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My first set of Compass tires, $162.00 waste of money

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My first set of Compass tires, $162.00 waste of money

Old 05-10-18, 02:14 PM
  #26  
rpthomas
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I wrote WTB technical support and they told me that the rim does not have a max psi, to use the guidlines on the tire itself which what I did, Compass tire said max psi 75 lbs and I ran them at 50.
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Old 05-10-18, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by rpthomas View Post
I wrote WTB technical support and they told me that the rim does not have a max psi, to use the guidlines on the tire itself which what I did, Compass tire said max psi 75 lbs and I ran them at 50.
the tyres are very very good but the rims are **** (you can buy the rims here in the uk for very cheap)

get new wheels and try again
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Old 05-10-18, 03:20 PM
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Glad you like your Ramblers.
I had thought about buying compass, but after hearing multiple reports like yours, I think I'll stick with the ramblers.
Those Compass tires were not designed to be tubleless, and as best as I can tell they just put a not stretch bead on it and call it good. Jan doesn't like tubeless, and is only doing it because the market is kinda forcing him to.

Personally, with a tire like that, I set it up with a tube, ride it for a week or two to ensure it stretches, seats, and takes its shape properly. Then I remount it using a skinnystripper to seal the tire into a psuedo "tubeless" tire so it can't blow off or burp. That has worked for me on iffy tires, but maybe I'm lucky. Ultimately I think it depends a lot on the diameter of the tire and the wheel (which are NOT standard).
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Old 05-10-18, 06:30 PM
  #29  
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Compass tires are not great tires. I have seen many sets come in with complete side wall cuts. The side walls are very soft and supple. I honestly had no idea they were that expensive. We stopped selling they last year.
Chalk it up and grab some new tires or try running them with tubes but the sides walls are still soo soft in my opinion.
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Old 05-10-18, 06:41 PM
  #30  
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Originally Posted by TimothyH View Post
Could this be a [BST] vs UST compatibility issue similar to the Schwalbe G-One's blowing off Stan's and American Classic rims?


-tim-


Tubeless Standards, see Post #14

SEAL THE DEAL

To The Point - UST Rims and Tires

It sounds like it is time for Tubeless tire and rim manufacturers to sit down around a big table and start hashing out a universal standard.

We're now nearly 20 years into this tubeless thing, and patents will begin to expire soon.

UST seems to be pretty specific about the locking mechanism.

The WTB ST i25 tubeless ready rims (not STP) seem to indicate a UST compatible design.

WTB ST Rims

I can't find any notes on Compass of the actual standards they are attempting to follow.

I bought a pair of once-mounted Bon Jon Pass tires. It is hard to tell for sure, but it appears as if they have a fairly square bead, so they may well be UST compliant, although in theory true UST shouldn't require sealant.

I have a pair of Schwalbe One Pro tires. The bead seems much rounder, so I'm thinking Stans BST.

Anyway, if Compass is, in fact, using UST or similar, then it should have been fine, as long as the beads were properly seated. But, they should take the next step and certify their tires.
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Old 05-10-18, 08:14 PM
  #31  
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What if you had died from the blowout, then they would owe your family millions.

No big surprise they refuse to pay for rims, no one is going to and no one is liable unless negligence is proven in court. If someone is to blame why didn't your bike store notice the tire has an obvious defect?
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Old 05-10-18, 08:42 PM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by chas58 View Post
Personally, with a tire like that, I set it up with a tube, ride it for a week or two to ensure it stretches, seats, and takes its shape properly. Then I remount it using a skinnystripper to seal the tire into a psuedo "tubeless" tire so it can't blow off or burp. That has worked for me on iffy tires, but maybe I'm lucky. Ultimately I think it depends a lot on the diameter of the tire and the wheel (which are NOT standard).
What is a skinnystripper? I'm guessing you're not talking about a girl at the club.
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Old 05-10-18, 09:49 PM
  #33  
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I have to be fair and update that later today Compass contacted me through email and has agreed to pay for the damage. The LBS owner told me they talked to him and then agreed to pay. Seems fair to me and surprised me.
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Old 05-11-18, 08:11 AM
  #34  
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Originally Posted by rpthomas View Post
I have to be fair and update that later today Compass contacted me through email and has agreed to pay for the damage. The LBS owner told me they talked to him and then agreed to pay. Seems fair to me and surprised me.
Good to hear, but still...

Is the ride quality worth it?
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Old 05-11-18, 08:14 AM
  #35  
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That is very surprising and speaks well of the company.

I have been a critic of Jan Heine/Compass but have to give credit where it is due.

Kudos as well to the LBS who advocated on your behalf. Sounds like you have a good shop behind you.
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Old 05-11-18, 09:01 AM
  #36  
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That's a good story. I had a good image of the company in my mind, and this restored it. I enjoy Jan Heine's blog, and I pay for a subscription to Bicycle Quarterly. I haven't bought any of his products, though.
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Old 05-11-18, 10:03 AM
  #37  
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I've had some DIY experience running tubeless sometimes with non-approved and improvised products and although I love tubeless and will always use it I think any new tubeless setup should be considered sketchy until it's been tested and inspected carefully especially if it was done by someone else. There are so many variables involved like the elasticity of the tire bead, leaky valve seals, shape of the rim, the type of sealant and whether there's some dry sealant at the edges. I'm glad it wasn't your front tire and that Compass came thru eventually. I think the manufacturer is reputable and makes quality products. I wouldn't want Panaracer to quit making tubeless-compatible tires for us so it behoves us to be cautious with new tires.

Last edited by Clem von Jones; 05-11-18 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 05-11-18, 10:27 AM
  #38  
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Originally Posted by Clem von Jones View Post
I've had some DIY experience running tubeless sometimes with non-approved and improvised products and although I love tubeless and will always use it I think any new tubeless setup should be considered sketchy until it's been tested and inspected carefully especially if it was done by someone else. There are so many variables involved like the elasticity of the tire bead, leaky valve seals, shape of the rim, the type of sealant and whether there's some dry sealant at the edges. I'm glad it wasn't your front tire and that Compass came thru eventually. I think the manufacturer is reputable and makes quality products. I wouldn't want Panaracer to quit making tubeless-compatible tires for us so it behoves us to be cautious with new tires.
This. The tire manufacturer can try to make their tires with careful design and tight QC, but they don't have control over which rims, tape, sealant, etc it gets installed with.
@rpthomas, do you know if the shop tried airing your tires up to the max rating to test the fit before you got them?
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Old 05-11-18, 11:52 AM
  #39  
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Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
What is a skinnystripper? I'm guessing you're not talking about a girl at the club.
For gosh sake, don't google it!!! (or its original name : fattystripper).

I created a thread to explain it:
https://www.bikeforums.net/cyclocros...l#post20334985
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Old 05-11-18, 12:01 PM
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Compass tires may have a tubeless bead but they obviously omit any of the other features that make tubeless work well.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:18 PM
  #41  
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Originally Posted by chas58 View Post
For gosh sake, don't google it!!! (or its original name : fattystripper).
Right? Especially since I'm at work!

I created a thread to explain it:
https://www.bikeforums.net/cyclocros...l#post20334985
Thanks! I will check it out.

Tubeless seems like more trouble than it's worth. Especially considering how nice quality tires and tubes ride. Plus, no messy sealants.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:18 PM
  #42  
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
This. The tire manufacturer can try to make their tires with careful design and tight QC, but they don't have control over which rims, tape, sealant, etc it gets installed with.
@rpthomas, do you know if the shop tried airing your tires up to the max rating to test the fit before you got them?
Not exactly. As mentioned by @TimothyH, and a few notes in my previous post #30

There are a couple of different rim and bead standards. Specifically UST (square bead) and BST (Stans round bead).

If one creates spec standards on rim design, and the rims adhere to the specs, and the tire manufacturers make their tires to work with those specs, then there is no longer a huge compatibility issue.

Unfortunately, possibly for patent. trademark, or other reasons, very few manufacturers are adhering to the specs. So, it becomes a free-for-all, and "tubeless ready" may not, in fact, be "tubeless compatible".

While the OP's rims may, in fact, be UST compatible, Compass doesn't specifically list their tires as being UST compatible.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:26 PM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Right? Especially since I'm at work!
OH,

Reminds me of doing support for engineers at my previous job.

An Engineer came to me and told me her boss wanted her to look up pool heaters and gave her a link that was being blocked by the company's net nanny.

It turns out the Engineer forgot a very important dash in the website name.

www.hotbox.com link blocked by the work net nanny.
www.hot-box.com Intended link for pool heaters.
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Old 05-11-18, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by AlmostTrick View Post
Tubeless seems like more trouble than it's worth. Especially considering how nice quality tires and tubes ride. Plus, no messy sealants.
I haven't quite gotten tubeless rolling yet, but will probably go that way in the next couple of months.

I have a mini tour heading through the desert and goathead territory, off the beaten path, and thus where cars haven't blown everything off the road.

While I may be able to use tubes, tire liners, sealants, and etc, the tubeless just seems to make sense. At least before heading off down the road.
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Old 05-11-18, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
OH,
It turns out the Engineer forgot a very important dash in the website name.

www.hotbox.com link blocked by the work net nanny.
www.hot-box.com Intended link for pool heaters.
Well that certainly could get somebody looking for hot water into some hot water!
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Old 05-11-18, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
Not exactly. As mentioned by @TimothyH, and a few notes in my previous post #30

There are a couple of different rim and bead standards. Specifically UST (square bead) and BST (Stans round bead).

If one creates spec standards on rim design, and the rims adhere to the specs, and the tire manufacturers make their tires to work with those specs, then there is no longer a huge compatibility issue.

Unfortunately, possibly for patent. trademark, or other reasons, very few manufacturers are adhering to the specs. So, it becomes a free-for-all, and "tubeless ready" may not, in fact, be "tubeless compatible".

While the OP's rims may, in fact, be UST compatible, Compass doesn't specifically list their tires as being UST compatible.
Are BST and UST necessarily compatible with each other? One would hope that these standards are attempting to be backward-compatible with the common BSDs at least.

I'll expect the whole industry to adopt one standard around the same time the country goes to single-payer healthcare.
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Old 05-11-18, 01:48 PM
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Guitar Ted suspects that some tire manufacturers are hesitant to claim their tire is one standard or the other as it will limit sales.

These are probably splitting the difference between the UST and BST specs and trying to make tires which work with either type of rim.

Threads like this are the result.
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Old 05-11-18, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
Are BST and UST necessarily compatible with each other?

Nope,

As far as I can tell, they may work together, somewhat like putting duct tape on a vintage rim and popping on a tubeless tire may work, but there is no guarantee it will stay in place.

For safety's sake (and to prevent issues like this blowoff), one would expect companies to develop and adhere to standards.

It would be like getting Ford and Chevy tubeless rims, and Firestone and Michelin tubeless tires, and not quite knowing if one would work with the other. Yes, I know there are a plethora of tire sizes, but with few exceptions, the rim interface and bead lock are pretty universal.

The bicycle industry has too many standards.... or non-standards. But, say 1 1/8" stems and 31.8mm handlebars are pretty universal now. Yep, there are some older standards, but the 1 1/8 & 31.8 are taking over. Hopefully in the future there will be less need to worry about 25.6, 26.0, or 26.4 bars. Or 22.2 or 22.0 or 21.15 quills
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Old 05-11-18, 02:28 PM
  #49  
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Engineers' joke: the great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from!
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Old 05-11-18, 02:35 PM
  #50  
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It is really a bummer all I am reading about issues with Compass tubeless.

I am on my 3rd set of Compass Tires. Stampede Pass, then Bon Jon Pass, and now Barlow Pass. All extralight.

I have looooooved them all. IMO they live up to every once of their hype and then some.

For my last wheelset, I got them built with WTB KOM i21 rims, so I could try tubeless, and I got the Barlow Pass tires planning to run them tubeless. I got them last fall, but just never got around to setting them up.

I planned to set them up this weekend, but when I googled info on setting up Compass tubeless, I read nothing but problems. And then an hour later this theead pops up.

Guess I’ll stick with tubes for now.

Been running tubeless on my MTB for many years with zero issues and easy setup with a floor pump every time.
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