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Long Distance Competition/Ultracycling, Randonneuring and Endurance Cycling Do you enjoy centuries, double centuries, brevets, randonnees, and 24-hour time trials? Share ride reports, and exchange training, equipment, and nutrition information specific to long distance cycling. This isn't for tours, this is for endurance events cycling

Advice on solo double century

Old 03-15-17, 08:51 AM
  #26  
bluestacks867
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Wow, thanks for all of the detailed info, Drew. I will definitely study this and do and or plan for many of your suggestions. This is really valuable info I appreciate it.


Hi Richard -

Family life is good. I definitely cannot enjoy my hobbies anywhere near as much as a bachelor, but my wife and I have been making time for each other to exercise even with our work and taking care of our three young kids. She has lost 55 lbs since September last year. I lost 20 lbs since March of last year.

I don't really know how to explain my current fitness level but I can give it a shot. I am 33y/o 6'0" 164lbs. I am probably in the best shape of my life, although that is not saying a lot. I ran a marathon in November. Since then I have been focusing on swimming and cycling while maintaining 4-6 runs per week. Between swimming, cycling, and running I average about 11 hours of activities per week. I am building up to 15 in early May to prepare for my first triathlon, and 70.3. I feel great. 11 hours per week is to balance family life, no where near the edge of what I can handle.

My indoor FTP is 265w. My last long ride I maintained 154w for about 6 and a half hours outdoors. There was an extra hour of stopping but it was not all entirely needed. I could have only stopped a half hour if needed. I felt strong the entire time. I could have either increased watts or increased distance.

6.5 hours my longest time doing any activity, so I will be doing a little more than double that if all goes well on my ride.

Thanks for the well wishes. I will be sure to update the thread after the ride to let you all know how it went and lessons learned.
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Old 03-17-17, 11:21 AM
  #27  
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6.5 hours my longest time doing any activity, so I will be doing a little more than double that if all goes well on my ride.
What I wanted to know is whether you have years of aerobic base. In other words - either an active life due to career - or lots and lots of aerobic hours. Just because you may be able to complete a double - doesn't necessarily mean it will be good for you - or help in your tri aspirations.

The fact that you have a family, you are attempting an extreme distance - early in the year - are all warning flags. These are all aspects that compete against success - at least usually.

But hey - if its a "beauty day" - if you have a good night's sleep - if your wife is happy to see you "go for it" - then try it. But if you are really interested in "building a base" for the long run - I'd suggest aiming for 150 miles - let's say in then hours - and then making a special effort to eat and rest and recover properly afterward.

I know something about these things - and have seen smart people hurt themselves on rides that produce little glory - and even less satisfaction. And I know what it feels like to ride 200and come home to house of sleeping people and not have time to eat or recover or unwind. Good luck - you'll need at least a little.
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Old 03-29-17, 10:26 AM
  #28  
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Lots of great information in this thread, I'm learning from it.

OP - you sound very fit. In regards to cycling, it appears that your longest ride thus far is 112 miles, and you will be doing a double century.

Probably will turn out fine. But it does push the envelope a bit, in terms of the rules of thumb of how far someone can safely ride without injury based on prior training. Would be better if you do a 150 mile ride without issue 3 weeks before your double century.

When I started riding, I ramped up the saddle time / miles too quickly and developed achilles tendinitis that has been very difficult to address. I wish I had been more gradual in ramping up my training and skipped that century event. The time lost - in my case almost a year - from a chronic injury is not worth the small benefit of an accelerated training plan.

Let us know how it goes!
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Old 03-29-17, 04:06 PM
  #29  
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when the subject of training for long distance comes up, I always wonder about the notion that you should have ridden half the distance recently. Is there really any adaptation to training that requires a ride longer than, say, 60 miles? Longest ride I did before this weekend is 2 hours, and I did a 200k with no issues. The experience I gained from riding 3 200k's before my first 300k certainly prepared me for what I would face, but I don't think there was a training effect involved. Same for the 400k and 600k. OTOH, if my fitness is not great, I usually feel fitter after a 200k.
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Old 03-30-17, 08:38 AM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by unterhausen
when the subject of training for long distance comes up, I always wonder about the notion that you should have ridden half the distance recently. Is there really any adaptation to training that requires a ride longer than, say, 60 miles? Longest ride I did before this weekend is 2 hours, and I did a 200k with no issues. The experience I gained from riding 3 200k's before my first 300k certainly prepared me for what I would face, but I don't think there was a training effect involved. Same for the 400k and 600k. OTOH, if my fitness is not great, I usually feel fitter after a 200k.
Yeah I've thought the same things. I feel like the overall fitness from regular riding over years has more impact that any magic number of miles. My weekly average right now is less than it has been in the past, but I'm a lot better cyclist now than I was then just because of consistency.
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Old 04-03-17, 08:04 AM
  #31  
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Thanks all, I will let you know how it goes. I am planning on Sat 4/8. Looks like the rain will putter out on Friday.

I feel very prepared from all the advice on this thread. My pack list is set and all the gear and nutrition has been tested on long rides.

I'll write a small recap on what it felt like to jump from 112 to 200 and some lessons learned along the way.

Thanks.
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Old 04-05-17, 11:20 AM
  #32  
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Good luck! I will be looking forward to reading your recap, as my own first brevet is on 4/23.
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Old 04-05-17, 04:26 PM
  #33  
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Have fun!
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Old 04-05-17, 08:04 PM
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well, I hope jumping from 130 to 230 goes ok, 'cause that's what I'm doing this Saturday
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Old 04-09-17, 08:55 AM
  #35  
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The solo double century went well. I was planning to average 17 mph and try to beat 12 hours moving time. I had somewhat of a tail wind the first 80 miles, then a nasty crosswind for the next 100 coming down through Maryland. Overall I would say the wind gave me a slight advantage but not by much. The crosswind and gusts really was a struggle.

The route I planned worked really well. Some roads were busy, some were empty, but over 180 miles had nice, wide shoulders where I had my own lane, regardless if it was an official bike lane or not.

I was making amazing time, mostly due to my disciplined aero position. By mile 100 I was averaging 18.6 mph and felt so strong. By mile 170 it dropped to 18.1 mph, mostly due to the crosswinds that were also sometimes slight head wind. I started running the numbers through my head and realized I could crush my 12 hour goal and come in under 11 hours. I cranked it hard the last 30 miles and kept running the numbers still knowing it was possible. Unexpectedly at mile 185 a road in Maryland heading into Delaware was completely stripped and grinded as if they were going to repave it soon. I bounced around on that road for 7 miles with my speed drastically being reduced. Fortunately as soon as I got to the Welcome to Delaware sign, the road construction stopped and it was smooth again. I went balls to the wall the remaining 7 or 8 miles and came in at 10 hours 53 minutes moving time. I was super happy with that.

Distance: 201.0 miles
Elevation: 6,024 feet
Moving Time: 10:53:32
Average Speed: 18.5 mi/h

Average Power (Weighted): 159 watts
Average Power: 140 watts
Average Heart Rate: 140 bpm
Average Cadence: 82 rpm

Total Work: 5,496 kJ
Calories Lost: 6,128
Elapsed Time: 12:11:53

Lessons learned:

I should have started with two pairs of socks.
My toes were frozen for the first three hours.

I should have brought more bananas.
I do not have a large enough appetite during long rides to stay fueled properly so I need to constantly force myself to eat. Bananas tend to go down easy for me and are a big part of my nutrition plan. Gas stations in Pennsylvania always have bananas but I was not prepared for Maryland gas stations not having them. I started with two bananas and ate them by mile 60, I was unable to get any more bananas until mile 160.

I should have put sun screen on my hands.
My hands got some sunburn but not too bad though.

Overall the ride went to as planned. No major issues, surprises, or regrets.


Edit:

I ate:
4 bananas
9 gels (from flask)
2 cliff bars
4 nature valley granola bars
1 bag of gummy bears
2 bags of sweedish fish
1 honey bun
8 bottles of gatorade

Last edited by bluestacks867; 04-09-17 at 08:59 AM.
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Old 04-09-17, 09:23 AM
  #36  
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Old 04-09-17, 09:26 AM
  #37  
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Very strong! Congrats!

What are you feelings about riding that distance on a triathalon bike, in regards to fatigue especially neck pain? Do you feel that you can ride much further on a tri bike? If the elevation gain were, say, 10K, would you still prefer a tri bike?

Of course your speed was largely due to the engine and not the bike, but you are making me wonder if I should consider a tri bike for brevets 400km and under. I've never ridden or been fitted for an tri bike aero position and not sure how well I would tolerate it. I have no history of neck or back issues.

Last edited by Flounce; 04-09-17 at 09:29 AM.
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Old 04-09-17, 09:43 AM
  #38  
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Congratulations.

Originally Posted by bluestacks867
I should have started with two pairs of socks.
My toes were frozen for the first three hours.
You want shoe covers. They'll keep cold air out and provide enough insulation your feet stay warm, without making your shoes tighter or changing the support from your foot beds. Construction varies for different climates, ranging from neoprene dry suit bootie for arctic conditions to thin but water resistant for rainy 55 degree days in California.
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Old 04-09-17, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Flounce
Very strong! Congrats!

What are you feelings about riding that distance on a triathalon bike, in regards to fatigue especially neck pain? Do you feel that you can ride much further on a tri bike? If the elevation gain were, say, 10K, would you still prefer a tri bike?

Of course your speed was largely due to the engine and not the bike, but you are making me wonder if I should consider a tri bike for brevets 400km and under. I've never ridden or been fitted for an tri bike aero position and not sure how well I would tolerate it. I have no history of neck or back issues.
I used an old steel Bianchi road bike when I first got into cycling when I was 18 (2003). It had to be from the 80s. I still have it. Sometime around 2008 I got a cheap Motobecane cyclocross bike from bikesdirect.com and used that as my only road bike for a few years. In January of this year is when I purchased the used P2. I have some cycling experience from my early and mid 20s but I was basically a couch potato from 2012-2016, so I was starting pretty fresh.

In March 2016 I decided I wanted to train for a full distance triathlon in October 2018. From March 2016 to April 2017 I logged 1,964 miles on the bike and 774 miles running. The large majority of those miles were still on the Motobecane. The first 9 months my primary focus was running and getting in shape for a marathon but I still biked a bit. Since getting the P2 in January of this year, I have logged 281 miles outside and 276 inside. I did get professionally fit specific for long distance triathlon. I feel like my fit is pretty aggressive. I wanted to start very low and just adjust higher as needed.

My outdoor rides on the P2 were 30, 56, 112, 66, and 17. Those five rides were the first time ever in the aero position and were my only practice before the 200. This is why I commented on family life and not being able to get longer rides in before the 200. It definitely took some practice to learn how to keep pressure off of my neck and shoulders but even when being as relaxed as possible the pain is there as the hours go by.

My legs felt great the entire ride. The limiting factors were keeping nutrition going without an appetite, and sore arms and neck. Stretching on the bike helped me a lot. While I stretch, I am upright holding on with one hand and doing elaborate stretches. This makes my aero terrible so I pick and choose when to do this. Never on a downhill or headwind when aero is most important. I try to do all the stretching on uphills or if I have a tail wind. My neck and arms ended up hurting a lot more than my legs, but yes I feel like I could have done 400 km if that was what I planned for.

Since this was my first time anywhere near this distance I really wanted to make sure I didn't go too hard. Now that I did this ride, one thing I could have done different was either went less aero during longer stretches and made my legs work harder, basically taking load off my upper body and putting it into my fresh legs. Or I could have just increased my power and finished a bit faster. I still had more in the tank at the end.

If it was 10,000 elevation I still would have used the P2, only because it is my only real bike. I guess it really depends on what your goals are. My bike usually weights 20lbs but was 28lbs when I left because I packed the kitchen sink being my first time. I would think that if you wanted to finish as fast as possible and put in your best possible effort then an TT bike would be the best choice. If you are in to to finish strong, feel good and avoid upper body pain at all costs then TT bike would be a bad idea. I never had back or neck issues either and it does not bother me that much. I am about 20 hours now since I finished and my neck is already back to normal.
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Old 04-09-17, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Drew Eckhardt
Congratulations.



You want shoe covers. They'll keep cold air out and provide enough insulation your feet stay warm, without making your shoes tighter or changing the support from your foot beds. Construction varies for different climates, ranging from neoprene dry suit bootie for arctic conditions to thin but water resistant for rainy 55 degree days in California.
Thank you Drew, that is exactly what I was missing. I am not sure if it is true, but I think my triathlon shoes let in even more air than normal. I'll pick up shoe covers so I have them for any cold morning rides.
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