masi61

Today's road bikes are wonderful with hydraulic discs and tremendous proprietary technologies that are starting to not be in the capability of the rider to fully break down without professional bike shop help.

We purchase the current bikes and they are fantastic out of the chute. Many riders don't require anything more. But we are "classic and vintage" in our DNA. We have to de-construct and re-construct our bicycles to be truly at one with it.

We go over each part individually. We clean and lubricate and adjust it. Sometimes it is more by mechanical intuition than reading any manual.

This is where I am disappointed a bit in modern road bike tech for the mechanically inclined. I want to install my own hydraulic braking system. I want to experience the success and the failure of implementing it. I want to memorize what size Allen or Torx bits that are needed. I want to cut the hydraulic hose to length for my size bike frame. I'm willing to wait in order to get it right while doing it myself.

This is apparently not how it is done today when buying the most current super disc bikes that are ready to go. I've got a lot more to say about it but that's it for now...

Pompiere

In our disposable society, a lot of people haven't developed the skills to work on things, but it doesn't mean they aren't curious. Just last weekend, the shop near me hosted a bike build clinic where they built a mountain bike from a bare frame to ready to ride. It included hydraulic disc brakes, dropper post, suspension fork, etc. It was a single speed, but they explained how the dropouts could be swapped for one with a derailleur hanger to use multiple gears.

obrentharris 

Working with hydraulic brakes is not an impossible task for the home mechanic. I built a drop-bar MTB using Ultegra levers and XT (post-mount) calipers. This required some mixing and matching of small parts but no big hurdles. The most difficult part was finding a bike shop that had the small parts. (Thank-you Sunshine Bikes in Fairfax CA!)

The service information is available on Shimano's website.



Brent

jamesdak 

LOL, I do a lot of mine own work but will pick riding a bike over working on one any day of the week.

delbiker1 

I most definitely like riding a bike a whole lot more than I like working on one. I hope that never changes. Being that I am such a bad mechanic/fix it kind of guy, I do not think that will happen.

Drillium Dude 

I think this inaccessibility for the average owner/mechanic began with brifters. I would guess less than 10% of us here have overhauled a pair of those.

DD

thinktubes 

I was pleasantly surprised when a Shimano crank with outboard bearings fit just fine on an Italian frame from the mid-80s.

I had to read up to understand the technology, since it was radically different. Very happy with the result.

repechage

Shimano really did not want you to dig into them. The plan was to add a gear by the time there was an issue and you would just upgrade.
(keep in mind that in Japan it gets more expensive to keep a car on the road as it gets older, fees, inspections, and the various criteria like no dents, crumpled sheetmetal push many cars off the streets, the Japanese auto industry is out of scale - but it is Designed that way)
Campagnolo did sell small parts, but there is a drop off for the early stuff now, and the tools/fixtures to make the work easier are expensive and hard to obtain.

smontanaro 

I see this a lot. People who can - at most - fix a flat. If they break a spoke or their brakes or derailleur needs adjusting, they are off their bike until it comes back from the shop.

delbiker1 

Planned obsolescence, a cornerstone of money making in all tech and mechanical areas.

John E

I detest and rebel against the throwaway society. Until an electrical short in the power window circuitry forced me to replace it in August of this year, I was driving a 1996 Audi A4. I am still fixing it up as a fun classic, but I finally had to semi-retire it from active duty and replace it with something newer and more reliable.

Salamandrine 

Yeah, that was a feature. Not intended to be serviceable. You were supposed to upgrade to the latest and greatest.

Another slightly insidious thing about brifters is rarely mentioned. If you race, brake levers tend to get mangled up often, even in minor crashes. I'm reasonably certain this is why campy used to make their lever bodies from steel, when they could have easily saved some weight by using aluminum. You could crash those things over and over, and they kept working. Might get a little scratched up but so what.

OTOH, if you crash a brifter, it's probably going to be toast, and those things are expensive. Every crash, Shimano gets to sell another $250+ set of brifters. Business genius I suppose, but it must suck to race juniors today. I really had to scrape for my bike parts.

merziac

Oh boy, here we go.

This is actually what spurred my rant in another thread.

Its not my fault, I didn't know that would happen, it broke in the vise, stand, whatever, insert scenario.

Any task at hand should be all encompassing, setup, safety, carefulness, diligence and successful completion including not damaging any tools in the process.

https://www.bikeforums.net/21181191-post755.html

TenGrainBread 

I think this idea about advancing complexity is wrong. A brifter is no more complex than an old Sturmey Archer IGH to overhaul. Hydraulic brakes are mechanically very simple systems. Just because it's new tech that C&V is not familiar with doesn't mean it's different in kind from old tech.

BFisher

"Malcolm Loughead (who later changed the spelling of his name to Lockheed) invented hydraulic brakes, which he would go on to patent in 1917." - Wikipedia.

1917 = Old tech.

If one can't figure out how to work on a hydraulic brake system, then "mechanic" is not the best way to describe one's self.

And that's perfectly fine. Nothing wrong with that whatsoever.

But, I'd bet most of the C&V crowd could install their own hydraulic brake system. You all seem pretty capable, mechanically. Some of you, I would say, are extremely capable.

mstateglfr 

Then do it.

I really dont understand your post. A home mechanic can do all the stuff you mention wanting to do.
Get a bleed kit and bleed your brakes. Get some torx and use them on your 6bolt rotors. Cut the hose.

All the things you mention can be done at home.

mstateglfr 

While some bicycle tech has not taken hold and therefore died off due to lack of support, there is very little actual planned obsolescence.

7sp drivetrains are still used on bikes, so 8-11 will be around for a long time.
Cable shifting and braking isnt going anywhere.
There are a ton of bottom bracket designs, and aftermarket companies provide replacements and conversions for even old inferior tech. Heck, new good quality square taper bottom brackets are readily produced for low prices.

Sometimes I see 26" mtb wheels being referenced as evidence of 'planned obsolescence', and I think that those people dont understand what the word means. No brands planned 40 years ago to phase out 26" wheels- it happened organically. And even then- 26" tires and rims are still available in low end and quality models.

When planned obsolescence in cycling is discussed I often see this in my mind.

Kabuki12

I remember at fifteen years old building my first Volkswagen engine. It only lasted a day or so , but I will never forget the thrill of hearing it fire up for the first time . I literally drove it to the ground . I eventually got really good at building them and made quite a bit of extra money for my self and my wife while an apprentice machinist at an aerospace factory. I got into cycling, not just riding a bike , but cycling in about the early to mid seventies. I hung out with a guy who raced and owned a bike shop near where my wife and I bought our condo. I would help him by sharpening his Campy cutting tools that would go dull. He eventually became a well known frame builder and taught me quite a bit about bikes. For me , working on a bike , whether improving the workings , or maintaining it makes the riding experience that much better. Being a mechanical type person is not for everyone , but it IS what keeps me on the vintage road bikes. I am fascinated with the new carbon bikes , so light and probably better at getting the power to the pavement , but it is not my style. I need to work on them to get the full experience, just me.

Hudson308 

What are these "brifters" you speak of?

Reynolds 

+1 to above. It's very satisfying to ride a bike (or car, or motorcycle) that you've disassembled to the last bolt, overhauled and assembled again.

thinktubes 

Gotta agree.

A big part of being a mechanic is learning how stuff works.

Slightspeed

With a garage full of bikes and a crazy, wild, wind driven brush fire approaching, I was taking inventory of what to pack for possible first ever evacuation. Yeah, cats, pictures, passports, important documents, computer, but which bikes? With two cars, and all the other stuff, I decided on just two bikes, my '64 Legnano Roma Olimpiade, had since new, 55 years, my first race bike, old friend, college commuter, first bike to ride after a 20 year layoff, etc. The other bike is a relatively worthless '73 Raleigh Super Course that I built myself from a scrap metal, abandoned frame. My first ever build. I loved building it, learning as I went (lurking on BF). I have other vintage, modern carbon, but these two are my keepers. There is a lot to be said for wrenching your own bike together. Don't be afraid to get your hands dirty, its worth it! The fire stopped a couple miles from us, no evac required ... this time, but the thought process was a a great exercise. The Legnano has 55 years of nostalgia and love behind it but the Raleigh has nostalgia that I created myself, only 3 years ago.

Drillium Dude 

Dunno if you're kidding or not, but "brifters" is a generic term for integrated brake/shift levers if one does not want to refer to them using manufacturer nomenclature such as Shimano Integrated Shifting and Campagnolo Ergopower.

DD

canklecat

Some newer designs and components are easier to service. The newer integrated headsets are much simpler and easier to service. First time I disassembled one was like an epiphany -- why didn't anyone think of this sooner? Heck, I'd check my headset a lot more often if it were this easy. I usually dread servicing my older bikes' headsets.

Too bad the press-in bottom brackets aren't as easy. I'd still lean toward old school square taper BBs, if only for servicing with minimal tools and no particular skills other than finessing the cone/raceways -- usually takes me a few tries with BBs and hubs to get them just right.

Earlier this year I installed my first set of integrated brakes/shifters -- not sure they're "brifters" because the brake levers are separate from the two pairs of shift up/down levers. Really easy and better braking feel than even the very nice Shimano 600 brakes. I've ridden only two bikes with brifters -- mine, with MicroShift, and a Tarmac with whatever Shimano's top shelf is. The MicroShift didn't quite compare in fingertip ease, but has still been a pleasure to use and more efficient when standing to climb or sprint -- I can shift without sitting. Can't do that with downtube shifters.

OTOH, it's hard to beat the elegance of a well integrated classic steel frame with old school components. Even the most subdued modern road bike looks a bit chunky and plump in contrast. And while aero rims offer some advantage they still look odd to me, even on my own bike. Those classic low profile rims with plenty of spokes just look right to me. One roadie club I ride with recently began encouraging occasional steel bike rides and it's fun to see what other folks bring. I thought I liked narrow bars, but two of mine are 40 -- most of the other fellows bringing 1960s-'80s bikes have 38cm drops without flare in the drops. They look really good, even if they're not the most comfortable for long rides.

Hudson308 

Yeah, just funnin with ya... see my signature.
All this newer technology can be more user friendly and reliable, but there's something about the elegant simplicity of the bicycles from the last century.
Same for modern vehicles. No valid arguments against safety, reliability or user-friendliness, but wrenching on a 70 year-old car with the plugs lined up along the top of the engine is therapy for some of us.