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How To Live A Car Free Life

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How To Live A Car Free Life

Old 02-22-18, 06:57 PM
  #126  
Maelochs
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Yeah ... I have not read the books but have read the Cliff Notes version .... sad, isn't it, that there is less disease, poverty, illiteracy, violent death and more food and shelter. Not sure I can keep living if life is just going to keep getting better for more and more people.
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Old 02-23-18, 04:08 AM
  #127  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Yeah ... I have not read the books but have read the Cliff Notes version .... sad, isn't it, that there is less disease, poverty, illiteracy, violent death and more food and shelter. Not sure I can keep living if life is just going to keep getting better for more and more people.
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Old 02-23-18, 06:39 AM
  #128  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Yeah ... I have not read the books but have read the Cliff Notes version .... sad, isn't it, that there is less disease, poverty, illiteracy, violent death and more food and shelter. Not sure I can keep living if life is just going to keep getting better for more and more people.
This is always true at the peak of a civilization. I hope you're right, and this time it will be different

Last edited by cooker; 02-23-18 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 02-23-18, 06:57 AM
  #129  
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Originally Posted by cooker
This is always true at the peak of a civilization. I hope this time it will be different
Not wanting to get political or religious but ... yeah. i hope for some serious improvements in people. I hope that even if there are minor crashes and burns, in general the good stuff lasts this time.

I am even optimistic.

I predict the world will be a better place---hopefully within five years.

Oh, wait, wrong thread for that.
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Old 02-23-18, 04:41 PM
  #130  
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Originally Posted by Walter S
A factor yes. But people will see to it that it's a manageable factor with cleaner technologies. Either carbon will not accumulate or people will develop controls that reduce (like with mirrors etc.) UV/carbon or sequester it. There are many feasible approaches and a combination will probably be the answer.

If you like the think the world is swishing around the commode don't read this book https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...-pinker-review
That would be nice, but for some reason people can't see that carbon is naturally absorbed by living ecosystems. We have been focused on combustion and other intensive energies to drive industrial machines instead of realizing that biological processes/growth, while slow relative to industrial machines, are actually the best suited to maintaining the natural sustainability of the planet.

Now, as appreciation of solar and wind energy, it becomes possible to consider how trees and plants are amazing solar-powered machines consisting of highly complex nano-systems that have evolved over eons. Living organisms naturally use sunlight and wind to build shade-canopies, manage and clean water and air, and produce raw materials like wood, food, and many other base substances. The more we use our industrial-intelligence to refine industrial processes to work harmoniously with nature, the more of a positive-feedback loop we gain with our natural resource base, instead of threatening it with our utilization of it.
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Old 02-23-18, 07:24 PM
  #131  
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Originally Posted by tandempower
That would be nice, but for some reason people can't see that carbon is naturally absorbed by living ecosystems.
I have a feeling that if that’s the most efficient way to deal with carbon, that people will figure it out. Even if you remain silent and don’t say a word.
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Old 02-23-18, 09:55 PM
  #132  
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Originally Posted by Roody
It shouldn't surprise anybody that people (whatever their ages) are becoming carfree only in areas where it is feasible to do so. Like areas with good transit, decent pedestrian and bike infrastructure, and relative lack of sprawl. If they quit building all those parking garages and put the money into sensible infrastructure, many more people--young and old--would make a free and reasonable choice to drive less or not at all.
Indeed.

However it seems just as many like myself whom have never owned a car there seems to be just as many who refuse to not be driving in a car. Its simply simplistic. Many of the youth are old souls or have some sort of muscle memory and simply doing what they remember whether that is from driving, food etc
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Old 02-23-18, 09:58 PM
  #133  
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Originally Posted by tandempower
That would be nice, but for some reason people can't see that carbon is naturally absorbed by living ecosystems. We have been focused on combustion and other intensive energies to drive industrial machines instead of realizing that biological processes/growth, while slow relative to industrial machines, are actually the best suited to maintaining the natural sustainability of the planet.

Now, as appreciation of solar and wind energy, it becomes possible to consider how trees and plants are amazing solar-powered machines consisting of highly complex nano-systems that have evolved over eons. Living organisms naturally use sunlight and wind to build shade-canopies, manage and clean water and air, and produce raw materials like wood, food, and many other base substances. The more we use our industrial-intelligence to refine industrial processes to work harmoniously with nature, the more of a positive-feedback loop we gain with our natural resource base, instead of threatening it with our utilization of it.
Very true and plants can even create thermal or cooling environments. The mangroves and eco system flora and fauna in west palm beach, Everglades etc and northbound are proof of that as are areas all over the world.
I wish I coud have met the gentleman with the water powered car I think based out of the midwest.

I feel we have barely cracked the surface on biological impacts of man and inventions vs the plant kingdom, solar power, water filtration mediums and purification and much more. All I know is when I bike thru pristine areas I could bike forever. There is a direct correlation between heavy metals and exhaust from cars etc as well as other toxins and bodily performance and well being.
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Old 02-24-18, 06:51 AM
  #134  
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Originally Posted by Roody
It shouldn't surprise anybody that people (whatever their ages) are becoming carfree only in areas where it is feasible to do so. Like areas with good transit, decent pedestrian and bike infrastructure, and relative lack of sprawl

If they quit building all those parking garages and put the money into sensible infrastructure, many more people--young and old--would make a free and reasonable choice to drive less or not at all.
Originally Posted by gerv
Yeah...nothing takes the joy out of walking to a destination or riding to work than having to negotiate streets clearly designed ONLY for high-speed traffic. Unfortunately, there's just too much of it...

If there was more attention paid to alternate modes of transportation, you would see more young people making the decisions Ryan made at 16 years old (ie,do I need the expense of owning an automobile?)
Originally Posted by tandempower
More importantly, you can live a rich life without a lot of income by living car-free. A penny saved is a penny earned, literally.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
Boston is probably one of the most Car-free cities in the world, and having a car is often detrimental.

We live near the transportation hub of Kenmore Square. Our easily accessible Car-free / Car-light modalities at home and work are:..
I persistently post about Boston as a Car Free haven. On a recent Commuting Forum thread, “Is Cycling Growing Or Declining In Your Area (U.S.)?,” @mcours2006 (from Toronto) came to, and nicely stated the same conclusion as @canklecat and me.
Originally Posted by canklecat
Cycling is growing in Fort Worth and, judging from social media contacts, doing well elsewhere in Texas…Fort Worth's Mayor Betsy Price is a fitness buff and very supportive of cycling… .
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
(from 2011) One of the big changes in the Boston cycling scene over the past couple years has been the interest that Mayor Menino has taken in bicycling,and he has appointed a bike czar, introduced several cycling lanes in thoseabove-mentioned areas in the heart of the city, and instituted a bicycle sharing system, called “Hubway,” particularly centered in the downtown and surrounding neighborhoods…
Originally Posted by mcours2006
Again,not U.S., but in the Metro Toronto Area I've been hearing politicians talk about a city that is more livable, that is, people can walk and ride their bikes to places, more green space, more pedestrian friendly, more trails, more bike lanes.

The current city administration seems to be quite committed to this initiative, whereas the previous one, not so much. I think because of this,bike use, in particular for commuting, has increased.

Political currents have a huge impact on whether bicycle use is increasing or declining
Currently here in Boston, hackles are raising over restrictions on parking for new developments. On a few threads I have posted about the critical situation of parking in Boston, including the now-closed thread LCF thread from 2015, “People Without Cars.”
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
In a dense, urban city like Boston with pretty good mass transit,the detriments of driving and parking can outweigh the benefits; and car driving takes away from cycling time…
Originally Posted by CbadRider
And we're done here. This thread is taking a political bend with the talk about the government so instead of moving it to P&R, I'm just going to close it to stop the bickering.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
…Driving in heavy traffic to a scheduled appointment in downtown Boston and trying to find a parking place or pay outrageous parking fees is not a liberating experience whereas walking, subway and bike can be.
BTW, our condo which has five units, has three deeded parking spaces and next door with about eight unit also has three spaces. Our building date from the 19th century and became a condo in about 1980.


Alternative street parking is mostly metered, and many even when not metered require a neighborhood parking sticker. Kenmore Square is a commercial and entertainment district, so there are a lot of non-stickered spaces metered only from 8AM to 6PM, free on Sundays and Holidays.


Last edited by Jim from Boston; 02-25-18 at 06:50 AM. Reason: added BTW
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Old 02-24-18, 07:35 AM
  #135  
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Hopefully, smaller, AV buses/vans can make mass transit more practical in more areas.

I know this is a cycling site, but still ... from what I have seen most people would rather walk a short distance (no special equipment needed, no particular level of fitness) than bike. However, more mass transit can help lower traffic volume, which benefits cyclists too.

The key is convenience. When it is harder to own a car, people will stop paying for the privilege.

Not a lot of people I know are willing to stop driving just to save money---because driving is more convenient. Given options of comparable convenience and less cost, change becomes a consideration.

I sort of hope the flexibility offered by smaller AV mass transit vehicles will increase that convenience---routes can economically spread further, run more frequently and for longer hours when operating costs are lower and driver costs non-existent.

It isn't a spiritual thing, or a financial thing for most people I know. Most people simply cannot tolerate inconvenience.
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Old 02-24-18, 08:03 AM
  #136  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
Hopefully, smaller, AV buses/vans can make mass transit more practical in more areas.

I know this is a cycling site, but still ... from what I have seen most people would rather walk a short distance (no special equipment needed, no particular level of fitness) than bike. However, more mass transit can help lower traffic volume, which benefits cyclists too.

The key is convenience. When it is harder to own a car, people will stop paying for the privilege….
FYA, I replied to this thread on the Commuting Forum. “I may give upon walking to work.”
Originally Posted by RobertC
Like the title says, I may give up on walking to work and start cycling. I have been cycling to work, at various locations, for about ten years; however, my work is now very close to where I live, about three blocks.

I decided to start I decided to start walking for two reasons, the first is that it doesn't take much longer. The second is that I have been putting on a lot of weight lately …

Here is the problem; people just aren't looking for pedestrians. I never had as many close calls as I have started having while walking. The trouble is that the walk light puts me in the path of left turning cars behind me.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
How about wearing a rearview mirror. Like a Take-a-Look?
Originally Posted by mc9000
While walking through a parking lot during my lunch break, I caught myself mindlessly looking for my "Take a Look" mirror a few times. I missed that ability to get a glimpse behind me without having to turn around....
I once posted about feeling safe in traffic, cycling vs walking, to the thread,"Once again: Health VS Cycling Accidents."
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
…Personally I feel pretty safe,well-lit, with unlimited vision with mirrors, and pretty nimble on my bike.Nonetheless, I’m totally attentive to the cars around me…
As a usual pedestrian, and a cyclist, I actually feel more nimble as a walker on the mean streets of Boston. I would unlikely cycle for a short distance errand, since subways and taxis are more convenient, and I always bring my bike with me, i.e. I don’t carry a lock.

Not to be a braggart but, for a regular commute to work (mine is 14 miles),since I cycle for fitness, anything so short as three blocks would not be worth the trouble to ride.
Originally Posted by ussprinceton
I'd rather ride my bike than walk
Originally Posted by Abe_Froman
With good reason. To walk when you have a perfectly good bike is just ludicrous. Probably indicative of a psychological disorder of some sort.

The real question, IMO, is whether when forced to walk for whatever reason, you prefer to do it alone, or walk your bike next to you.

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 02-24-18 at 08:25 AM.
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Old 02-24-18, 08:19 AM
  #137  
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Originally Posted by Walter S
I have a feeling that if that’s the most efficient way to deal with carbon, that people will figure it out. Even if you remain silent and don’t say a word.
There are so many ways to sacrifice the long term good for short-term convenience, and the money people can make from that leads them to choose the easy path over the more disciplined path of long-term sustainability.

Look at the basic principle of fire, which is the essence of combustion-driven industrialism: fire takes energy that has been stored up over a long period of time by wood-growth or coal/oil formation and releases that energy quickly. That intense energy can generate levels of torque and (horse)power and thus speed, etc. that surpass what natural systems and organisms can do. So there is a tendency to get used to these unnaturally impressive levels of power and dismiss the significant of natural levels of energy and power.

But when you look at the big picture of how natural 'machines' and other mechanisms/systems of nature work, they are sustainable because they must feedback into the larger ecosystem beneficially, or else they wouldn't survive, long term that is. If totally unsustainable, destructive organisms/systems survived, they would destroy everything else and undermine their own support base, and that hasn't happened as far as I know yet.

But humans have this uncanny ability to innovate and the question is whether they can temper that innovative power with the power to take responsibility for the long-term effects of the technologies and systems we establish. I.e. can we achieve sustainable industry and development? To me it is as simple as maximizing nature's ability to spread and thrive in all the ways that it has evolved to, including maximizing humans' ability to use our bodily energy/power for transportation and other productive activities. But others seem to want to make it more complicated than that because they see rivalry between my way of thinking and a status quo that they feel they must urgently defend against critical questioning.
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Old 02-24-18, 08:23 AM
  #138  
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When i lived in the frozen north, cycling was not accepted. I am sure I could have bought studded tires from Finland or something ... but mountain bikes were not really things. I would have had to buy a cruiser, install some sort of band front derailleur and use a claw-hanger out back .... So I walked and jogged to work.

The idea of gearing up to ride in that weather .... unless i were riding, say 14 miles .... The gentleman who says he cannot walk because of traffic ... I am mystified. if a person cannot manage walking I would not recommend cycling ... ???? if he is having close calls I suggest he try some neck stretches ....

Thing is ... this is Not a representative population. I know I always get crap for saying it, but most people simply don't want to ride bikes.

I am sure people on golf sites cannot comprehend why people do not want to golf.

Ninety5rpms posted some study in another thread that showed all kinds of people said the biggest reason they didn't ride and the thing they wanted most as riders was Bike Lanes.

That makes a ton of sense to me. You want more people to ride ... the few who are willing ... make them feel like they aren't soft targets. A four-foot bike lane quickly becomes three feet wide when road crap piles up along the outer edge (if it has a curb) or soil erodes into the lane, or the pavement crumbles on the outer edge (if no curb.)

A cyclist riding int he center of that lane is about six inches from the white line (assuming two feet of width ... a bike might be as narrow as 16 inches, but with my panniers I am probably more than two feet wide.) If a car comes withing six inches of the white line and the cyclist is six inches from the other side of that line ... I can understand how a cyclist would feel naked and vulnerable to have a car pass that close at traffic speed (30-50 mph.)

Cities have to be willing to sacrifice the real estate---make the lane four feet wide, then have a one-foot dead zone (not painted, please.) But traffic volume has to decrease some before that will happen.

The other thing is contiguous bike lanes. There are a few I ride that disappear from one side of the street to the next, and at least one which just ends at a driveway in a deep dirty hole.

A new cyclist, cruising timidly along side traffic, suddenly seeing no lane on the other side of the intersection ... might never ride again.
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Old 02-24-18, 10:01 AM
  #139  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
…Thing is ... this is Not a representative population. I know I always get crap for saying it, but most people simply don't want to ride bikes.

I am sure people on golf sites cannot comprehend why people do not want to golf.

Ninety5rpms posted some study in another thread that showed all kinds of people said the biggest reason they didn't ride and the thing they wanted most as riders was Bike Lanes.

That makes a ton of sense to me. You want more people to ride ... the few who are willing ... make them feel like they aren't soft targets. A four-foot bike lane quickly becomes three feet wide when road crap piles up along the outeredge (if it has a curb) or soil erodes into the lane, or the pavement crumble son the outer edge (if no curb.)…

If a car comes within six inches of the white line and the cyclist is six inches from the other side of that line ... I can understand how a cyclist would feel naked and vulnerable to have a car pass that close at traffic speed (30-50 mph.)

Cities have to be willing to sacrifice the real estate---make the lane four feet wide, then have a one-foot dead zone (not painted, please.) But traffic volume has to decrease some before that will happen.

The other thing is contiguous bike lanes. There are a few I ride that disappear from one side of the street to the next, and at least one which just ends at a driveway in a deep dirty hole.

A new cyclist, cruising timidly along side traffic, suddenly seeing no lane on the other side of the intersection ... might never ride again.
I have posted about separate bike lanes.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
…Two years ago (in 2013) we visited Toronto and when riding on Yonge St. I realized how valuable were those simply painted bike lanes we have in Boston; Toronto had none.

Later on that visit, I met a cyclist and we exchanged tales of riding in our mutual cities. He told me about Rob Ford’s vehement anti-cycling stance.
Originally Posted by Boston Globe
...But Ford reserves special venom for the menace called the bicycle. He is perhaps the most antibike politician in the world. In2007,he told the Toronto City Council that roads were designed for only buses,cars,and trucks. If cyclists got killed on roads, “it’s their own fault at the end of the day,” he said.

He compared biking on a city street to swimming withsharks—“sooner or later you’regoing to get bitten.” He once summarized his views in City Hall succinctly: “Cyclists are a pain in the ass to the motorists."
Anways @Maelochs, as a corollary to your post about painted (or non-painted) bike lanes, this post from the thread, Cycling is safe" on the A&S Forum, IMO best reflects a major downside to physically separated bikepaths in general:
Originally Posted by alathIN
Man, this is like so many internet arguments.

We need air!
No, you're wrong! We need water!

How about we ride on the roads where that works, develop new infrastructure where we need it, and enforce the laws everywhere?
Originally Posted by B. Carfree
Sounds great. However, we have this little problem that started in California back in '78 with prop. 13. As a result of the four decades long tax revolt it spawned, we're dealing with the ultimate priority issue: there's only so much money in the budget and it's not enough.

Some people, mostly people who are relatively new to cycling, think we should use the few dollars that can go towards improving conditions for cycling by building a few miles of separated infrastructure and place it mostly on urban roads (with the inevitable intersection failures).

Other, more experienced riders, think we would be better served by funding traffic law enforcement and putting in many more miles of proper, six to eight foot bikelanes (not in the door zone) and only putting in separate facilities where there are long stretches of high-speed road without appreciable numbers of intersections.

This difference of opinion wouldn't be such a big deal, but many of these segragationists have been making their public case by convincing everyone that cycling is too dangerous to be done anywhere except on a segregated facility. Not surprisingly, this has an impact in terms of how many people are willing to even try riding a bike since there is no way to get anywhere in the US without riding on a road.

Oddly enough, these people are called and consider themselves "bicycling advocates". If one were to design a fifth-column assault to keep cycling participation down, it would look just like the pro-separation folks.
BTW, good point about contiguous bike lanes, or as noted below, contiguous sidewalks.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston
...Last week I visited the family in Macomb County, MI. IMO, that is some of the nastiest road riding I have ever encountered. The main roads, to get anywhere, are six lane concrete slabs with bumps about every 20 feet, and many cracks and potholes especially on the right, with no shoulders, and heavy, zooming traffic with little patience for (slow) cyclists.

Sidewalks alongside are frequently discontinuous, and often non-existent. Even as an experienced urban commuter, I will often flee to the sidewalks, little used by pedestrians out in suburbia.

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 02-24-18 at 01:50 PM.
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Old 02-24-18, 11:11 AM
  #140  
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I hate the idea of walled-off lanes, myself ... I don't want to be penned in with a bunch of cyclists ... worst group of people .... ask ex-mayor Ford (well ... the late ex-mayor Ford.) he smoked with the sharks ....
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Old 04-16-18, 05:11 PM
  #141  
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Car Free 12 yrs.

I did about 12 years Car Free in 3 major Metro areas; SF, NYC, and Chicago. Couple of takeaways from my perspective.

1) Good cities have more infrastructure to support you. Bike sharing, carsharing, public transit, Lyft (not uber), taxis. These are inabundance in all three cities.
2) More dense pedestrian friendly areas with concentrations of high quality food, experiences and people.
3) Quality of life improvement was NOTICABLE. Walking to work or riding a bike will make your day better.
4) Plan accordingly. Rent or buy in a place that leverages the aforementioned infrastructure.

Worked great for me. I'm back to car commuting now and its basically a drag. Your results may vary.
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Old 04-16-18, 08:08 PM
  #142  
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Originally Posted by Maelochs
I hate the idea of walled-off lanes, myself ... I don't want to be penned in with a bunch of cyclists ... worst group of people .... ask ex-mayor Ford (well ... the late ex-mayor Ford.) he smoked with the sharks ....
He didn't die from smoking.
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Old 04-16-18, 08:45 PM
  #143  
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Originally Posted by cooker
He didn't die from smoking.
I don't know what caused his cancer .... No reason to think crack and alcohol were the cause.

I hear he was a huge supporter of cycling, though .... a really green guy, when he wasn't smoking crack.

I thought Toronto had facilities where people could use drugs under clinical supervision?
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Old 04-16-18, 11:06 PM
  #144  
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Originally Posted by teejaythomas
I did about 12 years Car Free in 3 major Metro areas; SF, NYC, and Chicago. Couple of takeaways from my perspective.

1) Good cities have more infrastructure to support you. Bike sharing, carsharing, public transit, Lyft (not uber), taxis. These are inabundance in all three cities.
2) More dense pedestrian friendly areas with concentrations of high quality food, experiences and people.
3) Quality of life improvement was NOTICABLE. Walking to work or riding a bike will make your day better.
4) Plan accordingly. Rent or buy in a place that leverages the aforementioned infrastructure.

Worked great for me. I'm back to car commuting now and its basically a drag. Your results may vary.
One might ask with such a formula for success, though I question car sharing as car free on a personal level, how do you go from nirvana to forced slavery?
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