eagletree

That is an interesting topic to me. I measure against my leaderboard number and shoot for 50% up as my goal. Most of the time, I use the compare function on segments and "My Results" so I keep it focused on self-competition though. It's one of the highly motivating factors for me concerning riding. Having those competitive comparisons makes riding feel much like Cross Country did in high school, and though I was one of the slowest on our team, I was motivated by running, pushing, and finishing. That was a thankless sport school wise, but it had it's own addictive sense of self-motivation. I think that is why I so quickly became infatuated with biking. It feels the same. All by yourself riding out there, no one else cares nor needs to, and you compete against your own times.

Interestingly, it's often harder to hit halfway up the pack in the 65-69 age group than in the all age group leaderboard. I attribute that to only the resolute people continue riding into their 60s while in the general population there are many very casual riders recording on those segments, likely just there to enjoy a ride and not for training and fitness. But I do notice that some of the young riders are astoundingly fast. I usually can feel accomplished, even gratified, if my speed is half of the top cyclists on a segment (some are so fast, that would never be possible). On many segments I'm still working to get there. Part of the concept of asking this was that I had a couple of days where it felt fast and I was a minute behind myself. That could indicate overtraining. I suppose you could say that segment work can show you if you need a break.

canklecat

Yup, I watched Fury vs Wilder 2 twice. Hate to admit I wasn't surprised by the one-sided KO by Fury.

Even before the opening bell rang, Wilder looked worried, Fury got into his head. He looked even more worried when Wilder actually did what he said he'd do: take the fight to Wilder, back him up and take away his ability to set his feet to throw that right hand bomb.

The fight was basically over after round two when Wilder's left ear drum was ruptured by a Fury right to the side of the head. Wilder tried to roll with punches, usually a good tactic. But in this case it exposed him to worse damage because he and Fury are about the same height, and Fury has more reach. Wilder is no defensive master like Duran and Canelo, who can twist their heads to roll with punches while not making themselves more vulnerable.

Fury *is* a defensive wizard, with remarkable agility for a giant. That is extraordinarily rare. We won't see another heavyweight like Fury again in our lifetime. He reminds me of a much taller, bigger Larry Holmes, with octopus arms, a long range sniper's jab and superhuman recuperative abilities, who can switch easily between defensive boxing and aggressive brawling. But if anything, Fury has better ring generalship, although he can look a bit awkward at times. And his body and muscle tone defy the usual cliches about lean, cut, superhuman athletes. He looks more like a cliche of a carnival sideshow strongman who lifts oxen instead of weights.

When I saw the blood coming from Wilder's left ear and his poor balance, I knew his ear drum had been ruptured. Frankly, the fight should have been stopped after round five. The referee, ringside doctor and Wilder's own team exposed him to serious danger. He was unable to defend himself and lasted until round 7 only through sheer determination and a pretty darned good chin. But it was pointless. The doctor should have caught that injury sooner and stopped the fight.

And if that seems premature, take a look at the middleweight title fight between Gerald McClellan and Nigel Benn. Wilder was showing symptoms similar to McClellan's, a warning of a potentially serious head injury. (It turned out later McClellan had been showing warning signs in training well before the title bout, but everyone ignored it. Now he's in a wheelchair.) McClellan was another tall, rangy KO artist who disdained technique and thought his punching power would solve every problem.

Over the past few weeks I studied many bouts by Wilder and Fury and realized Wilder's seemingly impressive record of stoppages was heavily padded with incompetent doughboys and human punching bags. Not entirely his fault. Wilder has been active during the weakest heavyweight division in modern history. The few viable top contenders naturally would be advised by managers and promoters to duck Wilder until they got the maximum payday for being blasted into neverland, or to avoid him completely and wait for him to retire or be defeated.

But even in such a weak era, Fury still managed to develop an impressive ability to adapt and change techniques to suit the opponent. That's the mark of a true champion. Wilder never developed.

Meanwhile, Wilder made the classic mistake of a big puncher. He fell in love with his own power. He couldn't believe there was anyone he couldn't put to sleep. So he never bothered to develop well rounded skills or a backup plan. The closest he ever came to a strategy was to bore an opponent until the other guy quit paying attention, then land the big right hand and/or wild, sweeping left hook-ish haymaker thing that resembled a playground slap-swipe more than punching. Pretty much how he beat Ortiz in the rematch.

Even a young Big George Foreman had far more sophisticated ability than Wilder. Foreman's ring savvy was very underrated in his first career. He didn't just blast Frazier and other opponents. He set them up, negated their strengths, and corralled them into his punching range.

Wilder never developed any such skills. And whenever he got an opponent into trouble he'd flail around wildly, arms outstretched, zero attention to defense, off balance. Eventually it would catch up with him.

Pardon the digression. I spent way too much time analyzing both fighters' past bouts and reviewing their rematch twice last night.

canklecat

The lifelong fitness experience is crucial. I know some of the folks my age have rarely ever been out of shape.

Mitochondrial adaptations to exercise takes time. There's no substitute for that, no way to speed it up. When we're younger we adapt more quickly. With age we lose some of that ability -- lower testosterone, HGH, etc.

When I resumed cycling in 2015 at age 57, I never imaged it would take years to get back into above average shape for my age. I was still thinking of my peak fitness years in my teens and 20s when I could take a few weeks or even months off and quickly regain my form.

But by 2015 I'd been virtually inactive for 14 years, since a car wreck broke my neck and back. I walked with a cane until 2014. I figured a year back in the saddle after 2015 would be enough to overcome more than a decade of being pretty much sedentary. Nope.

Besides lower testosterone and HGH, we accumulate a lot of little or sometimes major injuries, lose flexibility, bone density, etc. People who stay active retain more of that longer.

With back and neck injuries I also lost the ability to stay wheel to wheel in a fast group, saving energy by drafting. I can't stay in an aero tuck as long due to neck stiffness and pain. When I'm in the drops or as low as possible I sometimes get double-vision on rough terrain -- very dangerous in a fast, tight group. As soon as I sit up I'm in the wind, fall off the back and the group gets tiny in the distance.

I still do moderate pace group rides but I won't endanger other riders or myself trying to hang onto a group that's beyond my ability.

My best solo times came from good days when my neck and back were good enough to let me stay tucked longer. I still can't manage aero bars longer than a minute or so at a time, but even that little bit helps on my longer rides.

To compensate I'll wear more aero kit -- more snug fitting jerseys, helmet, shoe covers, etc. -- when I'm chasing PRs. Makes a difference. And it's more cost effective than a newer aero bike. My bikes are all old school, a 1989 steel Centurion Ironman with downtube shifters, and a 1993 carbon fiber Trek 5900, which was Trek's flagship for that era but pretty ordinary by today's standards. Neither is very aero, but my body is a bigger factor than the bike for wind resistance, so I focus on my engine, getting aero and clothes that don't act like sails in the wind.

It also saves energy. I'm less exhausted after fast rides because I haven't expended leg energy trying to overcome an upright position. That's where workouts that include static body toning exercises like planking helps. Personally I hate planking. It's the world's saddest, most boring exercise. I can't imagine the dedication it takes to plank for 8 hours, the world record just set by another 62 year old. I'd be suicidal after planking for 8 hours, wondering where my life had gone so wrong that I'd rather plank for 8 hours than ride my bike for 8 hours on a sunny day.

But it's a good exercise for the upper body to get stronger and more comfortable on the bike. So I do the routines my physical therapy showed me last year. It helps. But I plank for only a minute at a time, switch to another muscle group, then back again. It's less tedious, especially while watching TV.

eagletree

I started exercising again at 53 or so, with weight lifting, then walking and jogging. Jogging combined with a lot of random exercise like land clearing, left me with Sciatica and the walking, while I know it's adequate to reach the longevity maximums of aerobic exercise, was clearly inadequate to do much for actual aerobic fitness. But that is what I did up until 64. Then a friend introduced me to riding when I took her to a bike shop for a repair, and there was a low end (300 frame) Trek Emonda half-price. I bought that and slowly started ramping up.

I just now am experimenting with kit, as I rode with jeans and sweats last year (and often an old baggy jacket ;-)). I love it, it does make a big difference. I attempted drafting last year, but was far too shaky on the bike to be safe with it. Now I'm fairly stable but no one to ride with and try it. Would be interesting to experience. I got off the hoods at the start of January and love the drops now, at first that felt like poor control, but now it feels like better control. Part of that was I finally had a pro set the bike up. The original shop did little to get it right but that made all the difference in the world. He also got me going on tricep lifting which I had abandoned long ago since most body builders recommend full body lifting only. That helped a lot with the bent over position becoming comfortable and stable for me.

I don't know with cycling and honestly didn't study aerobics except superficially because I was into anaerobic exercise for so long, but the adaptations in lifting take a full four months to begin with secondary improvements like joints, ligaments, bone density deposits and such only occurring after mass building begins (which requires strength building to kick it off). Perhaps it will be like that with biking and mitochondria. I've only been seriously at it for two months. The first 6 or 8 months was weekend rides and short mountain bike rides that probably had no real value excepting stability on a bike. I am fortunate in one way, I have only one way to go, up, but all the studies I've read say that those of you who have done this sort of thing for a life time, if you keep it going through the pains of aging, will have less of a tendency to lose what you have gained. I have a very few years (statistically 5) to actually make gains to maintain. That is one reason I'm pushing so hard.

The testosterone issues have plagued me since I started lifting and I'm sure they will with this endeavor. I did consult to find diet changes to support this effort (most specifically to eliminate visceral fat which is of course the most dangerous kind). I'm just now starting on a program to eliminate foods that foster an estrogenic effect. The fitness carrot of the biking is even making that painless. The other half of that equation involves lower cortisol which is a bit tougher with age. That would be where the initial response suggested yoga (but actually meditation) makes a lot of sense. I have trouble with that though as do most men, we love our cortisol and type A behavior.

big john

No, thanks for your analysis. I knew you would be someone I could ask and I appreciate your knowledge of the sport. I don't have anyone in my bike club to discuss it with.
I knew Fury had good defense but I thought Wilder would get to him. Maybe Fury will be around for a while. Thanks again and sorry for hijacking the thread.

eagletree

Threads that don't digress are quite boring. Now I have to go look up Fury and Wilder.

Clipped_in

OP, there are two types of "overwork" as you call it. There is overreaching, and then there is overtraining. I think overreaching is more of what you are concerned about. Overtraining is a serious matter that can have long-lasting negative effects. You seem to have a fundamental grasp of some aspects of endurance training, but lacking in others. I think it is great that you are highly motivated, disciplined to be consistent, and that you are interested in having structure in what you are doing. That will take you a long way!

However, one aspect of endurance training that you need to better understand is called periodization. Also, I think you have some great goals to train regularly, etc., but they really need more focused on some kind of event, or better yet a series of events. This is important to understand because one cannot obtain and sustain a really high level of endurance fitness over time. This has been shown to be physiologically (and psychologically) impossible. And, that is where the needs of the individual athlete come into play and why if you see , you should proceed with caution. There is some great information to be gleaned on the web, but a whole lot of misinformation too. Mostly because things are often put out there with no real contextual basis, the writers are misinformed, or they are simply trying to sell you something.

With the path you are currently on, you will likely continue to see improvement for a time, maybe even a couple of years, but ultimately you will likely plateau and then decline both physically and mentally when the newness of it wears off.

Here are a few reliable resources that you may find helpful as you try to expand your understanding of structured endurance training principles:

what-is-training-periodization
understanding-the-3-cycles-of-periodization
10-guidelines-for-effective-goal-setting
6-goal-setting-mistakes-to-avoid

Good luck!

Koyote

OP: You've gotten much good advice in this thread, so I won't offer anything that is too redundant. I will only add that, while it is important to incorporate rest days into your workout schedule, you should also pay attention to your body: if you feel tired, don't feel like riding, then take a rest day.

One other thing that works, in order to reduce the (misplaced) feeling of shirking on a rest day, is to just do a very low-intensity form of fun exercise. My wife and I will often go for a long (5k) walk on a MUP.

eagletree

That is a good idea, my dog has been a bit neglected in his walking this year. He's the sort that can use several miles at fairly high speed (Great Dane). Indeed, walking him is not overly restful since he can't walk slowly. But that and other things, the biking tends to overshadow.

I see people use MUP constantly on here. Is that Multi-Use Path or something like that?

Koyote

Yes, MUP = Multi-Use Path.

Yep, dog-walking is a big part of my routine, every day in all but the worst weather.

eagletree

You bring goal back to the conversation and that is somewhat nebulous for me. I can't imagine there would be some sort of real competition that I could involve myself in. Instead, there are events such as the Seattle To Portland that I was thinking of riding in, and that means a significant change in mileages (100 miles a day, or 200 miles in one day). So training toward something like that is very different than doing individual short self-competitive segment competitions I'd do with Strava. In general though, I don't have a goal to reach, it's more the journey and the trappings of riding and pushing. I suppose that makes it tough to have a training program for. I realize that just picking a number of miles a week, or times on a segment, aren't actually goals, they are open ended. I will study the links you provided and ponder whether there is some goal I can latch onto to actually train for.

Carbonfiberboy 

This is pretty simple. As everyone has said, don't compare your schedule or results to anyone else's. Of course. Also, don't assume you can use any canned training plan. The issue is totally one of having the ability to self-evaluate. There are two methods:

1) Morning resting and morning standing heart rates, MRHR and MSHR, There's also the difference between these 2 numbers called orthostatic HR.

How: In the morning after your pee, lie down with your HRM and lie still until your HR stops dropping. Then watch it for 2-3 minutes and note the last number, your MRHR. Then stand up, noting the time. Stand still and watch your HR and the time. Note your approximate average HR between 2:30 and 3 minutes. That's your MSHR. Orthostatic is then MSHR-MRHR. Put these numbers into your training log. If you don't have one, start one. A spreadsheet works well. Being overtired will usually result in an increase in MRHR of 5-8 beats, or a similar increase in your orthostatic. An orthostatic of over 20 is usually not a good thing.

2) HR during hard efforts. If your HR doesn't come up when you are well warmed up and you pedal hard for several minutes, then you're tired and should probably do an easy workout.

With self-monitoring, no need to worry about overworking at all. Just do your workouts and see what happens. After a few months of this, you'll get a very good feel for what you can do and what is too much - or too little. I can't emphasize enough that if you don't see signs of overwork once in a while, you could be working harder. Of course if that's not your goal, then just keep it down below those warning signs. You can see them coming. It's not like you wake up one morning and you're overworked. It takes a few days to build it up.

Carbonfiberboy 

If you want to ride STP, that's a good goal whether you wind up riding it or not. Work up to 150 miles a week for 2-3 months before the event. That'll get you strong, whatever you want to do. And ride almost year 'round. It is said that in the PNW there are only 2 types of riders: the wet and the weak. It takes quite a while to build up the endurance to ride a high weekly mileage. There's also randonneuring, which is a lot of fun - for a certain type of rider.

caloso

When the weather is good and work/family/etc cooperates, I will ride 7 days a week. But at least 1 or 2 days needs to be a full recovery ride. Easy ride. Super easy. As in little old ladies on shopping bikes and toddlers on training wheels could drop me. It is actually a bigger test of discipline than a hard ride. Either I'm setting an alarm on my power meter or I go for a super easy spin with my wife to the ice cream shop.

eagletree

That is effectively the mileage goal I've been working toward, and I think during this thread, I came up with a route that could do that. It is difficult to get 20 miles a day, because of the poor roads over here (meaning dangerous really, I won't ride on a narrow or non-shouldered road). But 150 per week would be only slightly over 20 miles a day and running from PT to the 104 Hwy, and up towards Sequim, then back would more than cover that, all with a 4 to 6 foot shoulder.

In the STP, since you've ridden it, is it as hilly as it is over here? I know the I-5 route is very minor though long grades (If only freeway riding were legal). I presume this runs east of I-5 on the old highway north-south? How many MPH to you shoot for when you do it one day? I think my goal may be developing.

On the resting heart rate measurement, that gives me a more comprehensive way to measure. I've been using the Fitbit Resting figures which deviate by a few BPM almost cyclically. I'll try your method with my HRM and the Roam. Sounds interesting.

Edit: Wet or Weak? Yes, I've spent more time in the rain this year than ever before. Unfortunately, I'd go with "wet and weak" as of yet.

eagletree

I have no distractions to stop me from doing 7 days a week, and in fact, that is exactly what I want to do. The recovery ride concept sounds good, still go the miles but don't push and ignore all segment indicators on the computer.

caloso

Personally, I would not have any mileage goal or target on a recovery day. It's just to spin the legs and enjoy the air.

Vintage Schwinn

I'm not a doctor and I didn't play one on TV so I have no real qualifications to give an answer.
I am old and I am in great shape, and many of my tennis, running, and golf pals are physicians and orthopaedic surgeons. One of my fishing buddies is a cardiologist.
They all seem to the enjoy life, keep active, eat right, get enough sleep, get enough exercise and stay in good physical shape, maintaining the proper waistline without getting heavier there beyond age 35 or 40.
Chuck Norris will be 80 years old in two weeks, Ringo is 80 now in 2020 and Mick Jagger will be 77 years old in five months. With a little luck and a committment to trying to stay healthy and active, you too could possibly remain in good enough shape to do most everything you'd like to do for many years to come.
I'm not saying everybody will be as lucky those guys to be healthy fit and as active as they are at their current ages.
One thing is mostly clear, and that is that if you don't make an effort to stay relatively fit, it probably will be a bit more of a challenge, but there are rare anomalies and examples of folks who live to nearly the century mark with vigor and full mental capabilities and mobility and few health concerns despite vices like being overweight, continuing to smoke. Some folks seem to have the "right" long term survival genes, while others do not have them. Some have the family genetic history of higher probability of shorter lifespan and probability of health factors/diseases that become serious concerns decades sooner than for those lucky folks with the "right" genes.
Just as not everyone is exactly alike, my uneducated guess is that you have to "listen to your own body".
Just as there is no way in the world that an out of shape 33 year old male could come close to the physical go-go-go output of 80 year old Chuck Norris, one cannot expect that they are going to be able to match certain benchmarks/records as one cannot get there overnight...............it cannot be done in a full day or a week either...
----it will take a serious effort and cohesive plan that you adhere to that allows the excercise program get you to that higher level.
Now, practically speaking, that out of shape 33 year old male, probably has a better chance to get into Norris-Jagger shape within a year or year and a half than the average healthy-physically fit 63 year old could. An outta-shape 63 year old realistically has a near zero probability of ever being able to move like Jagger, even if they were to employ the best personal trainor to train and assist them. It takes more than a motivated personal trainor, the outta-shape subject has to have his/her motivation, determination, drive, and vision to reach the goal. Old folks require much longer than someone thirty years younger, to both recover and get back into shape.
NFL players have sometimes commented that they knew it was time to retire from football when they felt like they had not recovered from the aches/pains of the prior week's game, further commenting with something like it was once Tue or Wed after Sunday's game that they felt fully recovered, and then it became Friday, and now it's game day and I just can't do it anymore.
I know it is preaching to the choir because by definition if anyone is cycling in the USA, to the degree that most bike forums members do, they are likely very active and among the healthiest Americans for their particular age. Folks in other countries are on average in better shape than most Americans. People from other countries who have never visited the US, or have not visited the US since 1980 or prior, will be shocked to see just how fat and morbidly obese many Americans are today.
I'd say don't worry too much, because you are in good shape, but realistically realize that age sixty or whatever, you can't the "beating" that you could at age 17 or age 25 and recover within 12 hours to do it all again. Ask any of your pals or neighbors who might be doctors, physicians assistants, nurses, or physical therapists about this subject when you see them in your neighborhood jogging, walking, or on the tennis court, or at the dog park......etc.
They will probably tell you to keep going. Move it or lose it, stay active, and get off your rump because a couch potato in front of the tv or computer with the required snacks are a bad move indeed if you do that too much. I guarantee that they will tell you that it is better to get your rump on a bike and get outside in the sunshine and just get moving, even if it is just a brisk fast paced walk of a mile or two around the neighborhood. Folks have got to get moving. They have to start somewhere. You can't expect that obese neighbor of yours to be able to ride 1/30 th of the distance that you can, as he might not be able to walk up three flights of stairs without nearly croaking, but if you can somehow encourage, inspire, or motivate such a person to get moving, even it is just walking a half block or just up the street and back, it is a start.
You are a role model, whether you think so or not, because you're healthy, active, and in great shape. You're not gonna be quarterbacking Green Bay, and you're probably not going to be doing Total-Gym commercials with a beautiful super-model or headlining a sold out show at Madison Square Garden, and unless they institute some type of super-Seniors division or version of the Tour de France.......thats not gonna happen..............................but count yourself lucky and continue on your quest to be the best that you can be and continue to strive to enjoy life to the fullest............................Adventure before Dementia, the older that you get, the more important it is that you not act your age!
Remember that you need to make "pit stops" for fuel and "rest stops" for sleep as everything on the road can only go so far without doing so.
With some classic words from Minnesota Bob: .....May You Stay Forever Young..........

Carbonfiberboy 

Good questions. No, not hilly, though there are a couple hilly sections. A little over 4000' total. My wife and I rode it on our tandem in 2015 with ~12 hours saddle time or about 15 overall. My wife is not a strong rider and we had ~140 miles of headwinds. My fastest time on my single when I was 58 (I think) was a hair under 12 hours elapsed, so an average of ~19.8 or something like that. You should be able to get the route off the cascade.org website or ridewithgps.com.

I ride on non-shouldered roads all the time, but they are low traffic. There are hardly any roads in this state with decent shoulders which are not so heavily traveled as to make the traffic a bit unbearable. I'll take low traffic and no shoulders.

You'll want to do a long ride every weekend, 40-50 now, gradually ramping up. You don't really have to do anything over 80 miles to get fast. My favorite is ~60, 4000', ridden as hard as possible. About a 4 hour hard ride is good, nothing over 6 because over 6 your intensity really drops off. I never could do a hilly century in under 6 hours, but I never was a strong rider, just conditioned.

davethelefty

I guess I really need to be paying attention to the science of training. I'm nearing the end of a ramp up in mileage for a half-century in 3 weeks. Right now I hate riding. I hate the Sat/Sun long ride, I hate short rides, I have no strategy for recovery, for HIIT, for anything other than just getting on the bike and seeing what I can do, with nothing but a distance goal in mind. Consequently I am exhausted, dispirited, and ultimately concerned that I won't be able to ride my 50-miler. Well, at this late date there's nothing much I can do, but after this ride, if I plan to continue my commitment to riding, I need to go all in.

Silly me, I thought I could take a casual approach to riding, ride when I want to, but that's in conflict with any kind of goal orientation, so it's gut check time -- what do I want? To me there are two options: having fun or accomplishing things. I'm sure the two can merge, but at this point I don't have a clue how to make that happen.

eagletree

That is a great and encouraging post. I agree with all you said. Yes, I think you are correct about what the professionals say about aging and exercise. If the doctor gives the green light, it's full speed ahead. I am fortunate in that my doctor is a cyclist, in his late 70s no less and tremendous role model such as you describe. That was in fact one factor in my starting to ride.

big john

What is your longest ride ever? How long is the Sat/Sun long ride? If you've done 50 before then you know you can do it. If not, and stressing about it is ruining riding for you, maybe don't do it?

eagletree

I just joined Cascade last week and bought the Season Pass, I'll look again for a map of the STP. The 4000' total sounds extremely flat since I get that each week around here in 80 or 90 miles, if that's over 200 miles seems that would not be a problem. But if to do it in one day requires 20 mph average, I doubt I could maintain that, certainly not with a headwind. I suppose I should plan two day only. I did trace out the distance to Sequim from PT and that would be such a ride as you recommend. Just a bit of roundabout selection would put it at 60 miles over and back. My usual excuse about Jefferson county roads and inadequate distance isn't valid now.

I've been selecting the wide shoulders and higher speed traffic. Only rarely does someone give any space when they come by. I hug the very right of the shoulder which is problematic because of the junk along there, but I've actually become more paranoid since joining this forum and reading about disasters and problems people have with cars. Last summer I did ride some low traffic shoulder-less roads and probably will again when the conditions start improving, but I started riding with complete naivete, just assuming all car drivers deal with bikes like I do when driving. It will probably take me awhile to work back up the guts to deal with those 3 inches to the right of the white line.

Carbonfiberboy 

Not that fast! It took me years to work up to that. The course opens at 5:00 with early releases (like fish from a pen) of 1-day riders. Portland closes at 9:00 IIRC. That's 16 hours, though the later riders look worse than the earlier ones as they come in. If you really want to do it, register soon. It does sell out. Most important thing: hydrate, hydrate, hydrate. I usually went through ~8 liters of water, used a Camelbak, and stopped about every 50 miles. I mostly carried my own food, at first mostly Clif bars and Hammer Gel, later my own maltodextrin/whey protein powder. I took one long stop at Lexington, otherwise in and out as quick as I could. If I came into one of those rest stops and couldn't pee, I'd sit and drink water until I did.

I always ride 6"-1' to the left of the fog line unless there's a real shoulder.

davethelefty

Though I've ridden centuries in the distant past, in this training effort I've done 3 rides in the 40-43 range, and multiple weeks with 70+ miles total. I'm attempting to get up to about a 45-46 mile ride before the 3/21 event. The half-century I'm doing is actually about 48 miles, so I think I'm pretty close.