Is the Madone SLR stiff enough?
10-13-19, 10:30 AM
#26
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I read that other thread about the BB90. I agree with the person who said that the odds of something happening are relatively low (else we'd be hearing far more complaints about this). Were I in a location where i could just drive down and send my bike back for warranty repairs, I wouldnt care. But the added complexity of warranty service for me is leading back to my other option - the System6.
That was actually my first preference - it is just that i couldnt readily get the groupset + frame color combo i wanted, but would have to buy an Ultegra frame and then upgrade the parts, whereas the Madone was a simpler option - buy and ride.
That was actually my first preference - it is just that i couldnt readily get the groupset + frame color combo i wanted, but would have to buy an Ultegra frame and then upgrade the parts, whereas the Madone was a simpler option - buy and ride.
10-13-19, 02:41 PM
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System 6 will have the BB30 issues - aka it will creak if the bearings are not properly installed.
There are many, many, many more threads about this than the Trek BB90 one.
There are many, many, many more threads about this than the Trek BB90 one.
10-13-19, 07:46 PM
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I will say that very few other race-tier bikes have put as much effort into rear-end compliance, but that seems to be the only real distinguishing factor.
10-13-19, 07:49 PM
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the big difference between the two is BB30 has better solutions to the issue. The only real solution for the BB90 is a resurfaced bottom bracket or new frame.
10-13-19, 08:27 PM
#30
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I read that other thread about the BB90. I agree with the person who said that the odds of something happening are relatively low (else we'd be hearing far more complaints about this). Were I in a location where i could just drive down and send my bike back for warranty repairs, I wouldnt care. But the added complexity of warranty service for me is leading back to my other option - the System6.
That was actually my first preference - it is just that i couldnt readily get the groupset + frame color combo i wanted, but would have to buy an Ultegra frame and then upgrade the parts, whereas the Madone was a simpler option - buy and ride.
That was actually my first preference - it is just that i couldnt readily get the groupset + frame color combo i wanted, but would have to buy an Ultegra frame and then upgrade the parts, whereas the Madone was a simpler option - buy and ride.
I ultimately ended up getting the S3 instead of the Madone for my Aero bike not because of the BB standard...but because an LBS was having a 45% off of the 2018 S3 model (which I then talked down an additional 10%). So for what would have been the cost of the sale priced 2019 Madone SL6, with a mech ultegra and meh wheels (Aeolus Comps), I got the S3 with ENVE SES 5.6s, SRAM eTap HRD and an aero bar. Plus I liked the ride of the S3 a little bit more than the Madone (though again that might have been due to the better groupset and wheels).
Honestly I don't think you can go wrong with the Madone. I do think most BBs can have issues, and Trek being a big seller...their problems are going to be more widely reported than say Cervelo, or Pinarello, or Colnago who sell an order of magnitude less bikes than Trek.
That said, most agree that threaded BBs are less problematic so if the rumors are true that Trek may head over to T47 for all of their lines (they did for the newest Domane) then it may be worth your patience to wait a model year or two for that to happen.
I will say if you're looking for stiffness in a race geometry, which also has a pretty compliant design to absorb less than ideal gravel without being too "cushy" of a ride, try out a TCR. I have the Advanced SL1 (2019) and it is by far my favorite of the bikes I've owned. The S3 is second. Cannondale and Trek FX are the purchases I wish I could undo. The FX because I was afraid I was too old to ride drop down bars and found that not to be the case, so no fault of Treks. The SuperSix...well the TCR does everything it does, but way better. The TCR and S3 are complimentary bikes and I enjoy alternating rides between the two of them, because they do different things a little better than the other.
Last edited by CarloM; 10-13-19 at 08:31 PM.
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10-14-19, 06:55 AM
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10-16-19, 12:23 PM
#32
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10-24-19, 01:35 AM
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I will say if you're looking for stiffness in a race geometry, which also has a pretty compliant design to absorb less than ideal gravel without being too "cushy" of a ride, try out a TCR. I have the Advanced SL1 (2019) and it is by far my favorite of the bikes I've owned. The S3 is second. Cannondale and Trek FX are the purchases I wish I could undo. The FX because I was afraid I was too old to ride drop down bars and found that not to be the case, so no fault of Treks. The SuperSix...well the TCR does everything it does, but way better. The TCR and S3 are complimentary bikes and I enjoy alternating rides between the two of them, because they do different things a little better than the other.
So am down to Trek and Venge now.
- Trek has a color that excites me more, along with an eTap groupset, which is what i want
- Venge has Di2, is about $500 cheaper and removes the concern about the bottom bracket
Started a thread on this, actually...
10-24-19, 01:58 AM
#34
Destroyer of Worlds
I'm biased...so take what I say with a grain of salt...or maybe a grain cut in half. But here is my story.
BLUF: TREK took my money after a less-than-stellar experience with Specialized.
I had it whittled down to the Emonda SLR or the Tarmac Pro / S-WORKS. I didn't know what to do until I went to about 4 stores in the surrounding area for each company (Tokyo/Yokohama area). I kid you not, each and every Specialized store was full of reps completely uninterested in me or what I was doing. None of them even wanted to talk to me, and when I did ask questions, they would give me simple answers as if to "shoo" me away because there was no way I was actually going to drop the money on the bikes I was asking about. I mean, there was zero desire to assist me with a test ride, or information about the bikes. I guess they only cater to people decked out in full kit and their pedals wrapped around their fingers when they walk in. (I purposely didn't do this btw...but rather went in casual clothes) So then, probably hard to believe...each TREK store I went into, the reps were kind, humble, very forthcoming with information and willing to just chat with me about TREK bikes, even though I never stated I was looking to buy. I actually didn't buy from any of those stores. Instead I went home, thinking it's a fluke and I just need to write these companies and talk about my experiences and my desires. I wrote TREK and Specialized emails, both stating that I was looking at the other company, and that I was curious if they could tell me anything that might sway me the other way. I of course added specifics about the bikes I was interested in, and then asked a few pointed questions at the end. TREK came back less than 48 hours later with a detailed response to my questions, a comparison of the bikes I had included, a pretty personalized response on how I should get what's right for me, but definitely ride them both and then wanted me to write the guy back and let him know my thoughts afterward. Specialized literally wrote back about a week later and said..."I sincerely apologize for not being able to respond to your request. Thank you very much for your understanding.". That is literally what the email said. I can upload it somewhere if you'd like to see it. Like, what does that even mean?
I know this is probably stupid, but that sealed the deal for me. Specialized in every encounter I have had seems to think they are above everyone else. Maybe it's because pro teams like their stuff, maybe each rep feels like they are an extension of Peter Sagan. I don't know. But I don't give 5 digit money to a company that isn't willing to even attempt to communicate effectively, or teach their stores to provide proper customer service. So in I went to my LBS store that specializes in TREK (see what I did there?) and placed an order. Ironically, after spending some time on their bikes...I ended up going with a Project One Domane SLR...instead of the Emonda (bad back, not really a "racer"). I'm very happy with my purchase and that's that. So I guess my story is really saying...what is most important to you? I actually liked the Specialized Tarmac more at first...but after those experiences, every time I see a Specialized bike, I have negative thoughts about the company. And that turns me off. Would I have gotten over it? I don't know...but that's just something to keep in mind.
BLUF: TREK took my money after a less-than-stellar experience with Specialized.
I had it whittled down to the Emonda SLR or the Tarmac Pro / S-WORKS. I didn't know what to do until I went to about 4 stores in the surrounding area for each company (Tokyo/Yokohama area). I kid you not, each and every Specialized store was full of reps completely uninterested in me or what I was doing. None of them even wanted to talk to me, and when I did ask questions, they would give me simple answers as if to "shoo" me away because there was no way I was actually going to drop the money on the bikes I was asking about. I mean, there was zero desire to assist me with a test ride, or information about the bikes. I guess they only cater to people decked out in full kit and their pedals wrapped around their fingers when they walk in. (I purposely didn't do this btw...but rather went in casual clothes) So then, probably hard to believe...each TREK store I went into, the reps were kind, humble, very forthcoming with information and willing to just chat with me about TREK bikes, even though I never stated I was looking to buy. I actually didn't buy from any of those stores. Instead I went home, thinking it's a fluke and I just need to write these companies and talk about my experiences and my desires. I wrote TREK and Specialized emails, both stating that I was looking at the other company, and that I was curious if they could tell me anything that might sway me the other way. I of course added specifics about the bikes I was interested in, and then asked a few pointed questions at the end. TREK came back less than 48 hours later with a detailed response to my questions, a comparison of the bikes I had included, a pretty personalized response on how I should get what's right for me, but definitely ride them both and then wanted me to write the guy back and let him know my thoughts afterward. Specialized literally wrote back about a week later and said..."I sincerely apologize for not being able to respond to your request. Thank you very much for your understanding.". That is literally what the email said. I can upload it somewhere if you'd like to see it. Like, what does that even mean?
I know this is probably stupid, but that sealed the deal for me. Specialized in every encounter I have had seems to think they are above everyone else. Maybe it's because pro teams like their stuff, maybe each rep feels like they are an extension of Peter Sagan. I don't know. But I don't give 5 digit money to a company that isn't willing to even attempt to communicate effectively, or teach their stores to provide proper customer service. So in I went to my LBS store that specializes in TREK (see what I did there?) and placed an order. Ironically, after spending some time on their bikes...I ended up going with a Project One Domane SLR...instead of the Emonda (bad back, not really a "racer"). I'm very happy with my purchase and that's that. So I guess my story is really saying...what is most important to you? I actually liked the Specialized Tarmac more at first...but after those experiences, every time I see a Specialized bike, I have negative thoughts about the company. And that turns me off. Would I have gotten over it? I don't know...but that's just something to keep in mind.
10-24-19, 02:34 AM
#35
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I completely agree with that sentiment, @Noob_Cyclist. However, weirdly, for me, it has been the other way around.
I found the Trek dealer to be fairly inflexible, whereas the Spesh guy was very prompt and responsive, and also gave me a *very* good deal. In fact, were I to buy the Trek, it wouldnt be from the "local" (as in, one flight away) dealer, but from someone else, who can source and ship me a Madone at a much better price. This dealer has been fantastic in replying to my messages and i am quite confident he will help with warranty issues too, but this will involve mailing the bike internationally.
Like you, i have gotten to the point where, if all is equal/close, i go with the place that gives me better service. I am willing to pay a premium for this as well, actually.
I found the Trek dealer to be fairly inflexible, whereas the Spesh guy was very prompt and responsive, and also gave me a *very* good deal. In fact, were I to buy the Trek, it wouldnt be from the "local" (as in, one flight away) dealer, but from someone else, who can source and ship me a Madone at a much better price. This dealer has been fantastic in replying to my messages and i am quite confident he will help with warranty issues too, but this will involve mailing the bike internationally.
Like you, i have gotten to the point where, if all is equal/close, i go with the place that gives me better service. I am willing to pay a premium for this as well, actually.
10-24-19, 03:42 AM
#36
Destroyer of Worlds
I completely agree with that sentiment, @Noob_Cyclist. However, weirdly, for me, it has been the other way around.
I found the Trek dealer to be fairly inflexible, whereas the Spesh guy was very prompt and responsive, and also gave me a *very* good deal. In fact, were I to buy the Trek, it wouldnt be from the "local" (as in, one flight away) dealer, but from someone else, who can source and ship me a Madone at a much better price. This dealer has been fantastic in replying to my messages and i am quite confident he will help with warranty issues too, but this will involve mailing the bike internationally.
Like you, i have gotten to the point where, if all is equal/close, i go with the place that gives me better service. I am willing to pay a premium for this as well, actually.
I found the Trek dealer to be fairly inflexible, whereas the Spesh guy was very prompt and responsive, and also gave me a *very* good deal. In fact, were I to buy the Trek, it wouldnt be from the "local" (as in, one flight away) dealer, but from someone else, who can source and ship me a Madone at a much better price. This dealer has been fantastic in replying to my messages and i am quite confident he will help with warranty issues too, but this will involve mailing the bike internationally.
Like you, i have gotten to the point where, if all is equal/close, i go with the place that gives me better service. I am willing to pay a premium for this as well, actually.
My buddy here who got me into cycling only rides Specialized / S-WORKS and always tells me how much "rarer" they are on the road (one of the main reasons I was looking at them). So I always give him a hard time about how anytime I see someone riding Specialized, they're always decked in out in the most pro looking kit, with sponsors up and down and all over...even if they're just a normal cyclist going on a quick ride to the Family Mart up the hill. Gotta look proper for those IG selfies I guess.
It's all in good fun though...there are a lot of good bikes out there. Like you said, your "experience" when shopping can definitely play a pivotal role in your overall decision.
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10-24-19, 05:37 AM
#37
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@guadzilla I could not agree more about going with a dealer that cares about you and will provide good service. I will stress though that you make sure you get to know them first, as most dealers are good at making you think they care about you pre-purchase, and can sometimes change post-purchase.
There are tons of good bikes, and everyone's got their likes/dislikes. I understand not being excited by certain brands, but you do know Giant makes Trek frames right? (along with Colnago and other brands)
Bottom line: ride as many brands as you can pre-purchase. My TCR absolutely stood above all the other makes/models I was able to ride. It wasn't the value or bang-for-buck that sold me on the TCR. It was the way it rode. The fact that it also had the most features for the best price was icing on the cake.
The S3 is a wonderful aero bike, but if I could only keep one, it would be the TCR. It's that great of an all-rounder race bike. The two things the S3 does better than it are: slightly higher top speed on the flats, looks "cooler" from side-view due to aero frame geometry. Everything else the TCR does a bit better, climbing, comfort, handling. In fact, I've ridden quite a few more bikes since buying the TCR, and none have made me want to upgrade. The S3 was an impulse purchase to scratch the aero itch, and since it was on clearance being a 2018 model, I essentially paid for the ENVE 5.6s and eTap, and the rest of the bike was free.
Having both the older Red eTap 11 speed, and the current Ultegra Di2, both have their advantages and disadvantages: Di2 shifting is a tad bit crisper and responsive (I'm talking milliseconds, which casual riders likely wouldn't notice) and has superior batter life and programmability (new eTap I believe levels the playing field). That wireless on the eTap is awesome though, but it comes at the expense of battery life.
There are tons of good bikes, and everyone's got their likes/dislikes. I understand not being excited by certain brands, but you do know Giant makes Trek frames right? (along with Colnago and other brands)
Bottom line: ride as many brands as you can pre-purchase. My TCR absolutely stood above all the other makes/models I was able to ride. It wasn't the value or bang-for-buck that sold me on the TCR. It was the way it rode. The fact that it also had the most features for the best price was icing on the cake.
The S3 is a wonderful aero bike, but if I could only keep one, it would be the TCR. It's that great of an all-rounder race bike. The two things the S3 does better than it are: slightly higher top speed on the flats, looks "cooler" from side-view due to aero frame geometry. Everything else the TCR does a bit better, climbing, comfort, handling. In fact, I've ridden quite a few more bikes since buying the TCR, and none have made me want to upgrade. The S3 was an impulse purchase to scratch the aero itch, and since it was on clearance being a 2018 model, I essentially paid for the ENVE 5.6s and eTap, and the rest of the bike was free.
Having both the older Red eTap 11 speed, and the current Ultegra Di2, both have their advantages and disadvantages: Di2 shifting is a tad bit crisper and responsive (I'm talking milliseconds, which casual riders likely wouldn't notice) and has superior batter life and programmability (new eTap I believe levels the playing field). That wireless on the eTap is awesome though, but it comes at the expense of battery life.
10-24-19, 05:57 AM
#38
Destroyer of Worlds
@guadzilla I could not agree more about going with a dealer that cares about you and will provide good service. I will stress though that you make sure you get to know them first, as most dealers are good at making you think they care about you pre-purchase, and can sometimes change post-purchase.
There are tons of good bikes, and everyone's got their likes/dislikes. I understand not being excited by certain brands, but you do know Giant makes Trek frames right? (along with Colnago and other brands)
Bottom line: ride as many brands as you can pre-purchase. My TCR absolutely stood above all the other makes/models I was able to ride. It wasn't the value or bang-for-buck that sold me on the TCR. It was the way it rode. The fact that it also had the most features for the best price was icing on the cake.
The S3 is a wonderful aero bike, but if I could only keep one, it would be the TCR. It's that great of an all-rounder race bike. The two things the S3 does better than it are: slightly higher top speed on the flats, looks "cooler" from side-view due to aero frame geometry. Everything else the TCR does a bit better, climbing, comfort, handling. In fact, I've ridden quite a few more bikes since buying the TCR, and none have made me want to upgrade. The S3 was an impulse purchase to scratch the aero itch, and since it was on clearance being a 2018 model, I essentially paid for the ENVE 5.6s and eTap, and the rest of the bike was free.
Having both the older Red eTap 11 speed, and the current Ultegra Di2, both have their advantages and disadvantages: Di2 shifting is a tad bit crisper and responsive (I'm talking milliseconds, which casual riders likely wouldn't notice) and has superior batter life and programmability (new eTap I believe levels the playing field). That wireless on the eTap is awesome though, but it comes at the expense of battery life.
There are tons of good bikes, and everyone's got their likes/dislikes. I understand not being excited by certain brands, but you do know Giant makes Trek frames right? (along with Colnago and other brands)
Bottom line: ride as many brands as you can pre-purchase. My TCR absolutely stood above all the other makes/models I was able to ride. It wasn't the value or bang-for-buck that sold me on the TCR. It was the way it rode. The fact that it also had the most features for the best price was icing on the cake.
The S3 is a wonderful aero bike, but if I could only keep one, it would be the TCR. It's that great of an all-rounder race bike. The two things the S3 does better than it are: slightly higher top speed on the flats, looks "cooler" from side-view due to aero frame geometry. Everything else the TCR does a bit better, climbing, comfort, handling. In fact, I've ridden quite a few more bikes since buying the TCR, and none have made me want to upgrade. The S3 was an impulse purchase to scratch the aero itch, and since it was on clearance being a 2018 model, I essentially paid for the ENVE 5.6s and eTap, and the rest of the bike was free.
Having both the older Red eTap 11 speed, and the current Ultegra Di2, both have their advantages and disadvantages: Di2 shifting is a tad bit crisper and responsive (I'm talking milliseconds, which casual riders likely wouldn't notice) and has superior batter life and programmability (new eTap I believe levels the playing field). That wireless on the eTap is awesome though, but it comes at the expense of battery life.
