to the wonderful world of import/export law.
Still didn't get why you said I m ight risk double import duties?
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Old 03-12-19, 09:32 AM
  #88  
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Originally Posted by deepakvrao View Post
Still didn't get why you said I m ight risk double import duties?
My thought was....You (might) get dinged on import duties into the US...but you might also get dinged for import duties into India too. I don't know India import/export law or their duties enforcement....but I'd expect that, carrying a large box with wheels in it through an airport, India customs will ask you (or your wife) what is in the box...and its value.

If you've done this before...and gotten away with it (because, legally, you are "getting away with it")...then feel free to ignore
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Old 03-12-19, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
My thought was....You (might) get dinged on import duties into the US...but you might also get dinged for import duties into India too. I don't know India import/export law or their duties enforcement....but I'd expect that, carrying a large box with wheels in it through an airport, India customs will ask you (or your wife) what is in the box...and its value.

If you've done this before...and gotten away with it (because, legally, you are "getting away with it")...then feel free to ignore

Got it.

I have no problems breaking rules in India [we pay **** loads of taxes that are just pocketed by the politicians] but, for what It's worth, this is actually legal. One can carry in 750 dollars of stuff by flight, so, my wife would be even legally within her right.

Different matter that next month I am getting a 4000 dollar bike shipped to France, and bringing it back with me. :-)
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Old 03-12-19, 12:40 PM
  #90  
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Very interested in getting one of these wheelsets myself.

What do you all make of this "review" from 2015 of the LB wheelsets? One of the only reviews I could find online, but it is a mountainbike wheelset:

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mt...er-rim-review/

Thanks!
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Old 03-12-19, 12:51 PM
  #91  
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Originally Posted by maartendc View Post
Very interested in getting one of these wheelsets myself.

What do you all make of this "review" from 2015 of the LB wheelsets? One of the only reviews I could find online, but it is a mountainbike wheelset:

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mt...er-rim-review/

Thanks!
I saw that when I was researching LB wheels, I take it as a testament to the build quality. He ran the pressure too low, even for a mountain bike, and cracked the wheel, but it still didn't fail completely and he was able to keep riding.
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Old 03-12-19, 12:55 PM
  #92  
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Originally Posted by maartendc View Post
Very interested in getting one of these wheelsets myself.

What do you all make of this "review" from 2015 of the LB wheelsets? One of the only reviews I could find online, but it is a mountainbike wheelset:

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mt...er-rim-review/

Thanks!
Id put most of the blame on the reviewer(he blamed himself), and from the sound of it, an Aluminium hoop would be trashed as well.
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Old 03-12-19, 01:16 PM
  #93  
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Nice post - was looking for the long miles review for the carbon wheel set.

I was looking to a carbon wheels at the beginning of the year and after reading all good and bad reviews of unbranded carbon wheel set,
ended up with alloy H+Son Archetype and paired with Bitex hubs RAR12 and RAF12 and Sapim Laser spokes + brass nipples. 24h rear and 20h front.
I am not a racer, more an endurance rider.
Building my first set of wheels myself was a fun project and it came out light at 1422 gr and below 4 Benjamin's.

Next year or 2021 I will be looking for some cheap carbon frame.
Is there any similar thread like this about frames?
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Old 03-12-19, 03:03 PM
  #94  
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Originally Posted by maartendc View Post
Very interested in getting one of these wheelsets myself.

What do you all make of this "review" from 2015 of the LB wheelsets? One of the only reviews I could find online, but it is a mountainbike wheelset:

https://www.singletracks.com/blog/mt...er-rim-review/

Thanks!
The reviewer (rightly) sounds accepting of the fact he killed wheels--not that they failed. That the lasted such abuse and improper repair ends up being a compliment.

As is common with all bleeding edge products...old reviews skew things because products change so fast.
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Old 03-12-19, 06:43 PM
  #95  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
The reviewer (rightly) sounds accepting of the fact he killed wheels--not that they failed. That the lasted such abuse and improper repair ends up being a compliment.

As is common with all bleeding edge products...old reviews skew things because products change so fast.
Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
Id put most of the blame on the reviewer(he blamed himself), and from the sound of it, an Aluminium hoop would be trashed as well.
Originally Posted by Rides4Beer View Post
I saw that when I was researching LB wheels, I take it as a testament to the build quality. He ran the pressure too low, even for a mountain bike, and cracked the wheel, but it still didn't fail completely and he was able to keep riding.
Interesting. I don't really have experience with breaking rims, so good to hear that this kind of damage is not out of the ordinary when abused.

What hubs would you recommend for a rim brake version? I am looking for a cheapish build. Bitex or Novatec hubs? Or stick with DT Swiss 350, although they are about 150g heavier? DT 240 is out of the question in terms of budget I think.

Thanks!
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Old 03-12-19, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by maartendc View Post
Interesting. I don't really have experience with breaking rims, so good to hear that this kind of damage is not out of the ordinary when abused.

What hubs would you recommend for a rim brake version? I am looking for a cheapish build. Bitex or Novatec hubs? Or stick with DT Swiss 350, although they are about 150g heavier? DT 240 is out of the question in terms of budget I think.

Thanks!
IMHO...TL;DR if you have the money get the DT350s. They are nice durable hubs that make for nice strong wheels.

I have a set of Bitex laced Pacenti SL25 hoops....and the Bitex, for what they are--they're not bad. What they are, is bottom-dollar cartridge bearing hubs. But the freehub isn't that durable, even "anti-notch" revision will notch because they only reinforce one side of the splines. But cheap hub, there you go. The ratchet/pawl engagement is okay but I've found it hit/miss on one of the pawls.....resulting in one pawl not fully seating sometimes--resulting in a frustrating loud "BANG" when applying power--as the pawl fully seats.....They work and spin well, but they won't put a grin on your face as much as a nice hub probably would.

Faint praise is faint, as you may have noticed.
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Old 03-12-19, 07:33 PM
  #97  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
I have a set of Bitex laced Pacenti SL25 hoops....and the Bitex, for what they are--they're not bad. What they are, is bottom-dollar cartridge bearing hubs. But the freehub isn't that durable, even "anti-notch" revision will notch because they only reinforce one side of the splines. But cheap hub, there you go. The ratchet/pawl engagement is okay but I've found it hit/miss on one of the pawls.....resulting in one pawl not fully seating sometimes--resulting in a frustrating loud "BANG" when applying power--as the pawl fully seats.....They work and spin well, but they won't put a grin on your face as much as a nice hub probably would.

Faint praise is faint, as you may have noticed.
+1 about Bitex hubs.Both Bitex, and Novatec use tiny bearings, so wear can be an issue for heavier riders(or off-road use). Luckily it's cheap + easy to replace them.

I've used Novatec hubs(291/482 SB, and 291/482 SB-SL) for several builds, with very good results. I chose Novatec 411/412 hubs because I'll be using this wheelset for road only, and most of the roads in my are are quite good.

The DT350 upgade is a pretty good value through LB, but it would put you slightly over budget.
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Old 03-12-19, 11:07 PM
  #98  
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I did the calculation, the DT350 SP centerlock came out to be $250 from LB, decent value but you can get a set for $230 on eBay, wait for a 15% off coupon that's $190 for the set, of course you will have to build the wheel yourself
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Old 03-13-19, 06:48 AM
  #99  
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Originally Posted by Marcus_Ti View Post
IMHO...TL;DR if you have the money get the DT350s. They are nice durable hubs that make for nice strong wheels.

I have a set of Bitex laced Pacenti SL25 hoops....and the Bitex, for what they are--they're not bad. What they are, is bottom-dollar cartridge bearing hubs. But the freehub isn't that durable, even "anti-notch" revision will notch because they only reinforce one side of the splines. But cheap hub, there you go. The ratchet/pawl engagement is okay but I've found it hit/miss on one of the pawls.....resulting in one pawl not fully seating sometimes--resulting in a frustrating loud "BANG" when applying power--as the pawl fully seats.....They work and spin well, but they won't put a grin on your face as much as a nice hub probably would.

Faint praise is faint, as you may have noticed.
Originally Posted by noodle soup View Post
+1 about Bitex hubs.Both Bitex, and Novatec use tiny bearings, so wear can be an issue for heavier riders(or off-road use). Luckily it's cheap + easy to replace them.

I've used Novatec hubs(291/482 SB, and 291/482 SB-SL) for several builds, with very good results. I chose Novatec 411/412 hubs because I'll be using this wheelset for road only, and most of the roads in my are are quite good.

The DT350 upgade is a pretty good value through LB, but it would put you slightly over budget.
Ok thanks so much for the honest feedback guys! I had heard mainly good things about Bitex hubs before. I guess they are good for the money, but you get what you pay for.

Hmmm, I was looking at the Bitex and Novatec hubs mainly for their reduced weight.. they are about 150g lighter than the DT Swiss 350. The cost is not that significant only $100 more for the DT Swiss.

I guess the weight and cost savings are not worth it for the reduced durability and lackluster performance?

What about the spokes? They offer both Sapim CX Ray and Pillar Aero X-tra. About $40 between them, same weight. I am tempted to just go for the name brand of Sapim here. Any experience with the Pillar spokes?

Thanks!
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Old 03-13-19, 09:19 AM
  #100  
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Originally Posted by maartendc View Post
Ok thanks so much for the honest feedback guys! I had heard mainly good things about Bitex hubs before. I guess they are good for the money, but you get what you pay for.

Hmmm, I was looking at the Bitex and Novatec hubs mainly for their reduced weight.. they are about 150g lighter than the DT Swiss 350. The cost is not that significant only $100 more for the DT Swiss.

I guess the weight and cost savings are not worth it for the reduced durability and lackluster performance?

What about the spokes? They offer both Sapim CX Ray and Pillar Aero X-tra. About $40 between them, same weight. I am tempted to just go for the name brand of Sapim here. Any experience with the Pillar spokes?

Thanks!
If you are a heavier rider, or riding on bad roads/gravel, DT350 would be a better choice, but be sure to get the 36t or 54t ratchet upgrade.

I've built wheels with Pillar, DT Swiss, Sapim, and Wheelsmith spokes, and never had a problem. All make high quality spokes, but DT + Sapim think a lot of their products( #overpriced.).They cost more, but they have to pay for all that marketing somehow.

MAC / CN Spoke are pure trash. Never buy wheels from anyone that uses those.
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