tbrodzeller

Hello! Long time listener, only a few times posting...
This group has been VERY helpful to me!

I just purchased a trek T2000. From what I've read online, it sounds like the factory wheel set is not good for us as a very heavy team (almost 400lb combined rider weight)
(I will be posting the very nice used wheelset in the near future if anyone is interested)

(I would also like to use these wheels on my Trek T200 as well).

(Nigel was super helpful when I first got my T200 and I built the 135mm rear (Wheel Master HUB RR WM MT1110 QR SF 9sCAS 40x135 SB BK) /dyad set up)

Are the Shimano hubs good?

Specially the front HB-HF08 48 hole and the rear FH HF07 - 48 / 145 mm HG?

I found some NOS - and would build them with a Velocity Dyad 700c 48h Rims.


I could have this done for about ~$350 total for the pair.

I am on a budget, and am willing to spend a little more for a quality wheel set.


On a side note, I also found a nice used FH-HF08 rear with 700c rim - double wall Sun Rim CR18 / 145mm width / 48 spokes
Would that be a good rear wheel set-up? It looks older, but seller claims it rolls true/smooth and is in nice shape...

Thank you in advance!!!!

CaptainHaddock

So, quite honestly, unless you're doing something really hard on the wheels (aggressive gravel riding for example), and unless you're neglecting them (not checking your spoke tension from time to time); ride with what you've got. Yes, lighter spoke count wheels / lighter constructed spokes and/or rims will fail over time, but unless you're ignoring them, you should be well aware of the impending failure.

But if you're bound and determined (far be it from me to say to not spend money, after all I've bought one new wheel set, and re-built a second this year), I would argue that you can't go wrong with the velocity tandem wheelsets.

Artmo 

We have a T2000 with Bontrager tandem wheels and a spoke pulled out of the front hub. I had a similar experience with the front Bontrager wheel on a solo Trek. The hubs are no longer available. Our team weight is about 350lb.
The T2000 is in the UK and I don’t remember the replacement wheel, but it certainly wasn’t Bontrager!
Note that some Velocity have weight limits as a friend found to his cost.

Leisesturm

400lb. is not a 'very heavy team'. Our dept. store Kent Dual Drive had zero issues with a ~375lb team and a loaded trailer. A single wheel trailer I might add. Single wheel trailers put way more load on the back wheel than dual wheel trailers. Never a busted spoke, never a wheel out of true. OTOH our much nicer Raleigh Coupe with Alex Rims and real tandem spec hubs was breaking spokes at an unreasonable rate. What we did, and what we recommend, instead of buying a new wheelset, was to have the existing wheels re-built. I think we paid $80 and I can't recall if that was per wheel or for the pair but either way it was a bargain. But, I have to second and earlier poster and advise making no assumptions about the abilities of the OEM wheelset. Wait until spokes start to break before spending money.

jim_pridx

I'm in agreement with others who've said to try the original wheelset before making any decisions. I would just be sure to have a pro wheel builder who knows tandem wheels to look them over first to be sure that everything looks satisfactory for your team weight.

Regarding your other questions, I'm not familiar with the Shimano hubs, but I would think that running a 48-spoke Dyad with any decent hub would pretty much make for a bombproof wheel at nearly any team weight. We're about a 330 lb. team these days, and I've been running 36 and 40-spoke Dyads off and on for years without any issues at all. As noted above, though, it might be a good idea to check the Velocity weight limits. All in all, they're definitely a reliable rim for tandem use.

tbrodzeller

Thank you everyone for the feedback. I appreciate it!

Currently, my girls are young and we mostly do paved trail and "easy" road riding. My 10 year old loves it - and I hope to do more long road rides and even some overnight bike trips.

My thought was to recoup some of the cost my selling the decent used wheelset to someone who could use them.
I would guess I could get at least a few hundred dollars+ for the wheels I have?


(I should add, I have a NOS front wheel that I bought years ago at a swap that I am planning to list for sale as well)


If they get damaged, they will have little/no value.

The velocity wheelset would cost over $550+ shipping and are 40 spokes.
I can build these with a local builder I trust for under $400. And would think they would be very trustworthy/reliable/bomb-proof wheels)

I have been running a shimano 48 spoke (HB-HF08) on the front for the last 5+ years and have never even had to true it...


Wisconsin roads are nasty and the low spoke count wheels just make me nervous...



Thanks again everyone - it's great to have this forum or information!

reburns

I know that there were some issues with Bontrager tandem wheel hubs of an early vintage. Just our experience, but the wheels on our 2005 T2000 were completely trouble free. Always stayed perfectly true. I kind of liked the serviceability of the rear DT Swiss hub. In 2012 I hit a large metal piece of debris with the rear wheel. The tire flatted immediately and the brake track got a small dent, which started to crack when I inexpertly tried to straighten it. Out of an abundance of caution, I decided to replace the wheel. I could no longer get a rim from Bontrager. I was tempted to try a replacement rim from Rolf of the same paired spoke design. But then I called Mel at tandems East. At the time he felt that the Bontrager wheels were still among the best and sold me a NOS pair. Those have also been trouble free.

I personally would not worry about the wheels failing due to their low spoke count design. The rims are pretty narrow, though, and Dyads might better accommodate wider tires. For reference, we are a 320 lb team. We do a lot of climbing where we live, and occasionally ride a mile or two on gravel.

Paul J

We are a large team too and I would do exactly what you are thinking. Sell the Bontrager tandem wheel set to a lighter team and build the Dyad/Shimano set. We have that exact rim and hub compo on one of our sets of wheels (ours is 40 hole) and they have been very trouble free for many miles. It is just not worth the trouble you are most likely going to experience and as you said, you can recoup some or all of your cost.

merlinextraligh

I think most tandems wheels are way overbuilt. I like to think our team weight is around 340, but it fluctuates, and honestly has like been up to 375.

at that higher weight, we’ve ridden carbon fiber ENVE classics,with 28 spokes, and Zipp 808’s with 24 spokes, and Rolfs, with 20,spokes, all without major problems.
‘So I’d ride the wheels, you got and see how it works out. Realizing the consequence of riding an under spec’d wheel in the vast majority,of cases is unacceptable flex, and high maintenance, I.e. broken spokes, not catastrophic failure.

the Bontager wheels on your bike, are essentially the same as the Rolfs we had. Would not be surprised if at some point a spoke pulled through, given the spoke tension issues inherent in the paired spoke design.

so if you are touring in remote places concerned about being stranded I’d replace them. Otherwise, you’ll get chump Chang out of sellingthem Ride them till and unless they fail.

headwind15

Congratulations for reconizing that the low count wheels have a huge liability attached to them. Besides that TREK had to absolutely stop specing low count wheels on all of their bikes, because if the way that it overstressed the hubs and rims in a very isolated place. Trek has had to warrantee thousands and thousands of low count spoke wheels due to failure. (it was starting to cost the company way too much). I know that some posters on this forum have suggested continue riding on the wheels, but they are not the ones that would get stuck with the hospital bill when you are the ones getting hurt.

merlinextraligh

We’ve put over 25,000 miles on low spoke count paired spoke Rolfs, equivalent to the wheels in the OP’s Trek. There have been issues with spokes pulling through rims,and hubs, and a lot of parts replaced ove the years.

None of those failures rendered the bike unrideable to get home, let alone causing a crash. In all the reports of problems with Rolfs, I’ve yet to see a report of a catastrophic failure causing injury. So while you may issues with the longevity of the wheels and might need to replace a rim over time, they are highly unlikely to cause injury. Low spoke count wheels, setting aside some mavic wheels with a fundamentally flawed design and carbon spokes just don’t asplode.

So it’s more of an issue of lifespan, maintenance hassles, and lack of rigidity, leading to slopppy handling, than it is of safety.

Leisesturm

There is nowhere in the o.p. that indicates that the factory Trek wheels were 'low spoke count'. That might have changed my answer. Maybe. An adult team can weigh but so little. A mass market retailer like Trek has to worst case scenario the products they sell. Those wheels have to be rated for a 400lb. team on normal road surfaces. It wouldn't be my thinking that the factory wheels of a ~15 (?) year old tandem made by Trek (vs Co-Motion, Santana or Calfee) could fetch "a few hundred dollars" on the open market. Blue book valuation for a 2005 T2000 in excellent condition for private sale is "$557 - $573". I personally think this is horribly low, but there you are. For good or ill the information is out there that that is what this bike is worth. The entire bike ... FWIW.

mrfish

Bontrager and Rolf wheels are not the same.

The Bontragers are notorious for hub flanges failing. The spoke holes are a slot with spokes pulling each end of the hole. Cracks propagate from the slots and the hub flange disintegrates, losing tension in 1-2 spokes. This is why they are no longer sold. Luckily my front hub failed while the bike was hanging on the wall. The rear hub also shows cracks starting to propagate.

My bike has only done a few k miles, and we weigh 250lbs so this really should not happen. Inspect your hub flanges carefully.