86az135i

First analogy makes little to no sense.

Second. No it’s not logical. There is so much in life that’s dangerous and we mitigate the risks. Is living in a house dangerous? Why would we need permits and build to code? Mitigate risk. Why would I cut hotdogs in very small pieces to a toddler. Are hot dogs considered dangerous? Not really but we mitigate risk. Is all food dangerous? No, but it would be without a lot of the regulations out there. Would you argue eating is unsafe because we have FDA, USDA, state departments, ect. So many things are dangerous but we have mitigated risk.

Biking carries risk. Kids are risky, they have less coordination and aren’t fully fully developed. It is responsible to mitigate the risk.

I’m having a really hard time with people arguing against helmets for kids since they cannot logically make choices or comprehend what could happen. But here we are.

elcruxio

I suppose we could go into semantics of the risk of everything. But lets just say in general that the health benefits of active cycling outweigh the negative effects of not wearing a helmet by several times over. This is also true for kids. And it's been shown pretty well that mandatory helmet laws decrease cycling which also then makes cycling less safe since less cyclists leads to more accidents per hour ridden.

As to cycling carrying risk, depending where you live it's lower or on par with walking. So if we're taking the "think of the children" -route, kids should absolutely wear helmets all the time, not just cycling.

86az135i

Lol, show me the study about bicycling risk being lower or on par with walking.

I never said anything about mandating. It's parenting common sense.

How does less people cycling make cycling less safe lol. Accidents per hour ridden would be a static measure independent of how many hours ridden nor would a statistic influence the safety of an individual or group.

elcruxio

It's there, somewhere in this thread. Read it from the beginning.



If you can't figure this one out I really can't help you. However that too has been discussed extensively in this topic. I suggest you read it from the beginning

86az135i

My original argument is dealing with kids. I suggest you stay aligned.

And I know you can't help me. Because my statement is correct. And you cannot prove otherwise.

wphamilton

When more people are cycling, it becomes safer because drivers become accustomed to them and adjust their behavior accordingly. Secondly, it tends to encourage cycling infrastructure which also contributes to safety.

For example: https://injuryprevention.bmj.com/con...3/205.abstract

mivuj95

Suck important information in this thread. And very useful studies, great reading!

EaOutlaw1969

I started riding bikes in the early 1970s and I do not even think they had helmets back then. I lost count of the number of crashes I have been in over the years both on Bicycles and motorcycles and I must have been lucky because I never ever bashed my head into anything.

xtc14

Hello.
I would like to know if there are documented cases of people dying from bike accidents while using fakes/knockoff helmets? I know the China helmet replicas do not have the same stamping of security approvals compared to the real deal, but I'm curious to know if there has been incidents of people dying or sustaining heavy head trauma as result of wearing these fake ones?

coopman

I just started riding again about a month ago. Never used a helmet in my entire childhood, unless it was maybe a football helmet! Nobody wore a helmet in the 1960-1975 time period, I don't believe. But times have changed. I won't even leave my driveway without a helmet on now.

Jseis 

I peruse this subject once year to see what’s new under the sun. Battery powered mobility devices (scooters, ebike, etc) are interesting from ah.. a safety perspective.

Here is a statistic. In 50 years of motorcycling, biking, I’ve had a few wrecks. Let’s say in 75,000-100,000 miles (I’ve no idea the actual) I’ve had 4 bad ones that left me bruised or knocked out but not broken. Two (one motorcycle, one bike) broke either a face shield or a helmet. Both were cornering at speed (operator error). Without a helmet (+ face sheild) either would’ve left me with severe head trauma. One knocked me out cold for 15-25 seconds. I tend to push it a bit so if I keep doing that I’ll take another in a decade LOL.

I ride a fat-bike on the beach now. Still wear a helmet.

MTBUK

Totally agree. The thing is you can be a safe rider and do everything right buts it's other people you have to watch. My biggest bug bear is people pulling out of T-Junctions looking one way, pull off and then look the other was they drive off 🤪

350htrr

I too have had that happen to me like 3 times in the last 3 years... EXEPT, I was the driver in the car... EVERY time, it was one of these "A holes" riding their bicycles on the sidewalk, riding the wrong way to traffic flow... I glanced to the right, nobody there, I start to pull out looking to the left, for car traffic and... WOW, T bone ally, the bicycle came within inches of hitting me, smack in the middle of my car... Whose fault IS that... If it was a pedestrian I would have seen them, and let them go, but wait a minute, a bicycle comes on way faster than a pedestrian, and so... NEEDS, to compensate for such occasions, as the vehicle driver does NOT, expect any traffic from the right... OTHER than pedestrian traffic, which travel way,way, … slower, than most bicycles…

BoBodyJones

A helmet is very important. It is required in a lot of places but not in Colorado.

greatscott

Yup, many crashes and no bashed head is lucky...others have not been so lucky.

BigJonny

Hey All,


"Use your head." An often heard idiom usually directed at someone that makes a mistake, or is about to, or goes off the correct path to accomplish a task.


In this application it takes a broader, more meaningful sense. . .


Statistics are irrefutable proof that helmets save lives. Here is a passage from a 2016 study conducted by the University of New South Wales, Australia, on the subject of helmet use, or no use, among cyclists:


"A major study of bike helmet use around the world from more than 64,000 cyclists has found helmets reduce the risks of a serious head injury by nearly 70%.

The study also found neck injuries are not associated with helmet use and cyclists who wear helmets reduce their chance of a fatal head injury by 65%."


Yes, we could argue against helmet use, infringement of personal freedom and such, but the fact remains that a head hitting the ground with no protection will suffer severe blunt force trauma even at slow speeds.


So, it is your call and we recommend that you use your head!


Ride hard, ride safe.


J.

Chasboy

Hi folks, I have been recently been appalled by the number of kids under 14 in my area that are not riding with helmets, even while riding with parents who should know better.
Is there a definitive number or statistic that I could refer to if I post some kind of statement about this on a local bulletin board? I did a small amount of research this morning and it seems that what I thought was the positive effect of helmet wearing is not as prevalent as I thought. I was hoping what I saw was inacurrate and perhaps not up to date.

cb400bill

We have merged your thread into The Hemlet Thread 2. This is the only place for helmet use posts to be placed.

Ardrid

Always wear a helmet and make sure my little guy does as well. Crazy that you wouldn't. All it takes is one wrong fall to cause serious damage. Not worth the risk.

wphamilton

"Even though nobody wears bike helmets in the Netherlands, the fatality rate there is six times smaller than that of the United States." - which is attributed to a universal speed limit of 30kph (18.6 mph) in residential areas, and to infrastructure to a lesser extent. Food for thought anyway, that maybe where we ride has more effect on our safety than helmets and all our safety equipment.

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/pe...ike-a-dutchman

mr_bill

I find that I ride in the Netherlands when I’m in the Netherlands.

Food for thought anyway....

Speaking of food, you can bake an Appeltaart in Massachusetts.

Food for thought anyway....

-mr. bill

350htrr

I think there are huge differences in riding a bicycle in the Netherlands, compared to riding a bicycle anywhere in N America...

Speed, the people are riding at a leisurely speed...
Dedicated bicycle lanes, where bicycle traffic is not mixed with car traffic.
Distances, people ride to get to where they want to go are way less, thus allowing for leisurely speed bicycle traffic...

It all adds up to a TOTALT DIFFERENT, outcome in accident rates.. JMO...

wphamilton

I think I mentioned vehicle speed and infrastructure in that part you quoted - and that's really my point. With the right infrastructure - where you ride - there's no reason to not expect that same Six times lower fatality rate. Without helmets.

I disagree that you can't find it here, and I disagree that lowering speed limits is impossible here. My commute is probably easier and safer than the typical Netherlands commute. Less crowded, less traffic interaction on most of it. I could take a sidewalk for a mile or two if I wanted, and most bikers do on that section (but I almost never do that). Bike speed: most of the people I pass are likely going no faster than the typical Netherlands rider. I think we tend to make too much of the difference in environments.

mr_bill

Probably? Good <diety>!

-mr. bill

GormyGorm

It personally depends on the activity for me.

If I am mountain biking, or doing some intense road biking/training I will definitely wear a helmet, but I never wear one when I am commuting.

Where I live, schools, workplaces, shopping centers, and most of the cities aren't really considerate of cyclists. There are barely any lock ups for bikes, and when I was in high school I had a helmet literally get crushed because someone literally stepped on it. It really is just inconvenient at best, and a waste of a very expensive item at worst.

I also question the utility of a helmet being I feel that most TBI's are not a result of your head hitting something, but rather your brain hitting the inside of your skull, or some other sudden shock to your brain. A helmet doesnt get rid of the shock, it just makes it so that you don't split your head open from the fall that caused the shock. This is also just my opinion and no medical group has ever confirmed or denied this as far as I am aware.

Welp, thats my two-cents.