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Old 07-17-19, 11:45 AM
  #26  
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
The newest scooters to come online in Portland are more like small mopeds than real scooters. They are HUGE. The wheels must be 16" in diameter and they even have seats. On our regular Saturday morning walk recently, one of them had been placed carefully on the rumble strip of the wheelchair access ramp of the sidewalk. It would have caused considerable confusion and frustration if my wife (blind) had encountered it without me being there to identify it and make a path around it. A wheelchair user would have had to find another way to access that block. By now every Portlander has had to heave one of these things out of their way at least once in the last year. I'm not even sure if the latest mega-scooters are liftable by anyone lacking a bodybuilding background. I am not at all shocked to learn that they are winding up in rivers.
If they make them big enough, then nobody will be able to heft them over the rails and into the river, or they will all be a few feet away from boat ramps.

Portland was doing their "pilot study" a year ago. Perhaps they need more research.

Are they requiring helmets, and moped/motorcycle licenses?

I wouldn't be surprised if the 3rd generation will REQUIRE pick-up and drop-off at designated docking stations.
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Old 07-17-19, 11:53 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
The video quality above indicates that may not be as old as one might expect.
It's a clip from Stand By Me, Ace and his tough guys acting tough.
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Old 07-17-19, 11:59 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by tyrion View Post
It's a clip from Stand By Me, Ace and his tough guys acting tough.
Ahhh... that makes more sense...

It did look like a setup.

I heard of the movie, but I don't think I ever saw it. I don't know why. I may have to track it down.

Still, mailbox vandals do still exist. I presume they're perpetrated by rural hicks... on the other hand, the rural residents are also the victims.
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Old 07-17-19, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Ahhh... that makes more sense...

It did look like a setup.

I heard of the movie, but I don't think I ever saw it. I don't know why. I may have to track it down.
It's a good movie. 50s nostalgia, a kinder, gentler time, when the gangsters looked like this:

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Old 07-18-19, 11:30 PM
  #30  
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Old 07-19-19, 07:24 PM
  #31  
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...we have these, and they are thus far somewhat problematic. The company (at the urging of the city) has, since inception, initiated a policy that they are no longer "dockless". You can still leave them locked to any bike rack, of return them to the dock. But if you just leave one any old place, there's an extra fee charged to the user's credit card to cover retrieval. Someone left one on my corner in front of the house, blocking the sidewalk. I phoned in a request to have it picked up, and it was gone in about four or five hours.

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Old 08-16-19, 03:59 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
I heard of the movie, but I don't think I ever saw it. I don't know why. I may have to track it down.

Still, mailbox vandals do still exist. I presume they're perpetrated by rural hicks... on the other hand, the rural residents are also the victims.
Stand By Me has a very young Wil Wheaten, AKA Wesley Crusher in it.

And yes... Mailbox Baseball was a thing.... And, in some areas, still is. Thankfully, it's quite rare now.
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Old 08-18-19, 07:20 AM
  #33  
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These scooters are a real eyesore, and imposition on the rest of the pedestrian public IMO. Without any equity in them, in the form of a responsibly/considerately returned based deposit there is no motivation to treat them well and thus they are often treated as, and perceived as junk. The rental companies must buy these for far less than one might think or theyíd build some deeper asset protection into their business models.

Then there is the whole personal and public safety/liability issue....Ive seen some crazy antics most of us wouldnt think to do, on these scooters by casual and unqualified riders.
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Old 08-23-19, 07:55 PM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by FolderBeholder View Post

Then there is the whole personal and public safety/liability issue....Ive seen some crazy antics most of us wouldnt think to do, on these scooters by casual and unqualified riders.
...I was on one of my usual rides down near the state capitol yesterday, and I made the mistake of being there around lunchtime. There were both electric scooters and the JUMP bikes cruising out in the far left traffic lane, and I was kind of paralyzed by all of them zipping past either there or on the sidewalk.

I was starting to silently curse them, then I realized that as long as they are doing this ****, some of them will die, and the drivers will need to pay a lot more attention to what's going on with miscellaneous traffic...like me on a bicycle. So as long as I avoid the peak hours like lunch, I should be OK. And as the death and injury stats increase, I'll probably end up safer in the long run.

It's an ill wind that blows nobody good.
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Old 08-23-19, 09:29 PM
  #35  
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One word.

Oversupply.

Its still a major issue in Shanghai, and many other places around the world.

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Old 08-23-19, 10:18 PM
  #36  
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Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
After tripping over dumped e-scooters littering the downtown sidewalks it's inevitable that someone will treat them like litter, although that is an unacceptable receptacle in which to discard them.

-Bandera
In Bandera Texas which is just 20 miles away from me They painted bikes completely blue. Chain, tires, frame, everything. The bikes canít be ridden and I guess they are intended as art work. So no one steals them and throws them all in the Medina River No matter if you are in a metro area or a small town this kind of thing will always happen.
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Old 01-09-20, 09:35 PM
  #37  
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Not looking good

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn...ffs/index.html

looks like some predictions are coming true.
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Old 01-10-20, 01:34 AM
  #38  
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Lime is pulling out of 12 markets and laying off 100 employees https://www.yahoo.com/news/lime-layi...193955461.html

I heard on the local TV news that they are also cutting inventory where they are still at. While I do understand this is somewhat normal for both Lime and Bird, the cities they are exiting sound like a much bigger deal and I heard their expenses are eating into revenues just keeping some fleets going.
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Old 01-10-20, 03:08 PM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
Lime is pulling out of 12 markets and laying off 100 employees https://www.yahoo.com/news/lime-layi...193955461.html

I heard on the local TV news that they are also cutting inventory where they are still at. While I do understand this is somewhat normal for both Lime and Bird, the cities they are exiting sound like a much bigger deal and I heard their expenses are eating into revenues just keeping some fleets going.

things arenít all candy and Roses for Urber either.https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lat...ck%3f_amp=true
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Old 01-10-20, 05:48 PM
  #40  
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Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
Lime is pulling out of 12 markets and laying off 100 employees https://www.yahoo.com/news/lime-layi...193955461.html
I heard on the local TV news that they are also cutting inventory where they are still at. While I do understand this is somewhat normal for both Lime and Bird, the cities they are exiting sound like a much bigger deal and I heard their expenses are eating into revenues just keeping some fleets going.
Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
things aren’t all candy and Roses for Uber either.https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.lat...ck%3f_amp=true
It is going to take more than laying off employees here and there and quitting a few markets here and there for these money burning machines to get their expenses and revenues in line.
Lime cash burn:
"Scooter rental operator Lime has touted itself as one of the fastest-growing startups ever, blanketing cities such as Berlin, Paris and Los Angeles with thousands of two-wheeled electric vehicles. But the firm is losing money nearly as quickly as it expands in part because the company’s vehicles tend to break down before they can generate much cash.

Lime’s operating loss is likely to surpass $300 million this year, on more than $420 million of gross revenue, according to financial projections viewed by The Information. "
Lime Burning Cash

And Uber is in far worse financial condition and is also trying to fix its money hemorrhaging problem with a band aid of a few employee layoffs, when the problem like Lime's is systemic - its business model of growing losses and no sign of getting enough revenue to pay for expenses is OK as long as there is "growth." Of course the only growth has been the size of the $ losses. Uber, Lime, et al. may provide a bonanza for early investors and the founders of the Ponzi schemes, and its customers benefit too, as long as the losses are subsidized by gullible venture capitalists, desperate drivers (for Uber) and late comers to the Ponzi scheme.
"Uber Technologies Inc. is dismissing 435 employees, the second major staff cut this summer, as the company faces mounting losses and a declining stock price.
The eliminated jobs are in the product and engineering divisions, representing about 8% of those groups. Uber said it was firing about 400 marketing employees, about a third of that department, in July.

Four months after Uber went public, the stock is trading about 25% below the initial public offering price. Last month, the ride-hailing company reported its largest-ever quarterly loss of $5.24 billion. This week, California lawmakers are expected to vote on a labor bill that could dramatically alter the gig economy and foist new costs onto Uber."
Uber Cash Burn
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Old 01-10-20, 08:34 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by I-Like-To-Bike View Post
It is going to take more than laying off employees here and there and quitting a few markets here and there for these money burning machines to get their expenses and revenues in line.
Lime cash burn:
Lime Burning Cash

And Uber is in far worse financial condition and is also trying to fix its money hemorrhaging problem with a band aid of a few employee layoffs, when the problem like Lime's is systemic - its business model of growing losses and no sign of getting enough revenue to pay for expenses is OK as long as there is "growth." Of course the only growth has been the size of the $ losses. Uber, Lime, et al. may provide a bonanza for early investors and the founders of the Ponzi schemes, and its customers benefit too, as long as the losses are subsidized by gullible venture capitalists, desperate drivers (for Uber) and late comers to the Ponzi scheme.
Uber Cash Burn
Looking closer at the plan it does seem like the classic Ponzi scheme. It is like the old saying. if it looks too good to be true, more than likely it is. It might sound like I told you so to some, and I remember you have been saying this for some time, but many questioned how such a business plan could work. It takes some of us back to business 101 and reading William Edwards Deming. It was as if no one has ever taken a critical look at these business plans.
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Old 01-11-20, 09:58 AM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Mobile 155 View Post
Looking closer at the plan it does seem like the classic Ponzi scheme. It is like the old saying. if it looks too good to be true, more than likely it is. It might sound like I told you so to some, and I remember you have been saying this for some time, but many questioned how such a business plan could work. It takes some of us back to business 101 and reading William Edwards Deming. It was as if no one has ever taken a critical look at these business plans.
The business plan worked out quite well for the co-founders of Uber. Not so well for the employees, drivers with no employee benefits, or the stockholders who bought the stock with expectations that a company that burns cash forever and thumbs its nose at local governments and its drivers will be a good long term investment. Same situation pretty much applies to all the unicorn startups trying to cash in on media hype about the alleged success (almost always measured in "growth" not profits) of rental scooter and bicycle companies with no regard to running a business where revenue covers its expenses.
"Uber co-founder Travis Kalanick is resigning from the company’s board of directors. The news comes after Kalanick sold more than $2.5 billion in stock — more than 90 percent of his stake — when the lock-up on his shares expired. By exiting the board and selling his shares, he has essentially cut himself entirely off from the company he helped found."
Uber founder takes his money and laughs all the way to the bank
Uber co-founder Garrett Camp quietly shells out $71 million for Beverly Hills mansion.
June gloom is over — at least in the red-hot realm of real estate. After two homes traded hands for more than $40 million in May, Uber co-founder Garrett Camp just upped the ante by paying roughly $71 million for a newly built Beverly Hills mansion
HA, HA I got mine.
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Old 01-13-20, 08:42 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Fargo Wolf View Post
Stand By Me has a very young Wil Wheaten, AKA Wesley Crusher in it.
And the fat kid grew up to marry Rebecca Romijn. https://comb.io/Zr0CzC

Last edited by cooker; 01-13-20 at 08:46 AM.
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Old 01-13-20, 08:49 AM
  #44  
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Old 01-13-20, 02:15 PM
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Interesting summary of the Growth ‹ber Alles Business Plan of Lime, Uber and the other micro-mobility money burning enterprises.
Extract
Like Uber, Lime and its rivals used the money thrown at them by investors for rapid entrance into new markets, valuing the notion of being pioneers over bottom-line profitability.

The lukewarm reception Uber got on the New York Stock Exchange was a direct result of its prospectus. The document showed that behind the massive growth was a shaky financial model, based on large cash infusions meant to cover billions of dollars in losses, without offering a clear path to profitability, barring another massive investment.

Uberís downfall was enough to demonstrate that speedy growth with a damn-the-loss attitude is not a sustainable model. It is time for these companies to switch to a more conservative strategy that includes a business plan with actual profitability goals and a realistic cap on expenses. Lime is the first in the sector to take a significant first step to transform its operations. It will likely not be the last.
Why Micro-Mobility Companies Need a Better Business Plan
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Old 01-15-20, 06:57 PM
  #46  
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So ... at the risk of having my percieved intelligence quotient dinged several points, I am moved to wonder out loud ... why is Uber a money sink? They have no overhead, they have skirted every regulation that binds traditional hired vehicles ... what am I missing? They don't pay the drivers enough as it is. Are they supposed to pay even less? I'll take my answer(s) off the air.
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Old 01-15-20, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
So ... at the risk of having my percieved intelligence quotient dinged several points, I am moved to wonder out loud ... why is Uber a money sink? They have no overhead, they have skirted every regulation that binds traditional hired vehicles ... what am I missing? They don't pay the drivers enough as it is. Are they supposed to pay even less? I'll take my answer(s) off the air.
I'm going to guess. Advertising, IT costs, lawsuits, and thin profit margins. However it is a guess. Maybe executive salaries?
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Old 01-15-20, 10:17 PM
  #48  
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A: Their business model stinks, like just about any endeavor running on a wing and a prayer.

There is a solid reason why taxi companies have a fixed rate, and it's because expenses don't magically drop for volume. What Uber is trying to do is to get ridership up based on promotion and recover it over time by bringing fares up to cover, which is akin to a Ponzi scheme in some ways and only works over a short period of time.

Bad reputation for drivers is another problem that becomes very hard to surmount. It cuts both ways however.

Conventional cabbies have considered them to be a threat to their livelihood as well, and some states have now reclassified Uber work in ways that make it less lucrative vs. licensed cab company workers..IMO as well they should.
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Old 01-16-20, 09:02 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by Rollfast View Post
A: Their business model stinks, like just about any endeavor running on a wing and a prayer.

There is a solid reason why taxi companies have a fixed rate, and it's because expenses don't magically drop for volume. What Uber is trying to do is to get ridership up based on promotion and recover it over time by bringing fares up to cover, which is akin to a Ponzi scheme in some ways and only works over a short period of time.

Bad reputation for drivers is another problem that becomes very hard to surmount. It cuts both ways however.

Conventional cabbies have considered them to be a threat to their livelihood as well, and some states have now reclassified Uber work in ways that make it less lucrative vs. licensed cab company workers..IMO as well they should.
I think the point Liesesturm was making is that a lot of the financial risks and costs are borne by the underpaid drivers. How is the parent company, which functions to some degree as a middle man, losing so much money? What do they spend it on?
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Old 01-16-20, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by cooker View Post
I think the point Liesesturm was making is that a lot of the financial risks and costs are borne by the underpaid drivers. How is the parent company, which functions to some degree as a middle man, losing so much money? What do they spend it on?
Uber expenses
"Cost of revenue: Uber’s biggest cost is cost of revenue, a category that includes insurance costs related to ride-hailing, incentives paid to drivers, and costs incurred with carriers for the Uber Freight trucking platform. In 2018, Uber spent $5.6 billion, or 50% of its revenue, on this category. Cost of revenue increased by $1.5 billion, or 35%, from 2017 to 2018, in part due to an increase in “excess driver incentives.” Uber describes these incentives as any amount paid to a driver that exceeds the revenue earned by that driver (for instance, if a driver’s earnings from a trip exceed the fare for that trip). Excess driver incentives jumped by about $300 million in 2018 from the previous year, largely due to Uber Eats.

Sales and marketing: While most driver promotions go into cost of revenue, rider discounts go into Uber’s next biggest expense, sales and marketing. In 2018, Uber spent $3.2 billion, or 28% of revenue, on this category, up $627 million or 25% from the previous year. The company attributed this increase to $1.4 billion in discounts, promotions, refunds, and credits for customers, up from $949 million in 2017. Uber also puts driver referral bonuses into sales and marketing, and reduced that expense to $136 million in 2018, from $199 million in 2017.

Research and development: A lesser but still significant expense for Uber is research and development, which includes the company’s efforts to develop self-driving cars through its Advanced Technologies Group. In 2018, Uber spent $1.5 billion on research and development, or 13% of revenue, up from $1.2 billion in 2017. Of that $1.5 billion, $457 million was spent on Uber’s autonomous vehicle research, up from $384 million 2017."
The bottom line is that Uber is giving away their product at prices that won't ever earn a profit (revenue > expenses); plus throwing money around at other money losing projects like scooter rentals and self driving car R&D because they can. Their operation has been subsidized from day one with cash showered on them from cash rich venture capitalists trying to get in on the Ponzi scheme.

Note that Uber hasn't earned a dime and probably never will from its autonomous vehicle research expenditures.

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