3alarmer 

...thank you once again. It does, indeed have the front slot arrangement, the first I'd seen of that.


...no fitting on the shell. It goes surprisingly quickly with modern tyres at higher pressures.

juvela

-----

Some other possible dating aids -

a) lower head cup has a shallow groove. they went from no grooves on to shallow groove and lastly to the deeper groove with which we are all so familiar. forum's Tullio experts will know the time for this. the shallow groove enjoyed but a brief production life IIRC.

b) are bottom bracket fittings 3/16" ball or 1/4" ball? as i recall it the 3/16" was employed for about one year somewhere around 1963.

c) there are small differences in the Record pillar during this era in the markings on the backside and the cutout in the clamp body. the experts are sure to know the dates for these.

-----

Condorino

Thanks for that posting and clarification T-Mar.

Condorino

Hello 3alarmer,

The serial number of this Legnano Roma Olimpiade would enable us to fix the production date for you. If you prefer not to post it, you can send me an PM and I will keep it in confidence with a reply as to the year of production.

best regards,
Mark

3alarmer 

...thank so much. It's not that I'm shy, I just can't find a serial number in any of the usual places I looked.

Unless it's interior, on the fork or steerer somewhere. The BB shell, the seat and head lugs, and both rear dropouts are free of any letters or numbers (other than the standard Campagnolo stamping on the dropouts.)

Possibly it's been repainted and the numbers buried under paint ? It's a mystery to me, and I did not look at the steerer for numbers when I had it disassembled. I can do that eventually (when I swap out the wheels for a more appropriate pair) if that might do the trick.

Condorino

Hello again,

Perhaps it is my oversight, as I thought I saw something of the serial number on the detail photo of the seat lug that you posted just above the rear brake cable stop where the seat post enters the frame . . . but looking at the image again it may be just some chipped paint.

If there are no numerical markings on the seat lug, this frame was most likely produced after 1966 (when the 6 digit alphanumeric serial numbers were suspended) but before 1970-1971 when Legnano had pretty much discontinued using their unique seat lug and binder bolt format.

regards,
Mark

Wileyone 

The Roma Olympiad I had didn't have a serial number either. The only # I could find on it was a C2 under the BB.

It was Columbus tubing probably late 60's.

3alarmer 

...thanks. I have seen the stamped ones on some of the Gran Premio models on the side of the seat lug.
I thought for a moment that I was going blind.

3alarmer 

....thank you very much. This is very enlightening (for someone who knows little about Legnano's ).

juvela

-----

found meself thinking there had been an earlier posting of this mount...

discovered it here -

https://m.bikeforums.net/showthread.p...hlight=legnano

-----

T-Mar

A Roma of this era would typically have the serial stamped horizontally on the back of the seat lug, above the brake hanger boss. They were typically built with Falck tubing.

In the late 1960s, circa 1967, they started building with Columbus, then Reynolds and these typically have the serial number on the BB shell, with a 'C' or 'R' incorporated into the format. However, by this time they had also dropped the chrome head lugs, stays and fork blades.

Still, it wouldn't hurt to check inside the bottom of the fork's steer column for the five helical ridges that are indicative of Columbus SL/SP. Or the fork can removed and checked for Columbus' dove logo on the outside of the steerer tube. The latter would also allow checking for a serial number on the steerer tube, though I've never seen a serial number there on the three Legnano I've owned.

3alarmer 

...yep, there it is. This now gives you an idea of how long some of these simple project bikes sit on the back burner.
The Windsor was up and running a whole lot quicker, for sure.

juvela

-----

Enjoyed your Windsor photo. Being taken in partial shade gave the orange colour a softer look than I usually think of for the Windsor orange, which seems similar to Molteni orange. Does it also exhibit this softer look in bright sun? In the photo it is almost going toward apricot compared with the typical Windsor orange.

wrt "back burner" - no need to be embarrassed or feel bad; have frames/bikes in me workshop which have been snoozing for > lxxxv anni

Enjoying reading the observations on Sig. Bozzi from the experts!

-----

3alarmer 

..

3alarmer 

....

3alarmer 

.....

juvela

-----

wrt Gran premio chainsets of the 1950's & 1960's era -

have always been curious as to when the Legnano-Magistroni "Y" pattern sets were employed vs the more commonly seen three-arm sets. wonder if it went by time period or if they were used intermittently.

perhaps @Condorino could explain this...

-----

Slightspeed

Looks a lot like my blue '64 Roma, pictured above (page one), which I've had since new, except for wheels and saddle (Campy branded Brooks with narrow rails on mine originally). Mine had the same Abbrosio stem (recently replaced by Nitto) and Legnano branded bars. I Can't tell much about the brakes, Universal 61 Centerpulls on mine. Are the brake levers Campy? Mine has Universal with gum rubber hoods. Those look like Campy hoods. The paint us ah, interesting. Never saw a color like that. Mine came fitted with Campy bar end shifters. Yours is the only other one I've seen with those. Yours has the crank that mine came with, 53/45? If you like the color, I'd paint the head tube white, and re-apply the decals. They are available. I'd say yours is 90% correct hardware wise. One other thing, mine came with the chrome steel Gran Sport RD, with smoother, non-toothed jockey wheels. Nice ride, always enjoy seeing them!

3alarmer 

.
...it came to me as pictured in that other thread (here), outfitted with MAFAC centerpulls, an Avocet saddle, and in the "interesting" color (which admittedly is not as pretty as most of the other transparent blues and lime greens you see in photos of old Legnano's .) But the paint is pretty good in terms of gloss and it's more or less intact, so I'm gonna keep it as is.

I had considered, as you suggest, painting the head tube white. And I might at some future point do so. It looks like the chrome there has been roughed to better hold paint somewhere in the past. I'm trying to picture in my mind's eye how the standard Legnano decals would look against that red/chocolate brown background, and it's not an attractive image. For now, I'm just gonna build some new 700 c wheels with high flange Campagnolo hubs and call it good.

Slightspeed

Nothing against re-paints. Both the popular Legnano colors are difficult to match. I wish I could find some proper touch-up paint for my blue. I think the white head tube would look good against the paint you have, as well as the white seat tube stripes. The downtube logo on mine is very close to your frame color, and most replacement decals I've seen are too "red" for me. Mine is pictured below. Its not a decal but a kind of porcelain enamel, sort of sloppily applied, as original. You can actually feel the raised white paint of the lettering against the maroon background.

I did see another Legnano repaint, not sure what model, on a Pasadena vintage ride, the all blue one pictured below. It looks great, "wrong" blue, no decals, no white head tube. (notice the chrome seat tube lug, custom touch, nice.) Its your bike. have fun with it, ride it and enjoy. I recently built a Raleigh Super Course from an ugly spray painted found frame. I didn't like the original Raleigh "emerald" type green, so I went with a modern Toyota automotive color close to British racing green, with a little gold flake. I did reapply original decals, and I'm very happy with the result, though purists might not be. Last picture.

Condorino

I must admit to thinking that all of the three arm steel cranksets on the Gran Premio and Roma models during the 50's and 60's were from Magistroni. However the 'Y' configured crankset on this 1959 Gran Premio that I just acquired (as well as the 1958 GP in my collection) is from Way-Assauto. The most visible difference being the 'arched' or curved spiders on the chainrings as the design was more angular on the Magistroni rings. This differentiation can be confirmed in the 1952 Bozzi parts catalog.

It is also interesting that the 'Y' configured Way-Assauto crankset is only presented in the Legnano 'branded' portion of the 1952 Bozzi parts catalog. In the larger general section of the catalog, the Way-Assauto cranksets have the more conventional three prong format. Perhaps this 'Y' configured crankset was produced exclusively for Bozzi SpA and the Legnano brand?

I am thinking that the W.A. cranks may have been less expensive than the Magistroni product and a better positioning for the Gran Premio model that was as a step down from the top-of-the-line Roma. It has also struck me during my collecting and research that Bozzi had a very strong supplier relationship with Way-Assauto over many, many years as their components are widely fitted to many Legnano road and city bikes.

This 1959 Gran Premio is also a one-owner bike that is completely original with the exception of the toe straps and tubular tires that were replaced as worn.

best regards,
Mark

p.s.

I am not sure that I fully answered the question in all of that. Way-Assauto would seem to have changed the design of their crank arms about 1960-1961 from the 'Y' pattern (fixing one of the chainring attaching bolts to the inside arm of the crank) to the more common three-arm configuration used by Magistroni, F.B., Gnutti and others.

Only speculating here but perhaps this was to make the W.A. cranks more compatible with chainrings from these other suppliers as well as accommodating the popular Simplex (Italian production) aluminium chainrings and forged steel adapters that I do not believe will fit the 'Y' format of the earlier W.A. arms.


p.s.

Here is a photo of the Way-Assauto crankset (inside arms stamped 60) that is original to a 1961 Gran Premio in my collection. Here you can see the change after 1959 in the orientation of the three arms that mount the chainrings to the more conventional format.





.

DrHotdogs3

Looking for help in identifying a Legnano frame and box of parts I received. The entire frame was painted primer gray so no decals visible and the head tube has five holes. The only numbers I can find is #6039 on the non-drive side of the seat lug. A set of Nisi rims , looks like tubulars and a Campagnolo Strava crankset. No brakes, seat , or handle bars or stem. After striping the paint I can see the chrome is weathered but shines. Any thoughts on age or model.

DrHotdogs3

Here are some pictures from the restomod I m doing on the Leganon frame. I have repainted the frame a canddy apple gold over a silver metal flake base coat. applied stickers from Velocals. I found them to be a very good quality. Currently gathering other parts for the build and will use a 2 stage clear coat over the paint next.

3alarmer 

^^^nice job. Painting frames is a labor of love, that's for sure.

repechage

The sloppy downtube graphic is a two stage metal stencil that hinged closed around the tube, I thought the method quite intriguing when I first saw it as a kid. I saw one for auction long ago on Italian eBay, went for big dollars.