Saddle lower than hoods
07-11-13, 08:02 AM
#26
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That looks fine.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
07-11-13, 08:08 AM
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Whoever did that fitting for you needs to be shot straight in the face. your hoods should not be rolld up that high on the bars. saddle should be flat and if you are 6ft tall and that is a 56, you have got to have one of the longest torso's EVER. that looks set up for someone with a 28" inseem.
@MoreBlackSwan - I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the saddle position is correct or at least close to correct. I'm at 6' tall with shortish legs/longish torso and I didn't really look at bikes with level top tubes, like the CAAD - they just didn't give me enough nut clearance (and would have resulted in a stubby post like yours). That said, it's where I would start to sort out your fit - with the saddle height. If your leg is not quite straight at the bottom of the pedal stroke (without pointing your foot down excessively or rocking your hips on the saddle), try raising the seat .5cm at a time, or so. After the saddle height is correct, as comfort allows, gradually lower the position of the bars by flipping the stem and removing spacers.
Last edited by WhyFi; 07-11-13 at 08:54 AM.
07-11-13, 08:45 AM
#28
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That looks fine.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
07-11-13, 08:50 AM
#29
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07-11-13, 08:55 AM
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Like most are saying there is no normal. It's what's comfortable to the individual rider. I've got bikes with large seat/bar drop and I've got one with the bars just slightly higher than the saddle. Both fit me but just in different ways. Lately I've been ridding the latter (Salsa Fargo) and have gotten used to the more upright position. When I went to ride my CAAD9 it felt completely foreign to me. I felt like I was going to fall over the bars. I can see how when a person who is used to even saddle/bars first rides a "racing" road bike they feel it doesn't fit. Both bikes "fit" but feel completely different.
07-11-13, 09:03 AM
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most new bike "fits" just get the saddle position in the ballpark and send you on your merry way with the stem as high as it came. They will usually tell you to ride the bike for a few weeks to get used to the bike, or get used to riding a road bike if it's a first. Then they will schedule you in for a more involved "fit" if it was included in the purchase. Most beginners don't need to worry about getting into an "aero" position anyway.
07-11-13, 09:11 AM
#32
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If the saddle would be level, you wouldnt need the bars rolled up, like that... ( to use, to push yourself back up on to the saddle/your sit bones... since you are prolly sliding off/down, sitting on your giblets. )
That said, dont flip the stem or slam it, that is a fit issue ...
If you like the height on both leave it, but if you need the extra hight from the handlebar beeing rolled up, get a higher angle stem. ( and still keept he bars "level". )
If all else fails, het a "tall headtube bike" ...
Here is a publicity pic of my bike :
Here is how mine, looks:
That said, dont flip the stem or slam it, that is a fit issue ...
If you like the height on both leave it, but if you need the extra hight from the handlebar beeing rolled up, get a higher angle stem. ( and still keept he bars "level". )
If all else fails, het a "tall headtube bike" ...
Here is a publicity pic of my bike :
Here is how mine, looks:
07-11-13, 09:15 AM
#33
Descends like a rock
Without seeing you on the bike, no one can say if its right for you. (even seeing you on it doesn't answer everything)
The only concerns I see are the saddle tipped down like that could cause you to put too much pressure on your hands. I would rotate the bars down so the hoods and tops of the bars are level, but that's more cosmetic. If the saddle to bar feels good, go with it. If you're curious and you want to experiment with lower bars, try flipping the stem and ride it for a while like that. You can always flip back if you don't like it.
The only concerns I see are the saddle tipped down like that could cause you to put too much pressure on your hands. I would rotate the bars down so the hoods and tops of the bars are level, but that's more cosmetic. If the saddle to bar feels good, go with it. If you're curious and you want to experiment with lower bars, try flipping the stem and ride it for a while like that. You can always flip back if you don't like it.
07-11-13, 09:15 AM
#34
Descends like a rock
07-11-13, 09:21 AM
#35
I'm doing it wrong.
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If you talk to a company like Rivendell, everyone is riding frames that are too small and has too much seatpost visible. They also think any bar drop at all makes zero sense for all non-racing cyclists. Then again, they like quill stems, platform pedals, bar-end shifters and friction shifting. There is indeed no "normal".
Na, they are very knowledgeable there and happy to talk to you about bikes, wheels, bags. Mark especially. They do do things differently though, which I like a lot.
07-11-13, 09:22 AM
#36
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07-11-13, 09:27 AM
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Come on. There's no reason to be shy you have a Motobecane
07-11-13, 09:39 AM
#39
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I definitely like that they are not shy about their opinions and build what they think makes sense. I wish more bike companies were passionate enough to go their own direction. Also, the Roadeo is friggen gorgeous if you ask me. Love it in white and blue.
07-11-13, 09:43 AM
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I'm also of the shorter legs/longer torso variety and my setup isn't much different...my saddle is probably an inch higher than yours, in relation to the bars. It's a good compromise position for me, since I can relax and ride more upright on the hoods, but I can also comfortably ride in the drops for long periods of time during more spirited rides. I've thought about slamming the stem, which would be fine if I stayed on the hoods, but it would make it borderline uncomfortable to get in the drops for any length of time.
07-11-13, 10:30 AM
#41
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07-11-13, 10:50 AM
#42
Senior Member
I would guess the bike shop fitting did little or nothing with the bars. The most important part of fit is the leg extension, so that is what most fitters concentrate on. Lower the bars as you see fit; you have lots of room. I've noticed the bars on most showroom bikes are set high so the shop can leave lots of steerer length and lots of room for downward adjustment.
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"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
07-11-13, 10:55 AM
#43
You Know!? For Kids!
If the saddle would be level, you wouldnt need the bars rolled up, like that... ( to use, to push yourself back up on to the saddle/your sit bones... since you are prolly sliding off/down, sitting on your giblets. )
That said, dont flip the stem or slam it, that is a fit issue ...
If you like the height on both leave it, but if you need the extra hight from the handlebar beeing rolled up, get a higher angle stem. ( and still keept he bars "level". )
If all else fails, het a "tall headtube bike" ...
Here is a publicity pic of my bike :
Here is how mine, looks:
That said, dont flip the stem or slam it, that is a fit issue ...
If you like the height on both leave it, but if you need the extra hight from the handlebar beeing rolled up, get a higher angle stem. ( and still keept he bars "level". )
If all else fails, het a "tall headtube bike" ...
Here is a publicity pic of my bike :
Here is how mine, looks:
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07-11-13, 11:19 AM
#45
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07-11-13, 11:26 AM
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I went through something similar 4 or 5 years ago. I bought a road bike & started out with a fitting & bars level with my saddle
As time went on, I became more flexible and more comfortable in a lower position. As well, My mileage & riding kept improving. As of the last picture (last year) you can see the changes I have gone through.
These changes were due to comfort, not looks.
Since the last picture, I have cut the fork & dropped another one or two cm.
As time went on, I became more flexible and more comfortable in a lower position. As well, My mileage & riding kept improving. As of the last picture (last year) you can see the changes I have gone through.
Since the last picture, I have cut the fork & dropped another one or two cm.
07-11-13, 12:17 PM
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The transition may be fine but having the hoods and bars rotated up like that isn't. The ends of the bars are not level, which would make using an aggressive position in the drops pretty dang uncomfortable on the wrists. I see people riding around with this configuration and usually its because they have no idea what they are doing and are just trying to achieve a higher riding position. No good fitter would consider that an appropriate bar angle. If anything the shifters could be moved higher on the hoods, or different bars and/or stem could be used to achieve the same height, but bar rotation isn't the way to achieve that.
07-11-13, 12:19 PM
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The transition may be fine but having the hoods and bars rotated up like that isn't. The ends of the bars are not level, which would make using an aggressive position in the drops pretty dang uncomfortable on the wrists. I see people riding around with this configuration and usually its because they have no idea what they are doing and are just trying to achieve a higher riding position. No good fitter would consider that an appropriate bar angle. If anything the shifters could be moved higher on the hoods, or different bars and/or stem could be used to achieve the same height, but bar rotation isn't the way to achieve that.
07-11-13, 12:26 PM
#49
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Hi all, thanks for the advice and responses...I really appreciate you all helping out a newbie like me. I will upload more pics shortly.
I'm thinking this is the case. He watched me cycling for a few minutes and did mention that I tensed up my shoulders a lot while riding. However, I'm not super inflexible or anything - I'm 28 yrs old and stay pretty active. I ride everyday to work (15 mi round trip) then usually do one 40-50 mi long ride during the weekend. I'm guessing he just wanted me to comfortable with the bike for now and then adjust it as I go.
He adjusted saddle to make it parallel. I will upload new pics with better angles.
Hi Stan, thanks for the response. It is a 56cm, I am 6' (just measured in doctors office last month). I'm 28 and pretty active so it's not like I'm super inflexible. My inseam is around 31-32" I'm guessing.
The fitting took about 20 minutes. It is the kind that comes free with a bike purchase, see "new bike fit": https://helenscycles.com/articles/hel...tting-pg78.htm
He took the front wheel off and put it on one of those things where you can pedal your bike like a stationary bike. I hopped on, he took various measurements of both legs in different positions. He used some kind of tool (maybe a level?) to measure where my feet when my legs were at the bottom of the pedal stroke. He watched me cycle for about 1-2 minutes, gave me some tips on stretching, adjusted the saddle.... that was pretty much it. He seemed very knowledgeable about cycling and answered all of my questions well. The shop is Helen's Cycles in Santa Monica. It's a pretty big shop, with multiple locations so it isn't a shady place or anything.
Thanks for the tip Nihilum. I haven't dropped the handlebars yet but I will do.
The fitting took about 20 minutes with no body measurements. It seemed to be more like the initial set-up where they measured my legs at the bottom and top of the pedal stroke, watched me ride for 1-2 minutes, then adjusted the seat post/saddle. I don't think he adjusted the bars at all.
I don't feel stretched out at all. It feels very comfortable, but I'm just getting this feeling that this position is not typical by seeing all the other road bikes out there with their saddles higher.
I am willing to sacrifice comfort for performance.
Thanks for the tip guys.
Thanks JT....they had all the sizes up and down.. just a massive amount of cannondales everywhere in their store.
I have not measured my cycling inseam. I will posts some pics of me on the bike.
Thanks for the advice, will try flipping.
Thanks for the tips, Gaucho. The fit came free with the bike purchase.
We are very similar in height and inseam. I feel comfortable on it now, I'm just wondering if a more aggressive position is better for performance and speed.
Thanks for advice guys, I feel pretty good on it now.
Thanks for advice, feels good now but im going to experiment with flipping and see how that feels too.
Yes Brian, you are correct. They just measured the leg extension and didn't touch the bars. Will lowering the bars really help my performance a lot?
Nice bike! Did you see a big difference in performance when you changed to a lower position?
w/o seeing you on the bike it's just a crap shot, but i'm guessing your legs aren't that short. You should have like a 10-15 degree bend at most when legs are extended. Also your handlebars are rolled to far up. Drops should be parallel to the ground. You will get more flexible the more you cycle. Stretch your back, neck and legs everyday if you can. Maybe he just set the bike up that way until you get more flexible.
That's hard to believe that's a 56 and you are 6 foot. Unless you have very short legs and little flexibility, it looks way off. Post some pics of you on the bike.
When you said fitting, what did that consist of and how long did it take? Was the shop employee knowledgable?
When you said fitting, what did that consist of and how long did it take? Was the shop employee knowledgable?
The fitting took about 20 minutes. It is the kind that comes free with a bike purchase, see "new bike fit": https://helenscycles.com/articles/hel...tting-pg78.htm
He took the front wheel off and put it on one of those things where you can pedal your bike like a stationary bike. I hopped on, he took various measurements of both legs in different positions. He used some kind of tool (maybe a level?) to measure where my feet when my legs were at the bottom of the pedal stroke. He watched me cycle for about 1-2 minutes, gave me some tips on stretching, adjusted the saddle.... that was pretty much it. He seemed very knowledgeable about cycling and answered all of my questions well. The shop is Helen's Cycles in Santa Monica. It's a pretty big shop, with multiple locations so it isn't a shady place or anything.
Have you dropped your handlebars down? If not, I'd suggest that as a starting point if you're really looking for a more aggressive geometry. I ride a less aggressive Cannondale Synaspe 7 Sora, but my brother rides a CAAD and he had the same issue. He lowered the handlebars by removing the steering stem spacers.
Question: Did they do an actual fitment (take an hour or more where they take actual body measurements) or did they just do an initial set-up where they just made sure your legs were at the right positions at the bottom and top of your pedal stroke?
Question: Did they do an actual fitment (take an hour or more where they take actual body measurements) or did they just do an initial set-up where they just made sure your legs were at the right positions at the bottom and top of your pedal stroke?
The fitting took about 20 minutes with no body measurements. It seemed to be more like the initial set-up where they measured my legs at the bottom and top of the pedal stroke, watched me ride for 1-2 minutes, then adjusted the seat post/saddle. I don't think he adjusted the bars at all.
Do you find you reach too far for the hoods; are you feeling too stretched out? My bike has the saddle level with the handlebars and it is extremely comfortable, and I can use the drops all day long if I wanted to. I wouldn't judge a fitting by that alone...for sure.
Edited to say that I think your saddle is pointed down a bit much.
Edited to say that I think your saddle is pointed down a bit much.
I am willing to sacrifice comfort for performance.
As mentioned by datlas, you may start by flipping the stem. That should bring the bars slightly lower than your saddle (all other things being set up correctly). To specifically answer your question though, no, it is not normal to have that kind of setup on a race bike meant specifically for the kind of riding you intend to do.
There are no set rules. You have a lot of room to experiment. Flip your stem and put some of the spacers above the stem. Try numerous configurations and see what works best. Focus in whats comfortable, not what it looks like. Keep in mind, if you are new at this, the optimal setup will be a moving target as your fitness improves.
Along with everyones good advice remember it's not about the looks it's about the fit and your comfort, as long as you fill good thats all you shoud be concerned about. If not then seek a good fitter some shops fit you but its an general fitting and might I ask did this shop have all the sizes up and down you were looking for or did they sell you something because thats what was on the floor.
Have you measured your cycling inseam? That saddle looks pretty low for someone 6' tall on a 56". I'm 6'3" on a 58 and I have a lot of seat post. Probably could ride a 60-61. Your saddle/bars do not have to conform to any rules but there is a general trend for road bars to be lower than the saddle. If this is properly fit then it's properly fit. However, without some more data (like cycling inseam) it's hard to say. It's possible the shop set you up based on preconceived notions about newer riders rather than something more comprehensive and based on your actual body style and flexibility. A pic of you on the bike would probably help.
Well first off, you have like a bajillion inches worth of spacers AND your stem is at a positive angle. If you want your bars to be lower than your saddle all you have to do is place the spacers on top of the stem instead of below it, and then flip your stem.
I work at a bike shop and from personal experience I have seen some customers that need their saddle really low even with the proper leg extension. For people who are chubby/heavy set the problem seems to amplify drastically.
I agree with the fitter that a 54 would be too cramped for you. If it bugs you that the saddle is so low... do what I said and just flip the stem and slam it.
I work at a bike shop and from personal experience I have seen some customers that need their saddle really low even with the proper leg extension. For people who are chubby/heavy set the problem seems to amplify drastically.
I agree with the fitter that a 54 would be too cramped for you. If it bugs you that the saddle is so low... do what I said and just flip the stem and slam it.
No, that set up does not look right to me. You might see the hoods higher than saddle on touring or city bikes (a la the "French Fit," though even then it's usually at or sligtly below saddle level) , but not on a bike such as yours. Plus, the downward saddle angle is just wrong. I'm about your height (5'11") and also have long torso/short legs, but would not want to ride your bike for very long. If that were my bike, I'd start by flipping the stem, leveling the saddle and tilting handlebars forward. Start with a minimal saddle-to-bar drop, and lower as your comfort/flexibility allows. Oh, and ask for a refund from that fitter.
Don't compare your setup to the setup you see on bike photos in magazines. No one is riding those - they're just taking pictures. Instead look how people who are actually riding are setup for a more real life comparison. Even in the tour, some of the guys are using less aggressive setups than some of the guys here. It's no indication of skill.
Yours does look a little "mild" but that doesn't mean it doesn't fit right. My Allez is a 56.5 cm. I tried a 54 but I felt cramped on it. It may have been fixable with a long stem and setback post but at the time I was 45 lbs heavier than I am now and flexibility wasn't a strongpoint of mine.
Edit: For perspective, I'm 5'11.5" and my cycling inseam with shoes on is only ~32 in. Short legs here too.
Yours does look a little "mild" but that doesn't mean it doesn't fit right. My Allez is a 56.5 cm. I tried a 54 but I felt cramped on it. It may have been fixable with a long stem and setback post but at the time I was 45 lbs heavier than I am now and flexibility wasn't a strongpoint of mine.
Edit: For perspective, I'm 5'11.5" and my cycling inseam with shoes on is only ~32 in. Short legs here too.
That looks fine.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
There is no "Normal" for a bike set up. Fit is very specific to each individual. As others have said, if you have low flexibility, then you may need your bars above your saddle. Don't worry about what it looks like. Ride it and if you are uncomfortable, then make changes.
Without seeing you on the bike, no one can say if its right for you. (even seeing you on it doesn't answer everything)
The only concerns I see are the saddle tipped down like that could cause you to put too much pressure on your hands. I would rotate the bars down so the hoods and tops of the bars are level, but that's more cosmetic. If the saddle to bar feels good, go with it. If you're curious and you want to experiment with lower bars, try flipping the stem and ride it for a while like that. You can always flip back if you don't like it.
The only concerns I see are the saddle tipped down like that could cause you to put too much pressure on your hands. I would rotate the bars down so the hoods and tops of the bars are level, but that's more cosmetic. If the saddle to bar feels good, go with it. If you're curious and you want to experiment with lower bars, try flipping the stem and ride it for a while like that. You can always flip back if you don't like it.
I would guess the bike shop fitting did little or nothing with the bars. The most important part of fit is the leg extension, so that is what most fitters concentrate on. Lower the bars as you see fit; you have lots of room. I've noticed the bars on most showroom bikes are set high so the shop can leave lots of steerer length and lots of room for downward adjustment.
I went through something similar 4 or 5 years ago. I bought a road bike & started out with a fitting & bars level with my saddle
As time went on, I became more flexible and more comfortable in a lower position. As well, My mileage & riding kept improving. As of the last picture (last year) you can see the changes I have gone through.
These changes were due to comfort, not looks.
Since the last picture, I have cut the fork & dropped another one or two cm.
As time went on, I became more flexible and more comfortable in a lower position. As well, My mileage & riding kept improving. As of the last picture (last year) you can see the changes I have gone through.
These changes were due to comfort, not looks.
Since the last picture, I have cut the fork & dropped another one or two cm.
Last edited by MoreBlackSwan; 07-11-13 at 12:30 PM.
07-11-13, 12:27 PM
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The transition may be fine but having the hoods and bars rotated up like that isn't. The ends of the bars are not level, which would make using an aggressive position in the drops pretty dang uncomfortable on the wrists. I see people riding around with this configuration and usually its because they have no idea what they are doing and are just trying to achieve a higher riding position. No good fitter would consider that an appropriate bar angle. If anything the shifters could be moved higher on the hoods, or different bars and/or stem could be used to achieve the same height, but bar rotation isn't the way to achieve that.
