PhotoJoe 

OK, I am sick and tired of the goathead flats. I've had 4 in my last 5 rides. So, I'm seriously thinking about either putting Mr. Tuffies in or swapping out my GP4000s tires for Gatorskins (or the likes). I'd love to hear opinions as to which approach is better. If I notice a significant difference in ride quality, speed, etc., this will become a seasonal fix only. I'm already the slowest rider in the groups that I ride with. I don't need anything slowing me down more, if at all possible.

If your recommendation is tires over tuffies, which would you recommend.

Thank you!

trainsktg

I've had no flats with 700x25c Schwalbe Marathon Plus tires after approx. 3,000 miles.

I put slick x23c Gatorskins on my new road bike because there was no Schwalbe dealer in the area where I bought the bike, and so far so good more or less after a few hundred miles. I do feel I have to baby these more though...small pebbles in the roadway afe felt much more strongly through the Gatorskins than the Marathons...I run over everything with the latter.

I tried Mr. Tuffies in the 23c tires, but they seemed to be causing were marks on the tubes, at one spot actually appearing to rub through enough to cause I slow leak. I took them out.

Keith

cafzali

With Gatorskins, I can't see a reason for liners. I never flatted with Gatorskins, although "goatheads" aren't a problem in my area.

99Klein 

Bontrager T1's. I've never had a flat with these tires. I do replace them when they square off. The rubber is so thick you'd never wear through them. Gatorskins I not only flat, but pinch-flat an any pressure less than max due to my weight.

PhotoJoe 

And they're $20 each?

99Klein 

Yep. As long as you don't mind the weight or the wet handling. I seriously have NEVER flatted one. Frustrates people in group rides but they keep running their light tires.

SpeshulEd 

I've flatted gatorskins, tires with tuffies liners, and gatorskins with tuffies liners. Because Arizona.

Bike Gremlin

Fat tyres at lower pressure are less flat prone. I'd go for marathons, or gatorskins in 28 mm if possible.

Tyre liners suck IMO, don't like them. Same goes for Slime and similar products that are put into the tubes.

noisebeam

I used gatorskins for years, then about 5yrs ago switched to gp4000s. I get no more flats than with gatorskins and they ride so much better. But the gators last 6k mi vs 4.5k for the gp4ks.

Jarrett2

Gator Hardshells. Several thousand miles, one flat.

That flat was a nasty piece of jagged metal that went all the way to the rim and would have likely taken out my truck's tire as well.

Jarrett2

how so?

SpeshulEd 

Yes, I prefer GP4000s with latex tubes. I use gatorskins on my commuter and my fixed gear on occasion. Right now I have them on my fixed gear because I'm trying to burn through them. GP4000s and skidding rear tires don't go together too well.

Honestly, everything flats, just get used to changing them has always been my philosophy.

GP4000s are much lighter, more supple tire. Try them sometime, or any higher end race style tire and then go back to gatorskins and it'll feel like you're riding on frozen garden hoses. People tend to gravitate towards the GP4000s over other race style tires because they do hold up fairly well and the flat protection is fairly decent, not awesome, but not the worst out there either.

Drew Eckhardt 

There's about 15-20W at 20 MPH between Gatorskins and GP4000S tires. That could be the difference between what you can manage for an hour versus ten minutes.

The more supple carcass also makes your ride smoother.

GuitarBob

Marathons are probably the most flat resistant, but they weigh as much as most wheels! Okay, I am exaggerating, but not by much.

It's all about where you fall out on trade-offs. I use Gatorskins on my commuter; they're tough and last a long time, but like Ed, I get flats from time to time -- not many, though. They are pretty rough riding, but trade-offs.

I've been using Michelin Pro4 Endurance on my road bikes, and I like them. Pretty flat resistant, though I get more than with Hatorskins, and they don't last as long. They ride really nicely, though.

Jarrett2

No kidding?

Hmm, I need to see what the guys in the fast group are riding when I ride with them.

I may be throwing watts down the tube

noisebeam

Others already answered as I would have. For me it is far more about the 'comfort' and road feel than the 'watts.'

SpikedLemon

Bicycle Rolling Resistance | Rolling Resistance Tests
@100psi
Gators: 20.2W
4kS: 12.9W

Jarrett2

No wonder I'm losing. I've gots slow tires!

Jarrett2

Just a joke

banerjek

This is a hard one, but I'm no fan of tuffies. I've tried all the "flat proof" tires. The Schwalbe Marathon Plus provides far greater flat protection than anything else, but it is also like riding in sand. Use only as a last resort.

Gatorskins, Armadillos, and the like provide a miserable ride and terrible grip as well being incredibly slow, but they do provide good cut resistance. But since your issue is punctures from goatheads, they're not great. However, they're noticeably better than your GP4000s.

I eventually wound up using Bontrager Hardcases. They're a cheap tire that provides "not bad" puncture protection and the ride is as good as the other flat resistant tires except the Marathon Plus.

Despite what everyone says here, I do not find the GP4000s to be flat resistant. Rather, it is a good training tire. It has no outstanding strengths, but it also has no outstanding weaknesses. For people who ride on relatively clean roads, they're an excellent choice. But add too much debris and they get shredded.

You might get a set of Marathon Plus just to see how flat resistant you can get. But those tires are so crazy slow, you may find yourself thinking it's better to change more flats.

PhotoJoe 

Thanks everyone. I appreciate you sharing from your experiences.

What is the thought on Stan's? I've had a few people on my club's FB page recommend that approach. And when is goathead season over?

Drew Eckhardt 

Rolling resistance is proportional weight, and power to overcome it is proportional to speed.

They only load the tire with 42.5kg which is 93.7 pounds. As a 135 pound climber on a 15 pound bike you'll generate 70% more rolling resistance.

They test at 18 MPH. 20 MPH means 11% more power to overcome rolling resistance.

Make those adjustments and you have
Gators: 38.1W
4ks: 24W
+14.1W for the Gatorskins

A 200 pound rider on a 15 pound bike will have a 20.2W difference between the tires.

hueyhoolihan

that was me about 15 years ago when i lived in Sacramento. i went with Tuffies, now i use the Tuffy ultralites and have been using ultra thin and light tires (think Vittoria Corsa and Continental Supersonics) every since. goats heads do not penetrate, the SOBs can get in the side where the liner doesn't cover the tube entirely, but never straight on.

i'll admit it, they can cause flats in thin tubes when i run under about 70 PSI in my road tires (im 160, and think it's due to excessive tire squirm), but as long as i keep the PSI above 80 i'm fine.

BTW, there is no "goathead season" as far as i know. they are the devil spawn of the plant and can last indefinitely. but beware a windy or rainy night. the next day a new batch will have been spread upon the bike lanes and trails until they have been gobbled up by the street sweepers or cyclist's tires or crushed underfoot of pedestrians.

bassogap

Does anyone have a definitive opinion on the tire liners? They seem to be a bit on the "Fred" side; I've never tried them....although I've installed them on hundreds of bikes whilst working in bike shops...They don't seem to weigh much. I was intrigued by the poster who felt they can rub small holes in the tubes...

SpikedLemon

It's a baseline for comparison that gives a very good indication for ranking.
Don't forget to onsider that you don't put your full weight onto a single tire: perhaps 55-60% of it at the worst case. 42.5kg would equate to, roughly, a 90kg rider+bike (200lbs)