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gearing

Old 09-09-20, 11:02 AM
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gearing

I'm switching component with a buddy on our 26'' wheeled Truckers. I'm switching from a 2x10 to a 3x9. His is stock and mine was built with a double Tiagra 10 speed group.The triple is 46-36-26, question is will a 26t be enough for a fully loaded bike or should I go lower? I was going to go ahead and order a new ring today while at work but I forgot to check the BCD.
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Old 09-09-20, 12:11 PM
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It is not just the size of the chainring, it also is the size of the biggest sprocket. I use a 24T chainring on my derailleur touring bikes with a 32T biggest sprocket in the rear. Use that on two bikes, one is 700c and one is 26 inch. But I use a friction shifter, I can't comment on how changes in chainrings work with indexed shifters and whatever you plan to use for a front derailleur.
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Old 09-09-20, 12:27 PM
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What kind of weight are you carrying? How bulky is your gear when on the bike? Riding on paved roads, dirt roads or off-road, or trails? How many hills and how steep? How long do you plan to ride per day? Hopw fit are you = what's your average ride now?

Many variables that determine if a gear id low enough. When first touring on logging/mining roads I Northern Ontario, Canada; I used a Bianchi MTB and lowered the gearing to a 24 ring up front and a 34 cog in the rear. That was okay for all the hills and loose surfaces I encountered on a two-weeks long self-supported tour with a total 40 pounds of food, gear and water. I weighed about 160 pounds.

Cheers
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Old 09-09-20, 12:42 PM
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32t cassette and I’m planning a coast to coast unsupported trip so think heavy. Hopefully 99% paved. I’m a fit rider for the past 28 years.
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Old 09-09-20, 01:59 PM
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Gear Ratios are Math .
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Old 09-09-20, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by sloar
I'm switching component with a buddy on our 26'' wheeled Truckers. I'm switching from a 2x10 to a 3x9. His is stock and mine was built with a double Tiagra 10 speed group.The triple is 46-36-26, question is will a 26t be enough for a fully loaded bike or should I go lower? I was going to go ahead and order a new ring today while at work but I forgot to check the BCD.
Have you ever found yourself climbing a hill and thinking “this gear is just too low”? I can’t say that I ever have. I have a 16” low gear on my touring bikes and 14” low gears on my mountain/off-road touring bike. There are times when I’ve wished I had a lower gear...even at that low...but I’ve never thought they were too high.

The BCD is 64mm and a 22 tooth gear will fit on it without modification. If you are willing to do some filing, there are 20 tooth chainrings available for 64mm BCD cranks.
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Old 09-09-20, 04:16 PM
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Originally Posted by sloar
I'm switching component with a buddy on our 26'' wheeled Truckers. I'm switching from a 2x10 to a 3x9. His is stock and mine was built with a double Tiagra 10 speed group.The triple is 46-36-26, question is will a 26t be enough for a fully loaded bike or should I go lower? I was going to go ahead and order a new ring today while at work but I forgot to check the BCD.
On 26" wheels you end up with about a 20-22 gear-inch low gear, depending on your tire selection:

Bicycle Gear Calculator

A low gear of that size is usually considered the lowest necessary for most touring, but obviously that depends on your fitness, loaded bike weight, etc. You could go as small as a 22t chainring and get a few gear-inches lower if you think you'll need it.
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Old 09-09-20, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by cyccommute
Have you ever found yourself climbing a hill and thinking “this gear is just too low”? I can’t say that I ever have. I have a 16” low gear on my touring bikes and 14” low gears on my mountain/off-road touring bike. There are times when I’ve wished I had a lower gear...even at that low...but I’ve never thought they were too high.

The BCD is 64mm and a 22 tooth gear will fit on it without modification. If you are willing to do some filing, there are 20 tooth chainrings available for 64mm BCD cranks.
^^This^^ I crossed the US on the heavy side. IIRC, my low was something like a 17.5. I never once regretted having that gear. What’s could be the downside?

As noted, you can drop the small ring to a 24 or 22 without any issue. I’d also get myself a 34t big cog if you are going heavy.

BTW...The best laid plans....I once had to climb a pass in MT that normally would have been paved but for a road resurfacing project.
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Old 09-09-20, 07:59 PM
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Originally Posted by sloar
... but I forgot to check the BCD.
If it is a 74mm BCD, make sure you get the right bolt pattern, either five bolt or four.

Last edited by Tourist in MSN; 09-09-20 at 08:02 PM.
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Old 09-09-20, 08:05 PM
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Sloar, I can't recall, is your lht 700 or 26in?
like others have said, even on my 16.7 gear inch low troll 44/32/22 11-34, I've never regretted having those low gears. Sure I don't use first gear often, but I'm always appreciative when I do. Last month on my little 6 day trip, I used my first gear a number of times, and like others have said, there just ain't a downside to it.
On this last trip I took less weight than usual, and was tempted to put a smaller cassette on, I have a 12-27 I ride another bike on a lot, but am glad I didn't.

for those who poo poo low gearing, there is very much a macho htfu thing that comes into play, but you'll be easier on your knees and it's pretty damn simple, if you don't need first gear, shift up, it's that easy--BUT all of us who tour self supported with full gear,we know there is the odd time when it's just really nice to have low gears, and you're going to be stronger and faster overall if you don't lug down your legs.

if chainrings are inexpensive, you could get a 24 and a 22 and see what you prefer. The only downside to the 22 is a bigger jump up to the 36. I rode a touring bike for years with a 16t difference (40 and 24) , another bike with 13t difference, but a 10t difference is nice too, so a 24 and a 34 in back might be good. But will mean a cost of cassette and chain probably. The 22 is an easy change, but you'd have to t try it.
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Old 09-09-20, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by djb
...for those who poo poo low gearing, there is very much a macho htfu thing that comes into play, but you'll be easier on your knees and it's pretty damn simple, if you don't need first gear, shift up, it's that easy--BUT all of us who tour self supported with full gear,we know there is the odd time when it's just really nice to have low gears, and you're going to be stronger and faster overall if you don't lug down your legs....
it seems with the technology level for deraillers and gearing, if you're gonna be in the mountains AND carry a heavy load, you're not gonna easily be able to get a range with reasonable steps that has a super-low AND a super high gear. you gots to make a choice.

it's not that you have to choose between pedaling uphill or cranking downhill. the actual choice is PUSHING uphill OR coasting down.
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Old 09-09-20, 10:04 PM
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I guess what is considered reasonable steps depends on the person. I find my 9 speed 11-34 to be ok. My wife's 10 speed 11-36 is slightly better, and I'm sure 11 speed 11-42 is very very similar, ie all three have pretty good percentage jumps suited to touring.
Sure, my mtb triple isn't very highly geared, but honestly, with a heavy bike with very unaero panniers, it's not often that my touring bike can get up past 70kph, very rare indeed. So for me it's not a big deal to have a top end of only 104 gear inches.

if I were to cut my touring load down by half,I'd easily change my 11-34 to a 12-27, just to get the nice closer steps.
if in ten speed then a 12-30,or 34 in 11 speed.
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Old 09-09-20, 10:19 PM
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When I built my LHT, I had a 26 X 34. I live in very hilly territory and when started spring training, was having a hard time (unloaded) with that, so switched to 22 X 34. Thankfully. Recently, did some mountain passes while loaded and would not have made it with the original gearing.
The only problem is, sometimes when switching to lowest CR, the chain will fall off.
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Old 09-10-20, 05:04 AM
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Originally Posted by MarcusT
When I built my LHT, I had a 26 X 34. I live in very hilly territory and when started spring training, was having a hard time (unloaded) with that, so switched to 22 X 34. Thankfully. Recently, did some mountain passes while loaded and would not have made it with the original gearing.
The only problem is, sometimes when switching to lowest CR, the chain will fall off.
To Marcus and sloar, dog fang type simple chain catcher things that you bolt onto your frame work incredibly well. There are numerous companies that make these, I have I believe the dog fangs one on one of my bikes that came stock with it, and it just plain works 99%of the time, great thing to get and probably costs 15 dollars.
When you reduce an inner chain ring size and increase the tooth jump, this is where these devices shine. Of course proper fd adjustment is crucial for low limit screw setting (throw limit) but it helps immensely with fast downshifts to the granny gear.
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Old 09-10-20, 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by MarcusT
....
The only problem is, sometimes when switching to lowest CR, the chain will fall off.
Chain catcher. Photo is not that great, it is the black thing that has a band around the seat tube, it keeps the chain from dropping inside the granny chainring.

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Old 09-10-20, 05:59 AM
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You can get pretty close to perfect gearing in 9 speed with a little work. 20-30-40 rings and a 11-40 cassette. What makes it all work is a side swing front derailleur. Because the cage moves horizontally you can run it real close to the chain rings, and it doesn't change height like top or bottom swing ones do.
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Old 09-10-20, 06:58 AM
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sloar, to be more specific, if you change the 26 to a 22, you'll see that when you shift down to the 22 from the 36, you'll usually have to shift up at the rear one or two gears so that you arent spinning to much.
Easy to do, and you get used to it quickly.
You'll also see that you won't want to used the smaller cogs at the back cassette when in the 22 chainring, as the rd will get slack and the chain may rub on the rd jockey wheels and chain, but its not a big deal and just makes a noise to remind you its time to shift up to the mid ring again.
In real life, this just means that you wont use the last two or three cogs in the back, so the 11t, 12, 13t or whatever, but not a big deal, you just learn to not go to the end of the cassette in the 22t, simple
The big advantage is that changing the 26 to a 22 is an easy peasy change, you'll use the existing chain length and your fd should be able to handle the change without any changes or anything, and the bar end shifters make shifting easy also.

just get a chain catcher and you'll be set , with an easy lowering of your low gears probably equivalent to about 1 or more lower shift.
On my first touring bike 30 years ago, I changed the 50/40/28 to 50/40/24 and it was an easy fix to get the low gear from 25 gear inches down to about 21, so about one gear shifts worth lower gearing and made all the difference. You should be able to lower your stock low gear inch down to around 20 gear inches, look up sheldon browns gear calculator or the "html gear calculator" and you'll get the numbers for your bike.
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Old 09-10-20, 08:47 AM
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Just changing the 32T cassette to at 34T will get you to around 19 gear inches. Even with the 32T you are just above 20". YMMV of course, but I am at 20.9" on my 700c Trucker, carry what I would call a "medium" load, and it is low enough for me.
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Old 09-10-20, 09:40 AM
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74 BCD, I can’t find a 22t. Smallest I can find is a 24t
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Old 09-10-20, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Miele Man
What kind of weight are you carrying? How bulky is your gear when on the bike? Riding on paved roads, dirt roads or off-road, or trails? How many hills and how steep? How long do you plan to ride per day? Hopw fit are you = what's your average ride now?

Many variables that determine if a gear id low enough. When first touring on logging/mining roads I Northern Ontario, Canada; I used a Bianchi MTB and lowered the gearing to a 24 ring up front and a 34 cog in the rear. That was okay for all the hills and loose surfaces I encountered on a two-weeks long self-supported tour with a total 40 pounds of food, gear and water. I weighed about 160 pounds.

Cheers
I run the same. I prefer the 24x34 over the stock 26x34 on my Long Haul Trucker.
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Old 09-10-20, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by sloar
74 BCD, I can’t find a 22t. Smallest I can find is a 24t
A 24 is teh smallest that will fit on a 74mm BCD.

The 22 mentioned was for a different crankset.

After you install it, put it on a workstand (or if you are like me, no workstand, instead you flip the bike upside down), put the chain on the 24 and then see how far you can get the chain to the smallest sprockets without getting to the point where the cage is too short to take up all the slack and the chain rubs against itself. (DJB was mentioning that earlier.) When I first switched to a 24T chainring I found that I could not use the 11 or 12T sprockets on the cassette, but those were highly cross chained so I wanted to avoid those anyway.

In my case I removed a 30T chainring to install the 24, if you had a 26, you might not have any problem using the chain on the small/small, although you should avoid it as being highly cross chained.

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Old 09-10-20, 05:08 PM
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Everything is switched over. I’m going to order a 24t ring and see how I like it. I may go a little bigger on the cassette. I’m getting close to being done finally.
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Old 09-10-20, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by saddlesores
it seems with the technology level for deraillers and gearing, if you're gonna be in the mountains AND carry a heavy load, you're not gonna easily be able to get a range with reasonable steps that has a super-low AND a super high gear. you gots to make a choice.

it's not that you have to choose between pedaling uphill or cranking downhill. the actual choice is PUSHING uphill OR coasting down.
I disagree. This is my gearing on my touring bike



The steps in the high and middle range are quite nice for cruising. The shift from the middle ring to the inner ring is a bit large but if I have to use the inner ring, I usually have other things to worry about.

The drivetrain technology I’m using is just 9 speed (I have some 10 speed mountain bikes with similar gearing) and the derailer might even be 8 speed...it’s an old gray XTR. The cassette is a Sunrace 11-36 9 speed. The only addition I made so that the old XTR would handle the 36 is to add a Wolf Link.

_IMG4968 by Stuart Black, on Flickr

I don’t have to push uphills nor do I have coast downhills. I’m not moving very fast in the 15” gear (between 3 and 4 mph) but with a 115” high I can spin it up to about 40mph before I have to coast.
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Old 09-10-20, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by sloar
Everything is switched over. I’m going to order a 24t ring and see how I like it. I may go a little bigger on the cassette. I’m getting close to being done finally.
cool. Now it's time to get yer keester in that seat for regular riding. It can be good to increase distances and load weight bit by bit and the more hours you spend riding the better it will be to make small fit adjustments, and to gradually get stronger as you add more weight to the bike.
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Old 09-10-20, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by sloar
Everything is switched over. I’m going to order a 24t ring and see how I like it. I may go a little bigger on the cassette. I’m getting close to being done finally.
Looks great!
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