Electronic Shifting - What's the Point?
10-23-20, 12:38 AM
#151
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If I had a mechanical shifter with a disconnected cable I think I'd notice that the day before the ride. And even if I didn't, I could replace the cable in less than 10 minutes.
10-23-20, 07:57 AM
#152
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He had to ride mtb instead until he had time to think what was happening. So yes, that was easy to diagnose.
If I had a mechanical shifter with a disconnected cable I think I'd notice that the day before the ride. And even if I didn't, I could replace the cable in less than 10 minutes.
If I had a mechanical shifter with a disconnected cable I think I'd notice that the day before the ride. And even if I didn't, I could replace the cable in less than 10 minutes.
10-23-20, 08:19 AM
#153
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At the same time, I am strangely tempted to buy a solenoid and one of the microcontroller project kits and build one. Because I'm attracted to cool but pointless ideas I guess.
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10-23-20, 08:23 AM
#154
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10-23-20, 08:31 AM
#155
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Well you have another 30 years to be able to compare with mine. I used to be finicky too and in my early days took my bikes apart down to the bearings and beyond.
Still, no one is forcing you to use electronic shifting..... yet. I still feel that eventually it will be the norm. And it's just a different skill set that you will need to learn.
Still, no one is forcing you to use electronic shifting..... yet. I still feel that eventually it will be the norm. And it's just a different skill set that you will need to learn.
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10-23-20, 11:29 AM
#157
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10-23-20, 11:37 AM
#158
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David
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10-23-20, 11:44 AM
#159
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Earlier this year BC (Before COVID) I purchased a bike with SRAM Force eTap AXS.
So far I haven't been very impressed with electronic shifting or at least with SRAM's electronic shifting. I haven't tried EPS or Di2 so I can't really compare apples to apples. However I do have a couple of other bikes with Shimano Ultegra, 105, Campy Record 12 and Chorus 12--all mechanical. I don't think the SRAM eTap shifts any more consistently or reliably than any other groupset I have. As a matter of fact I sometimes think the mechanical groupsets might shift better. The one thing I do think is pretty cool, but not all necessary, is the wireless connectivity.
Am I missing something? What are others' thoughts on electronic shifting?
So far I haven't been very impressed with electronic shifting or at least with SRAM's electronic shifting. I haven't tried EPS or Di2 so I can't really compare apples to apples. However I do have a couple of other bikes with Shimano Ultegra, 105, Campy Record 12 and Chorus 12--all mechanical. I don't think the SRAM eTap shifts any more consistently or reliably than any other groupset I have. As a matter of fact I sometimes think the mechanical groupsets might shift better. The one thing I do think is pretty cool, but not all necessary, is the wireless connectivity.
Am I missing something? What are others' thoughts on electronic shifting?
My bikes both have internally routed cables and they are a pain to deal with. I also have some problems with cable friction, even with Campy's latest maximum smoothness cables for 12 speed. Force is so easy to set up that it's ridiculous, although there are some people who spend hours setting up the FD, that I did just this morning in about 15 minutes. I got my first disc brake frame recently and I'm trading parts over from one bike to another.
I'm finding a lot more cross compatibility than expected with Force. I managed to run the new 10-36 cassette with the standard FD, not the wide model and also found that the Campy 12 cranks work fine with AXS. I'm also using Shimano GRX 46/30 11 speed cranks with AXS, but I do use some shim washers to eliminate the +2.5mm chainline.
10-23-20, 11:49 AM
#160
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I think this sums it up. I think this question, as well as disc brakes on road bikes, comes down to personality and philosophy. I find a simple bicycle that I understand how to work on appealing. I'm spending way more time with technology trying to be a teacher during a pandemic so I appreciate my analog bicycle even more. I don't even use a gps computer on my rides generally unless I'm exploring an unfamiliar route. I totally accept that others feel differently and I'm willing to acknowledge that electronic shifting is better performing--I just don't care.
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10-23-20, 12:44 PM
#162
Newbie
I've considered electronic shifting for my latest N+1 purchase, but decided not. I'm using my bicycles for long multi-day and sometimes multi-week trips, and another set of batteries that need charging is unwelcome. In addition, I *can* fix a broken drivetrain on the road when it's mechanical, but that's unlikely when it's electronic. Finally, I expect any electronic shifting system to be obsolete in about ten years. I know that when I maintain my mechanical campagnolo gruppo well it will last for at least forty years. But will I be able to re-program or read out my EPS, Di2 or Etap in forty years? Surely not.
Last edited by WouterO; 10-23-20 at 01:00 PM.
10-23-20, 12:58 PM
#163
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I've considered electronic shifting for my latest N+1 purchase, but decided not. I'm using my bicycles for long multi-day and sometimes multi-week trips, and another set of batteries that need charging is unwelcome. In addition, I *can* fix a broken drivetrain on the road when it's mechanical, but that's unlikely when it's electronic. Finally, I expect any electronic shifting system to be obsolete in about ten years. I know that when I maintain my mechanical campagnolo gruppo well it will last for at least forty years. But will I be able to re-program or read out my EPS, Di2 or Etap in fourty years? Surely not.
Electronic is not for everyone and every circumstance.
Do you plan on bringing a cell phone?
10-23-20, 01:05 PM
#164
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And yes, I do bring a cell-phone, but keeping it charged over a week of bikepacking is not always trivial. Then I have to keep my GPS unit alive, and a GoPro if time and opportunity allows...
10-23-20, 01:16 PM
#165
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FYI... I get around 800 miles on a charge using Sram eTap. And that's when the RD LED goes from green to red. If I swap front to rear batteries,I bet I can get 1000 miles before both need a charge.
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10-23-20, 01:17 PM
#166
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Not doing electronic at the moment because I don't need it - my 10sp Ergos were just overhauled and are crisp&delightful, and I have a few 10sp cassettes to get through. I used to be skeptical of electronic, but I acknowledge that electronic's the future, and I'm sure I'll love it when I ultimately make the change. Really, the only hurdles I can see are (i) the cost - I'm not ready to fork out for Super Record - let's see some trickle-down to Chorus, and (ii) having to retrofit my frame for electronic - I have a 20-year old Ti frame that I love and don't want to replace. There are firms that can apparently retrofit Ti for electronic (and disks, although I'm not wild about them trying to cold set 6/4 Ti for a wider rear hub), which would likely be cheaper than a whole new frame. The other option is to hold out and see if Campag come out with wireless electronic.
10-23-20, 04:42 PM
#167
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Around me, there are a couple other people with campag equipped bikes (mostly older 10 speed stuff) but I have never seen a modern Colnago in the wild.
Last edited by vespasianus; 10-23-20 at 05:13 PM.
10-23-20, 05:24 PM
#168
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I was diligent the first year or so to check that the system was functioning before leaving the house if doing a remote ride. It always was and is, for years, so you kind of take it for granted. I’d bet few folks actually run the shifters on a mechanical system before a ride to make sure no cables have broken. Funny that in order to get the BT back I had to basically re-boot the bike. Same kind of troubleshooting you do with a phone.
10-23-20, 05:46 PM
#169
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I love my Di2. No broken shifter cables, no jumping gears, set it & forget it, auto-trim, dumping gears with one click, switching Garmin screens with buttons on the hood, sprint shifters (I ride on the drops a lot), and countless other stuff. Di2 looked like an unnecessary luxury until I owned a bike with it now it's a must-have.
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10-23-20, 05:51 PM
#170
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I have four road bikes - all have the Ultegra Di2 groupset. Two are 10 speed, two are 11 speed. I will never by a bike without Di2. Anything you read about batteries dead is wrong. The shifting is crisp, precise, reliable and maintenance free. Worth every nickel. That’s over 30,000 miles of hard riding experience talking.
FWIW, 19 of 21 Tour de France teams ride Dura Ace Di2............
FWIW, 19 of 21 Tour de France teams ride Dura Ace Di2............
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Ride hard and ride on......
Ride hard and ride on......
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10-26-20, 01:29 AM
#171
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Well you have another 30 years to be able to compare with mine. I used to be finicky too and in my early days took my bikes apart down to the bearings and beyond.
Still, no one is forcing you to use electronic shifting..... yet. I still feel that eventually it will be the norm. And it's just a different skill set that you will need to learn.
Still, no one is forcing you to use electronic shifting..... yet. I still feel that eventually it will be the norm. And it's just a different skill set that you will need to learn.
10-26-20, 01:43 AM
#172
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Auto - shift
I'm waiting to buy a new bike. I will wait till it shifts by itself and I don't have to pedal.. 😎
10-26-20, 01:47 AM
#173
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The problem with electronics is that it's not a skillset that you can learn. Most electronics, including Di2, run on propietary software. You don't know how it works, Shimano doesn't want you to know, and unless you reverse engineer it, you won't know. So if a firmware update makes it fail or whatever happens, you're screwed regardless of what skills you have.
10-26-20, 04:55 AM
#174
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The problem with electronics is that it's not a skillset that you can learn. Most electronics, including Di2, run on propietary software. You don't know how it works, Shimano doesn't want you to know, and unless you reverse engineer it, you won't know. So if a firmware update makes it fail or whatever happens, you're screwed regardless of what skills you have.
Seriously, I have Sram eTap, left shifts left, right shifts right and both changed the chainring.
Doesn't seem that hard.
10-26-20, 05:43 AM
#175
Senior Member
You knowing what button does what has nothing to do with having an idea of how the system works at the electronic/software level. You simply don't know that and won't be able to unless you are a SRAM or Shimano engineer.
It's true that, theoretically, you don't need to know it to use the system. Until your system fails and is out of warranty and SRAM considers it obsolete. Meanwhile, there are lots of 30 year old derailleurs that still work.