USAZorro

I have long held an interest in the old, and the obscure, and am not put off by "old soldiers. I pulled the trigger on an old French bicycle last night which I can find precious little information about. It has just begun its journey from France, and all I know about it is that it is my size, has patina, was made by a company that had its origins about a century ago in a small town in the Loire valley (hence Eriol ... Loire), and that the company made motorcycles for a time as well as a few other mechanical devices that were used in agriculture, AND that also made tandems (as evidenced by a lovely vintage poster which one will be bombarded with Pinterest links to if you Google the marque).

Frankly, I'm not certain of the age, but as it comes complete with headset and bottom bracket, I anticipate dodging some of the headaches that one hears of whilst building up a French frame.

If anyone knows ANYTHING, or cares to speculate about anything, I'm all ears. Am eager to know the age, the tubing used (there's a sticker that I can't make out, and which Velo Base doesn't contain), and anything about the marque, what it might have been originally built up with, or what size wheels it would likely have been fitted with. Note there is a right-side-only shift lever boss that appears similar in concept to what Simplex (and possibly others) made clamps to attach to - possibly suggesting it had both front and rear derailleurs?

The link to the sales posting is here.

Here's one of the sale images.

Hudson308 

Paging juvela
Whatever it is, looks interesting and cool. I like the obscure stuff, too!

bikemig 

eBay France is dangerous (as is eBay UK) but not as potentially dangerous as a project that starts out inexpensively . . .

tgenec86

Hey - once you get it in an measure it, I have a pristine Simplex seatpost that is getting very lonely. It might be the right size!

USAZorro

Appreciate the lead. I have an Ideale that will look just right on this. Would have to think about putting anything pristine on this though.

crank_addict

Like your style, USAzorro!

Keep the grime. Spray a coat of Pledge wax and Pepe le Pew will be happy.

Good call on having a frame like this include headset and bottom bracket. Depending on your build plans, finding parts and cost shouldn't be too much of a challenge. Kicker though are shipping from Europe. Using a claw for derailleur won't leave you hanging....

Tell us your build plans and hopefully I have some parts to donate.

TenGrainBread 

It's a Huret shifter boss. If you want to use a front derailleur this was the intended clamp to add on over the existing boss:

bikemig 

Here's an eriol that has been nicely restored:

https://forum.tontonvelo.com/viewtop...=28235&start=0


I love this poster:

nlerner

Love the patina! Will be interesting to see what wheel size it takes.

USAZorro

Thanks for the link to the restoration. I love the crankset on that. I think the one I purchased may be a few years older than that one. The paint on the restoration appears more like what I recall seeing in the late 60's to 70's. The paint on what I have coming reminds me of that on my 1949 Clubman, but also a 1970 Carlton Corsa that I picked up a few months ago.

JohnDThompson 

Simplex also used a mount like that:

USAZorro

I actually have one of those Simplex devices, and was thinking I would use it here.

Do you know when these came into being? That might give me a "not earlier than" date on this frame.

bertinjim 

USAZorro -

Cool poster. Try here as well and maybe some of the embedded links: https://forum.tontonvelo.com/viewtop...=1335&start=15

juvela

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Bonjour equipe,

For some reason I did not receive (lost?) Hudson308's page but seem to have wandered in in any event...

Frame bears a striking similarity to the Cote d'Azur cycle recently posted by member capnjonny -

https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-v...tery-bike.html

(lots of hi-res images here for you to compare)

Cote d'Azur is a Mercier owned badge (not a contract build).

The subject cadre here exhibits the same:

BOCAMA lug pattern 52/I

fork crown

dropouts

chainstay stop

top tube housing stops

bottom bracket shell

domed taper tube ends

Note also that the headset and seat binder of the Cote d'Azur are the same as those of the Eriol.

The Cote d'Azur has a different brake bridge than the subject Eriol; however it is the same distinctive one shown on the green Eriol at Tonton posted by Miguel. This bridge is curved, double drilled and has an inverted U cross section. It is a NERVEX product.

capnjonny's cycle appears to date from the 1965-66 time.

My guess, and it is only that, is that the subject frame may be contract made by Mercier.

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USAZorro

I did go straight to the link and noticed the similarities you mentioned.

Would you care to speculate on the approximate age of the Eriol?

Preliminary intention is to build it with Huret mechs, Simplex shifter, Atax stem, Ideale saddle, Nervar crank, TA chainring, some CLB levers, CLB or MAFAC calipers and Normandy or Atom hubs, and (unless I can find some nice 650B rims), some Mavic or Wolber clinchers.

dddd

I'm not very good at IDing old French frames, but my first guess also was Mercier.
Fork leg taper has me thinking Durifort tubing.

juvela

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did not get any specific date impressions

would guess it to be near to the time of the Cote d'Azur but that is only a guess

CLB brakes make sense for the build since it comes with a CLB front brake hanger

had not thought of 650B wheels; just assumed it to have been constructed for 700's

mixing Juy and Freres Huret in a gear ensemble is not something i would do as it sticks out like a sore thumb

Normandy/Atom hubs are everywhere. if my project, i might wish to keep and eye out for one of the Perrin badges such as Exceltoo, Newstar or Pelissier

if tubeset turns out to be Durifort that is the highest quality i think could be possible

have you been able to read the black transfer at the top of the seat tube?

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there be a wee spot o' Eriol information here you may wish to explore...

https://httpcyclomotosloire.e-monsite...e-en-a/ab.html

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juvela

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"EFMR" is one of a half dozen badges the company owned.

Here is an example from ca. MCML -

https://forum.tontonvelo.com/viewtop...=eriol#p439190

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USAZorro

I hadn't considered the faux-pa of mixing Huret and Simplex. I can't imagine that locating and acquiring a Huret shifter clamp would be a bank-breaker.

I had also assumed this would have come with 700c wheels. The passing thought I had was, "since it's French, why not make it as French as possible?" At any rate, I'm undecided about that detail. I will dry fit my 650B wheels when it arrives to see if that might even be a possibility. It looks from the pictures that frame and fork clearance wouldn't be issues, leaving brake reach to be what might torpedo that idea.

I do have a fondness for Pelissier hubs. Glad you mentioned them. Going all the way overboard with Maxi Cars was immediately ruled out (financially and aesthetically) given the aged appearance and modest pedigree.

Many thanks for your suggestions and for your input... not to mention the input and links that others have provided. I'm always open to suggestions - and I haven't even gotten to the point of considering fenders. bell, racks and (possibly) lighting.

juvela

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one correspondence with the Cote neglected to mention above is the seat stay treatment

sometimes these identity investigations remind me of DNA testing: one eventually gets to a point of 99.__% agreement and then must say "yes, its a duck"

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pump pegs are NERVEX item Nr. 848

brake bridge is NERVEX 600 serie (616-621)

chainstay stop looks to be NERVEX item Nr. 901

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marque history/chronolgy

document of 1927:




forum poster writes chronology beginning 1914:

https://forum.tontonvelo.com/posting...e&f=1&p=134495

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head of yet a third green Eriol example from the 1960's era (only image of this machine):




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combining Freres Huret and non-Huret bits in the same gear ensemble -

up until the mid-1970's Huret mechs had a mechanical advantage different from all other brands. so their shift levers have a unique drum size. one can mix and get away with it to some extent but it is not ideal. for example, Schwinn mixed Huret shift levers and front mechs with the Campag Gran Turismo rear mech on the Sports Tourer model of 1972.

beginning in about the mid-1970's Freres Huret (and subsequently Sachs-Huret) joined the rest of the known universe with regard to this variable.

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Etablissements Perrin hubs -

two other names they had (IIRC!) were Plume and Prior. suspect that both of these had gone out of production by the time your frame was manufactured.

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you inquired regarding dating -

will make a guesstimate of the 1964-67 window, but it is just a guesstimate

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USAZorro

Thanks for all the input. My very rough guesstimate was 50's -60's, the boss on the downtube suggested the early limit of 1955 (based on previous ownerships). I was partly hoping for earlier, as there's be some appeal to it being a bit older than my '49 Clubman (thanks again to clubman), but evidence seems to not support that fantasy.

juvela

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parameters to contemplate when considering possible wheel size change -

going to 650B will cause a net drop in shell height as the increase in tyre cross section is less than the reduction in wheel radius.

a lowered shell has a benefit in the ride quality known as "roll" (not mechanical resistance) but also increases the risk of catching a pedal in turns.

you wish to kit frameset in period fittings. with measurement, you may find the ideal CLB caliper set you would like to employ. it is unlikely to have the range to accommodate 650B. many forum members who convert to 650B from 700 or 27 end up using Tektro calipers to get the reach needed. this option would not fit your goals for the build.

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USAZorro

Understood. Not concerned about pedal strike, as I don't recall pedaling through a turn in ages, unless I'm heading uphill.

Brake reach is the obvious concern, and what I'll have the answer to when I dry fit a 650b wheel to the frame.

I know CLBs probably won't reach, but Racers... time will tell.

juvela

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Note on black transfer seen at top of seat tube -

this looked so familiar to me yet was unable to place it (rusty memory! )

so asked member non-fixie, who seems to know absolutely everything

he reports that the two letters just out of view due the curvature of the tube are L and U

word reads "LUXTUB" which is the house brand high-tensile tubing for Mercier

phrase at bottom of transfer is "Fabrication Garantie"

[all credit to @non-fixie]

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noglider 

I put the bike Tektro dual-pivot calipers on my 650b conversion. They are champs.

I don't care about lowering the BB. Somehow I'm able to adapt and not pedal through turns. And I'm not sure it's that much lower, either. For that matter, my Raleigh International which has original-size wheels seems to have a low BB, and I don't strike with that, either. The only place it really matters is with a fixed gear, because if you strike while fixed, you're going down (so I understand).