Training Status??? (III)
10-16-14, 10:11 AM
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n=1 but I'm the other way around. Tried to do 2 hours or z2 on the trainer last night, yea no way in hell. But give me some intervals and I'll be on there for 1-2 hours and not hate life as bad.
10-16-14, 10:41 AM
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I had considered holding off on the structured stuff until Dec or so, but figured since I wasn't really training this past summer, I could probably stand an earlier start and see what kind of improvements I can start to make with one or two tougher sessions a week, and possibly give myself a break around Christmas. I obviously have a lot to learn about developing a training calendar.
10-16-14, 10:45 AM
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In "Cutting Edge Cycling" there is an interview with Gibala, in which he cites data which suggests that incorporating high intensity intervals during the base period helps enhance aerobic adaptations. This dovetails nicely with (a) anecdotal advice from the most successful masters racer on my team regarding the importance of doing at least occasional, if sometimes low volume, high intensity work year round, to maintain the high end and (b) dealing with boredom and monotony in my basement pain cave over the winter.
I am a couple weeks into my 2015 season (Prep period), and I have added the Gibala sprint protocol once a week, or I have tried to. Basically, 30 seconds at ~200%+ of FTP (175% of VO2Max, to be precise), then 4:30 recovery x 12. With the long recoveries I thought it would be easy. Not easy at all. This week and last my roller sessions have given me a NP > FTP and IF > 1.0. Only slightly, but still, blows my mind because I spend so much time noodling along when I do these intervals.
The good news is that I am hitting my wattage targets consistently, and I went from 6 sprints before calling it off last week to 9 sprints this week. I have done lots of sprint work this summer in the 10-20 second range, but not 30 seconds; it is fun/hard, each time I have called it off because my legs were starting to feel uncomfortable in the wrong way (not looking to injure myself before I start base training!). Definitely feels like it is worth keeping in my training plan, my legs seem to be adapting (ie this week I was able to go slightly harder, for more sprints, before feeling discomfort).
I am a couple weeks into my 2015 season (Prep period), and I have added the Gibala sprint protocol once a week, or I have tried to. Basically, 30 seconds at ~200%+ of FTP (175% of VO2Max, to be precise), then 4:30 recovery x 12. With the long recoveries I thought it would be easy. Not easy at all. This week and last my roller sessions have given me a NP > FTP and IF > 1.0. Only slightly, but still, blows my mind because I spend so much time noodling along when I do these intervals.
The good news is that I am hitting my wattage targets consistently, and I went from 6 sprints before calling it off last week to 9 sprints this week. I have done lots of sprint work this summer in the 10-20 second range, but not 30 seconds; it is fun/hard, each time I have called it off because my legs were starting to feel uncomfortable in the wrong way (not looking to injure myself before I start base training!). Definitely feels like it is worth keeping in my training plan, my legs seem to be adapting (ie this week I was able to go slightly harder, for more sprints, before feeling discomfort).
10-16-14, 10:49 AM
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10-16-14, 10:52 AM
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So, stupid question: how much improvement can a new person training conservatively expect to achieve over a winter of structured training? In other words, does one experience bigger gains when one first starts training, while improvements become harder to achieve as one gains power? Maybe the better question is, based on your experience, how much did you improve during your first off-season. Just curious to know what others have experienced.
So, stupid question: how much improvement can a new person training conservatively expect to achieve over a winter of structured training? In other words, does one experience bigger gains when one first starts training, while improvements become harder to achieve as one gains power? Maybe the better question is, based on your experience, how much did you improve during your first off-season. Just curious to know what others have experienced.
10-16-14, 11:26 AM
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One coach I had incorporated high intensity into my winter routine by working in CX races and the Saturday group ride. Long and steady during the week is great, but going hard on the weekend isn't going to burn you out. In fact it keeps it fun and fresh and reminds you why you're doing all this boring steady state stuff.
10-16-14, 11:28 AM
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This dovetails nicely with (a) anecdotal advice from the most successful masters racer on my team regarding the importance of doing at least occasional, if sometimes low volume, high intensity work year round, to maintain the high end and (b) dealing with boredom and monotony in my basement pain cave over the winter.
Last edited by Racer Ex; 10-16-14 at 11:36 AM.
10-16-14, 01:35 PM
Making a kilometer blurry
Yeah, once I get into the mode of completely checking my ego at the door, I can just ride base and nothing else. Good to remember that I should ride in anger anyway, once in a while. I remember the old Coach Walden advice against it -- destroying some sort of capillary development that happens during base if you ride hard. I never believed that one.
10-16-14, 03:16 PM
Making a kilometer blurry
10-16-14, 03:58 PM
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FWIW my coach has me doing tons of intervals right now to get my FTP as high as possible before base starts. I'm down 5lbs and up 17W on my FTP. Idea is that higher ftp leads to higher quality base training, and so far it's going gangbusters.
Except for when I'm stupid, like today. Tried to do 5x5min at slightly higher than 4x4min pace; went about as well as you'd expect.
Edit: I should qualify this by saying I don't have a 9-5 and my schedule is ridiculously flexible, so I'm able to do my workouts without much life stress involved. I can see how it could lead to mental burnout if you're unable to move your schedule around or even like, sleep in to compensate/recover from harder days.
Except for when I'm stupid, like today. Tried to do 5x5min at slightly higher than 4x4min pace; went about as well as you'd expect.
Edit: I should qualify this by saying I don't have a 9-5 and my schedule is ridiculously flexible, so I'm able to do my workouts without much life stress involved. I can see how it could lead to mental burnout if you're unable to move your schedule around or even like, sleep in to compensate/recover from harder days.
Last edited by TheKillerPenguin; 10-16-14 at 04:26 PM.
10-17-14, 04:30 AM
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Considering going to Tucson in February for a week to ride, mostly for the climbing; might take my wife if she's interested. Total cost (gas, hotel, food) would be ~$1k vs. ~$3k for a formal training camp. I've already got a coach, so could get training direction from her. Any tips concerning logistics from locals or folks who have done this in the past?
ETA: Tentative hotel will be on Davis-Monthan.
ETA: Tentative hotel will be on Davis-Monthan.
__________________
Regards,
Chuck
Demain, on roule!
Regards,
Chuck
Demain, on roule!
Last edited by revchuck; 10-17-14 at 04:55 AM.
10-17-14, 06:40 AM
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@revchuck:
Davis-Monthan is on the southeast side of town. There is one popular route from there which is out Old Spanish trail to ****** Hill. I'm guessing you get a military discount otherwise it would be much better IMHO to be more north/central. In any event you can ride from any location, including DM, to every ride.
Of course ride Mt. Lemmon, I prefer it on a weekday as there is almost zero traffic. It will be cold at elevation though; I already need a jacket above 6K ft. Ride the Saturday Shootout as well. At that time of year, there may be some pro teams in attendance. There are many other routes/group rides as well, just depends on what you are looking for.
I'm local, so let me know if I can help out.
Davis-Monthan is on the southeast side of town. There is one popular route from there which is out Old Spanish trail to ****** Hill. I'm guessing you get a military discount otherwise it would be much better IMHO to be more north/central. In any event you can ride from any location, including DM, to every ride.
Of course ride Mt. Lemmon, I prefer it on a weekday as there is almost zero traffic. It will be cold at elevation though; I already need a jacket above 6K ft. Ride the Saturday Shootout as well. At that time of year, there may be some pro teams in attendance. There are many other routes/group rides as well, just depends on what you are looking for.
I'm local, so let me know if I can help out.
10-17-14, 08:02 AM
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Considering going to Tucson in February for a week to ride, mostly for the climbing; might take my wife if she's interested. Total cost (gas, hotel, food) would be ~$1k vs. ~$3k for a formal training camp. I've already got a coach, so could get training direction from her. Any tips concerning logistics from locals or folks who have done this in the past?
ETA: Tentative hotel will be on Davis-Monthan.
ETA: Tentative hotel will be on Davis-Monthan.
10-17-14, 08:39 AM
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10-17-14, 09:44 AM
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10-17-14, 09:53 AM
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10-17-14, 10:00 AM
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I had a great time in Tucson last winter. I just stayed at a cheap place by the airport but I had a rental car so it was fine.
Mt Lemmon was fun but very cold at the top, the hot chocolate I got at Summerhaven felt so good. I thought the Cactus forest loop was fun too, basically no cars and the giant cacti were cool.
I was just leaving as the rock show came into town and hotel prices went way up for that. You should probably avoid overlapping with that.
Mt Lemmon was fun but very cold at the top, the hot chocolate I got at Summerhaven felt so good. I thought the Cactus forest loop was fun too, basically no cars and the giant cacti were cool.
I was just leaving as the rock show came into town and hotel prices went way up for that. You should probably avoid overlapping with that.
10-17-14, 10:33 AM
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the riding scene in tucson was great, but i found a lot of the roads to have **** surfaces and a lot of the rides felt like "a whole bunch of boring riding to get to some AWESOME riding." overall i just preferred the riding in SD (once you get out of the city). poway, mt. laguna, palomar (well, the actual climb, the ride out there sucks) were all great.
since it sounds like you're stuck on tucson, however, you HAVE to do the box canyon dirt road ride. someone else can probably give you more info but it was my favorite ride in tucson.
fwiw i rode lemon in january and it really wasn't THAT cold. just pack a thermal vest, thermal gloves, and knee/leg warmers for the descent and you'll be fine.
since it sounds like you're stuck on tucson, however, you HAVE to do the box canyon dirt road ride. someone else can probably give you more info but it was my favorite ride in tucson.
fwiw i rode lemon in january and it really wasn't THAT cold. just pack a thermal vest, thermal gloves, and knee/leg warmers for the descent and you'll be fine.
10-17-14, 10:53 AM
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(chuckle)
Rode up Lemmon in warm sunshine and 45 minutes later the temp dropped 40 degrees and we were getting snowed on. We weren't fine.
Check the forecast and radar.
10-17-14, 10:55 AM
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Oh, yeah a lot of people enjoy Saguaro National Park East (there is a national park on the West side too) to ride around. It is often hooked up with the ride out Old Spanish Trial. It is very scenic.
I agree with the rough roads comment, if you are not familiar with the area. There can be a ****ty road right parallel to a very smooth road, you just gotta learn the routes. This is what happens when the state legislature reappropriates voter approved tax money to be diverted from road maintenance. But the traffic is nothing compared to CA.
I agree with the rough roads comment, if you are not familiar with the area. There can be a ****ty road right parallel to a very smooth road, you just gotta learn the routes. This is what happens when the state legislature reappropriates voter approved tax money to be diverted from road maintenance. But the traffic is nothing compared to CA.
10-17-14, 11:46 AM
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@revchuck My wife and I did a camp this year in Tucson run by the Cycling House we stayed near Mount Lemmon. It was a great area to have a camp and we had to wonderful time. We are doing another camp with the Cycling House next year in Central California. Here is a movie from the camp. Most of the movie is pics of the campers but some great shots of the area to get you pumped.