firebird854

I feel like no one has said this yet, but OP noted that the segment goes right through a stop sign. Given this, it should absolutely be regarded as dangerous and flagged as such. Even if it's "not always busy" sometimes there's a mega tailwind during the most busy time and some dumb guy is going to try his luck and get hit by a car.

There's zero conclusive evidence that the person the KOM was taken from reported it has hazardous, and, if they did, who cares? It is actually hazardous, you could even make your own KOM on that route that goes up to or starts from the stop sign.

I think it's BS when highly contested short segments go through a stop sign or intersection, I get if you're making a long TT one or something, then it's kind of expected that you'll slow down and look, but for a quick 1-minute effort type I highly doubt people will even slow down at all, and this just makes cyclists look bad in general.

rubiksoval

I don't think it does (unless this is brand new, as I flagged a few rides a while back). You can put your GPS in your car and drive around with it and be fine until someone manually flags it. Strava then sends an automatic email to the person asking them to crop their ride, delete it, or confirm everything is okay. That's that.

If it's flagged for a second time, then an actual person checks in and says "what makes this legitmate?"

At that point it's either removed or it's verified and you can't flag it anymore.

upthywazzoo 

Tried to do more digging on this. Beyond saying "we have a flagging system" Strava hasn't really divulged how their auto flagging system works. From their newsletter: "Improved impossible effort detection… False KOMs, QOMs, CRs dethroned!". So I think they've had an algorithm in place for at least a little while before now.

This article gives barely any more information on the improvement: https://www.cyclist.co.uk/news/7820/...gical-ordering

I still don't know if their system works or will work, honestly.

seypat

Speaking of the local area, my son graduated from LC Bird this year. He rejected the schools in the western part of the state and decided to be a Ram. I thought it was the right decision. Unless things continue to change(I think they will), he will be moving into that big glass dorm across from Monroe park between Main and Cary.

In the blink of an eye it will be happening to you. It happens so fast. Enjoy it while it lasts.

79pmooney

Question from a non-Strava user - can anyone else see if you stopped while doing a section? And, if yes, OP, did the previous record holder stop at the stop sign?

79pmooney

Nobody really answered your question about the meaning of KOM. It comes from pro racing, specifically the 3 week grand tours in France, Italy and Spain. The rider with enough accumulated points for arriving in the top three at mountain top finish lines mid-way in races gets to wear the KOM jersey and upon the finish is awarded the KOM trophy and prize money. Times up the especially hard climbs used regularly (the routes of the grand tours change every year but some segments get used a lot) get recorded and breaking those times is considered a big deal.

The current possessor of the KOM points get to ride that day's stage wearing the KOM jersey, For the Tour de France, that jersey is the famous polka-dot jersey, that pattern being the trademark of the French newspaper that first sponsored the KOM over 100 years ago.

Ben

spelger

when i look at the elevation profile and set the x axis to time instead of the default miles then yes, i can see where i stopped. but not at a stop sign, that is far too short to detect. what i see in the elevation profile with time as the x axis is a flat line for how long i was stopped. it can be quite subtle depending on how long i was stopped and how long the over all ride was.

spelger

don't they get a nice smootchy-smootch too?

Bah Humbug

I learned something today! Thank you.

rubiksoval

Yes, you can see if people slow down/stop. Time keeps running regardless, even if you turn off the Garmin.

rubiksoval

I'm wondering if this deals more with runs being uploaded as rides (it'd be pretty easy to automatically flag 10 min 5ks, for example). I think I flagged a car user just two weeks ago who averaged 14 mph for the first half of the ride and 38 for the second half...

Edited: Yep, can confirm there's definitely no auto flagging for bike rides. Just found one in the city. 12 mph for the first 50 minutes, then dude did 7 miles at 67 mph, peaking at 88 mph. Quite the speedster.

SurferCyclist

Well if you ride and get a KOM it counts, obviously. The point I was making was just how hung up some people are on getting KOMs, it seems to be the reason some ride. As I said whatever floats ya boat. As you don't have much to worry about in the KOM dept(your words), why then have them listed in signature? Just wondering.

Dan333SP

Agree. We have some sub-1 mile segments around here that include stop signs, and having seen people sprint through intersections without slowing to attack them, I ended up making a few mini-segments starting just before the stop and going out into the intersection with names like "HEY LOOK AT ME I RAN A STOP SIGN" and "STRAVA IS MORE IMPORTANT TO ME THAN SAFETY" so the people chasing the longer segment would have those segments pop up as KOMs as well, a sort of public shaming if you will.

DrIsotope

If Strava deleted all of the local segments with intersections in them, probably 60% of all segments would disappear. Most of what's left would be half a mile to a mile long. I'd be 100% okay with Strava deleting all of the micro-segments, the ones just long enough that the system will let them be created.

AFAIC, if someone gets hit by cross traffic while running an intersection to chase a meaningless digital crown, that's a sort of natural selection at work. I have zero issue with "interrupted" segments. If you can time those stoplights, you'll get a decent time. Pretty much every top-placing segment effort has a little bit of luck-- or with seemingly increasing frequency, conniving-- involved.

Much easier to just sort the leaderboard for any segment by "My Results." I know that on a good day, I can beat that guy.

MattTheHat 

Purely for the heck of it.

sfrider 

They could make segments smarter. For example, the creator could specify stops signs, and the segment would then require a rider to come a stop. (Say < 2 mph.)

Another option would be a rest section, like a downhill. While they do allow sections to be ignored (at least I believe so, or maybe it's only courses), the segment creator could look at a reasonable safe descent speed, say 20 mph, and make it a recovery. Then when starting the downhill a timer starts, and you can do whatever you want during this time - stop, coast, roll downhill, pedal lightly, drink water, eat a gel, whatever. Then when you reach the end of the rest section, or effectively the bottom of the hill, you're on the clock again. If the timer runs out the clock starts regardless of where you are. This way you're given a certain time to get down a hill safely, have a sip of water, or whatever - and everyone gets the same time.

rubiksoval

But, why?

The entire point is going as fast as possible over the allotted distance. Making rest periods, besides being impossible on strava, defeats the entire purpose.

It's the reason why you can't simply start and stop your time on a segment to take a break. The segment only measures when you first began and when you ended, regardless of what you do with your computer.

No way on earth anyone would actually abide by a <2 mph stop or whatever.

sfrider 

To keep people from getting killed or injured, breaking laws, and making cyclists look irresponsible?

For example, this downhill is part of a popular SF Bay Area segment (with I think over 100k best efforts). At -8 to -10% it's easy to get to 50mph if I you want to, but if you come around one of the blind corners at that speed and there's a patch of gravel (cars frequently drag dirt onto the road as they cut the corner too close), a small landslide, a stalled vehicle, foot wide crack in the pavement, or you just overcook it - you're in trouble. Since what the segment is really about is the climb up the hill (twice), the descent doesn't have to be a factor. It's not a closed course. Every once in a while people who miscalculate risks, not just road users but also hikers, have to be recovered from below a cliff.

rubiksoval

You can apply that to simply riding a road bike, period.

Like I said, not only is it impossible to do in strava, it's ridiculous to think anyone would abide by it.

If something is hazardous, you can flag it as such. The idea of putting breaks in segments is really silly, though.

dr_max

blame the player, not the game

you are facing a bike sociopath

CliffordK

Hmmm... so Strava pops up an E-Mail... "Your KOM has been stolen", why not go and steal it back?

Unfortunately, the people who are snagging my KOMs appear to be just a little stronger riders than me. So, while I might light pedal to the beginning of the segment and hammer it hard, they're pushing 20 MPH all day long, plus snagging a couple of KOMS they happen to pass by.

I can't say about the "Dangerous Segment" KOM? Was it dangerous? Did you break the law to get your KOM?

We've got one segment. Kind of a fun segment. 10 blocks long. I think the city has messed with the light timing a few times over the years (pretty close to 20 MPH now). I've come to the conclusion that one can not get a KOM by simply starting on a green light and finishing on a green light. My current tactic is to start on a stale yellow, and catch up on the light cycle through the 10 blocks and finish on the red/green changeover. Unfortunately, I also have to find a time with light traffic. I could imagine that if I had to actually run a red light to get the KOM, it might get flagged as dangerous. ... Could I do the first couple of blocks fast enough to jump a light cycle (red/green changeover to stail yellow, followed by catching up in the light cycle)? Still, that would be pushing pretty hard for me (and consistently 5 to 10 MPH or more above the speed limit).

I have about 2 downhill segments that I like, and one that I'm even questioning the sanity (very high speeds coming into the edge of the city).

Anyway... how dangerous was the segment?

dr_max

I wonder if a cyclist ever got killed trying to get a King Of the Mountain on a city street running through 10 city lights. That would be Stravapathologic.

CliffordK

It should be safe enough if one is doing it legally, on green lights, while watching side traffic, turning traffic, etc.

But, it could be bad if one starts running red lights. Also, early/late in the light cycle can be dangerous.

I had thought about trying for a KOM just before the Christmas Parade, but thought the better about it (too big of an audience). Better choosing early a Sunday AM.

Far more dangerous trying to hit 50 to 60 MPH down hill in a 40 MPH speed zone, even if visibility is generally good. Of course, much worse if visibility is bad, stop signs, etc.

Digger Goreman

..."Not displaying the desirable
keeps people from chaos....
This keeps men of knowledge refrained from daring...."
Lao Tzu

rubiksoval

Tragically, someone did die going for a downhill segment. Strava was sued. Downhill segments are nor available for goal times or live segment notifications