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Been working on this and got a surprise

Old 07-05-19, 11:14 PM
  #1  
1simplexnut
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Been working on this and got a surprise



84 PX10

Was debating which derailleurs to fit when I noticed something about the NR derailleurs I have.
One is an 82 other is an 83 so either would be appropriate,
One has quite a difference from the other .

You educated lot will spot the difference I am sure :-)
But then I noticed a bit of a mangle on the back of one .!



ouch


Should look like this !



Now do I try and file/ reshape the mangled stop ?
Do I leave it alone ?
What opinions about this out there ?

Thanks
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Old 07-06-19, 12:07 AM
  #2  
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post


84 PX10

Was debating which derailleurs to fit when I noticed something about the NR derailleurs I have.
One is an 82 other is an 83 so either would be appropriate,
One has quite a difference from the other .

You educated lot will spot the difference I am sure :-)
But then I noticed a bit of a mangle on the back of one .!



ouch


Should look like this !



Now do I try and file/ reshape the mangled stop ?
Do I leave it alone ?
What opinions about this out there ?

Thanks
If the mangle is on the wrong one, a cage swap should solve that for now. I would only file the stop to remove the lip not the stop surface, leave the rest as is and save it as a backup spare.
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Old 07-06-19, 12:15 AM
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Big question: When fully installed, does the limit stop still engage well with the dropout, or is the surface area noticeably less? The damage looks angular - as if the top pivot was gradually backing out.

-Kurt
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Old 07-06-19, 01:38 AM
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Originally Posted by cudak888 View Post
Big question: When fully installed, does the limit stop still engage well with the dropout, or is the surface area noticeably less? The damage looks angular - as if the top pivot was gradually backing out.

-Kurt
Yes indeed . Will check by fitting I guess ? . Or may just use as spare parts .

Anyone spot the difference between the two? ( apart from the damage )
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Old 07-06-19, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post
Yes indeed . Will check by fitting I guess ? . Or may just use as spare parts .

Anyone spot the difference between the two? ( apart from the damage )
That is why I said about switching the cages depending on whether you want to use the short or longer one with the unmolested body.
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Old 07-06-19, 06:45 AM
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post
Yes indeed . Will check by fitting I guess ? . Or may just use as spare parts .

Anyone spot the difference between the two? ( apart from the damage )
Might be a good idea to put the Super Record cage on the one with the damage, and file the stop so it sits at the angle of a SR RD.

The other difference is the typeface on the pivot bolts.

-Kurt
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Old 07-06-19, 06:55 AM
  #7  
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It may depend in part on how large a freewheel you plan to use and therefore how forward and up the rear derailleur cage can sit and still work properly for you. It may not matter much at all.
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Old 07-06-19, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post


84 PX10

Was debating which derailleurs to fit when I noticed something about the NR derailleurs I have.
One is an 82 other is an 83 so either would be appropriate,
One has quite a difference from the other .

You educated lot will spot the difference I am sure :-)
But then I noticed a bit of a mangle on the back of one .!



ouch


Should look like this !



Now do I try and file/ reshape the mangled stop ?
Do I leave it alone ?
What opinions about this out there ?

Thanks
To be restored material has to be added, not taken away. Did the change correlate to the change of cage? Was it necessary to fit the French frame?

If it was necessary to fit the frame, put it on the frame, tune it up and go forward.
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Old 07-06-19, 08:32 AM
  #9  
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I think the pivot bolt of the right derailleur is made from titanium.
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Old 07-06-19, 10:39 AM
  #10  
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Originally Posted by Brands View Post
I think the pivot bolt of the right derailleur is made from titanium.
me too
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Old 07-06-19, 03:36 PM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by merziac View Post
That is why I said about switching the cages depending on whether you want to use the short or longer one with the unmolested body.
both same length cage . picture is a wee bit deceptive sorry
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Old 07-06-19, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Brands View Post
I think the pivot bolt of the right derailleur is made from titanium.
Give that man a chocolate fish !!! wahooo .
At least I think that is what is is ?
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Old 07-06-19, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post
both same length cage . picture is a wee bit deceptive sorry
No worries, my bad, seems like the longer looking one would be the one to use, what do I know.
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Old 07-06-19, 03:55 PM
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I would default with the 83 RD as the subject bike is a 1984 Peugeot PX10...... but that's just picky me.....

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Old 07-06-19, 04:45 PM
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The arms down to the cable clamp bolt are odd on the right one. I hadn't noticed one like that before. I'll have to look at mine tonight.
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Old 07-06-19, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Chombi1 View Post
maybe lighter. Would default with the 83 RD as the subject bike is a 1984 Peugeot PX10...... but that's just picky me.....
Hi Chombi1 :-) thought you might say that . Will probably go that way if the stop engages ok .
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Old 07-06-19, 06:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jeirvine View Post
The arms down to the cable clamp bolt are odd on the right one. I hadn't noticed one like that before. I'll have to look at mine tonight.
hmmm I see what you mean . Also noticed that pulley cage is different shape .

Have a couple of others in the stash . will compare and see how different .
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Old 07-06-19, 06:22 PM
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Nice bike and components!!!!!!
I don't know if it's the pics but beware that the top limit screw on the right RD is a little bent.
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Old 07-10-19, 01:20 AM
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Originally Posted by MarcoBianchi View Post
Nice bike and components!!!!!!
I don't know if it's the pics but beware that the top limit screw on the right RD is a little bent.
yep it sure is ! Replaced now cheers . Build is ongoing :-)
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Old 07-10-19, 03:38 AM
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Different Pulley Cages???

The pulley cage on the dérailleur on the right looks like the longer cage that came on 2nd generation Super Record 4001 dérailleurs. They had titanium pivot bolts with an advertised capacity of a 28T FW vs. 26T for the NRs.


I've heard tales of Campy employees assembling bootleg derailleurs out of parts that they "acquired" from the factory. If true, that would explain some of the weird mismatched Campy RDs that show up from time to time.

@Road Fan "Was it necessary to fit the French frame?"

The unrealistic fear many cyclists have about any French bikes or components drives me (more) nuts as in simplexnut!!! Please do some research before breaking out the tar brush!

In the late 70's Simplex introduced their new style dropouts that worked with most derailleurs on the market including the de facto standard Campagnolo design.

These were used on a lot of better quality French bikes up into the early 90's. I have them on 7 of my top end French bikes: Gitane, Motobecane & Peugeot.




Before these came out, 10-15 minutes of work could modify the old proprietary Simplex dropouts that so many cyclists fear and/or loathe. This allowed most brands of dérailleurs to fit on them.




@1simplexnut your bike is made of Reynolds 531 Professionnel which had the same wall thickness as Reynolds 753R. It should be a supper smooth riding bike. The handling will be great too




verktyg

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Old 07-10-19, 03:52 AM
  #21  
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not far from the truth !

Originally Posted by merziac View Post
No worries, my bad, seems like the longer looking one would be the one to use, what do I know.
hi again , after rechecking ,have found that length of cages are the same , but they are different angles (if that makes sense)
Seems like the derailleur is a bit of a hotchpotch of parts ? Super record pulley cage? and titanium bolt .
So your is all good :-)
Will chuck it on and see how it goes.
Incidentally bike came with super record levers and NR ? calipers
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Old 07-10-19, 03:59 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by verktyg View Post
The pulley cage on the dérailleur on the right looks like the longer cage that came on 2nd generation Super Record 4001 dérailleurs. They had titanium pivot bolts with an advertised capacity of a 28T FW vs. 26T for the NRs.


I've heard tales of Campy employees assembling bootleg derailleurs out of parts that they "acquired" from the factory. If true, that would explain some of the weird mismatched Campy RDs that show up from time to time.

@Road Fan "Was it necessary to fit the French frame?"

The unrealistic fear many cyclists have about any French bikes or components drives me (more) nuts as in simplexnut!!! Please do some research before breaking out the tar brush!

In the late 70's Simplex introduced their new style dropouts that worked with most derailleurs on the market including the de facto standard Campagnolo design.

These were used on a lot of better quality French bikes up into the early 90's. I have them on 7 of my top end French bikes: Gitane, Motobecane & Peugeot.




Before these came out, 10-15 minutes of work could modify the old proprietary Simplex dropouts that so many cyclists fear and/or loathe. This allowed most brands of dérailleurs to fit on them.




@1simplexnut your bike is made of Reynolds 531 Professionnel which had the same wall thickness as Reynolds 753R. It should be a supper smooth riding bike. The handling will be great too




verktyg
hiya ,

Yes i think you have nailed down the cage difference .
I guess it will work ok with this set up ?
I have another frame the same that I really like riding but it is very very clean and tidy

Saw this rather well used frame come up and thought could use it without worrying about bending it etc .

Luxury !

Interesting to see the tensile difference of 531p to 753 .

thanks for the input folks
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Old 07-10-19, 04:03 AM
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the other one
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Old 07-10-19, 09:53 AM
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Nice. I wish more of the seatpost showed, but fit trumps style every time.

What's holding it upright, is part of it that little gray thing at the front of the rear wheel? Don't tell me it's photoshop.

PS are you by the coast? I thought New Zealand was full of hills.

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Old 07-10-19, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by 1simplexnut View Post
hi again , after rechecking ,have found that length of cages are the same , but they are different angles (if that makes sense)
The only difference between NR and SR cages is the guide pulley sits about 1cm lower on the SR. This allows it to handle the 28t cog. (It also makes it a little harder to shift down to the 13t though). The distance between pulleys is identical, so same overall chain capacity. I have swapped SR cages onto NR derailleurs just like yours.
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