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I gotta vent

Old 11-19-19, 07:01 PM
  #1  
Chris!
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I gotta vent

I was riding home today from work later than normal in the dark. I have a 1000 lumen head light on high and I even tipped it up a little bit to shoot the beam farther and be seen. Not once but 2x some one started to pull out in front of me at an intersection that I didnt have a stop sign. Just saying.
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Old 11-19-19, 07:05 PM
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be careful and watch out for yourself. Don't count on drivers seeing you, in fact, assume they don't
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Old 11-19-19, 07:09 PM
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Some drivers do that to me when I'm driving my car, and it's bigger than a bike.
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Old 11-19-19, 07:23 PM
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And then there is the A&S forum. Just sayin’.
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Old 11-19-19, 07:55 PM
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If you stare into the driver's window, would the light beam hit it dead-on? That would be 1000 lumens going into the driver's eyes and it wouldn't be wise for him to proceed if he can't see. But then, we know of a lot of incidences where drivers do foolish things.

Anticipate these things as you keep your trigger finger on your horn.
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Old 11-19-19, 08:05 PM
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Eh, I've had drivers do this while making eye contact with me. Not everybody wants to be considerate and civilized (and it seems to get worse around the holidays.)

Originally Posted by FiftySix View Post
Some drivers do that to me when I'm driving my car, and it's bigger than a bike.
Yep. They also do this to the cargo van, which is pretty big.
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Old 11-19-19, 08:50 PM
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Airzound Air horn FTW at :28 seconds.
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Old 11-19-19, 08:55 PM
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I know. It's just unbelievable. So, I was leaving Safeway after getting a couple of things this morning at about 0630 AM or so. Totally dark in my neighborhood, which is basically, downtown Portland. Lots of people heading to work. I get to a cross street where I have no stop and no light. I am to go. There is a Lexus SUV perpendicular to me to my right approaching his stop sign. Because I have been hit before and because I am paranoid, I hit my brakes anyway, in order to visually verify that he is, in fact, going to stop. He slows way down as he approaches his stop sign. It looks and feels like he is going to stop. Looks like he's stopping. Good.

I begin to pedal, somewhat reluctantly, still watching him. There are trust issues. I have 1100 lumens on my helmet and I am now looking right at him, because he still hasn't totally stopped. What is he doing? He turns and looks directly at me. Then he hits the accelerator and screams through the stop sign, while looking right at me!. By then, I had just stopped, so, he didn't hit me. But if I hadn't been riding so defensively, he for sure would've rammed into me, all 4500 lbs of him, right at me and my 18-pound BMC. Enjoy your morning.
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Old 11-19-19, 09:43 PM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
I know. It's just unbelievable. So, I was leaving Safeway after getting a couple of things this morning at about 0630 AM or so. Totally dark in my neighborhood, which is basically, downtown Portland. Lots of people heading to work. I get to a cross street where I have no stop and no light. I am to go. There is a Lexus SUV perpendicular to me to my right approaching his stop sign. Because I have been hit before and because I am paranoid, I hit my brakes anyway, in order to visually verify that he is, in fact, going to stop. He slows way down as he approaches his stop sign. It looks and feels like he is going to stop. Looks like he's stopping. Good.

I begin to pedal, somewhat reluctantly, still watching him. There are trust issues. I have 1100 lumens on my helmet and I am now looking right at him, because he still hasn't totally stopped. What is he doing? He turns and looks directly at me. Then he hits the accelerator and screams through the stop sign, while looking right at me!. By then, I had just stopped, so, he didn't hit me. But if I hadn't been riding so defensively, he for sure would've rammed into me, all 4500 lbs of him, right at me and my 18-pound BMC. Enjoy your morning.


I was gonna say to the OP that a helmet mounted light can help so you can flash the driver to get their attention,

but I guess that still won't necessarily work...
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Old 11-19-19, 11:13 PM
  #10  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
I know. It's just unbelievable. So, I was leaving Safeway after getting a couple of things this morning at about 0630 AM or so. Totally dark in my neighborhood, which is basically, downtown Portland. Lots of people heading to work. I get to a cross street where I have no stop and no light. I am to go. There is a Lexus SUV perpendicular to me to my right approaching his stop sign. Because I have been hit before and because I am paranoid, I hit my brakes anyway, in order to visually verify that he is, in fact, going to stop. He slows way down as he approaches his stop sign. It looks and feels like he is going to stop. Looks like he's stopping. Good.

I begin to pedal, somewhat reluctantly, still watching him. There are trust issues. I have 1100 lumens on my helmet and I am now looking right at him, because he still hasn't totally stopped. What is he doing? He turns and looks directly at me. Then he hits the accelerator and screams through the stop sign, while looking right at me!. By then, I had just stopped, so, he didn't hit me. But if I hadn't been riding so defensively, he for sure would've rammed into me, all 4500 lbs of him, right at me and my 18-pound BMC. Enjoy your morning.
Or.. to be fair. He is waiting for you to go because you have the right of way but you act hesitant and unsure and he finally decides to just get through without dealing with the waffle. I ride defensively but quite assertively and basically tell other drivers what to do with my hands or body language.

I often find it more frustrating to deal with nice holes, those people who follow slowly behind instead of passing when they have room or stop at intersections when they have the right away just because I'm on a bike. They are trying to be safe or kind but it causes confusion for everyone around.

Last edited by Happy Feet; 11-19-19 at 11:21 PM.
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Old 11-20-19, 04:06 AM
  #11  
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On the general topic, a couple months ago I changed two things.

1. I got tires with a reflective strip (to go with a new bike).
2. I got 18650s to drive the two flashlights on my helmet. Since these are rechargeable, instead of running on low to save AAAs, I'm running on high.

Now cars are slowing down sooner and giving me more space. I assume it's because they can see me sooner.

Originally Posted by BobbyG View Post
Airzound Air horn FTW at :28 seconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i61L3XJm-ks


Nice! Great to see that working.
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Old 11-20-19, 04:26 AM
  #12  
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So, @Happy Feet, you are suggesting that when I see and sense that someone I am perpendicular to appears not to be coming to a complete and full stop at their stop sign that the wise move for me is to accelerate into the intersection and toward him and into his path anyway? That this display of confidence and assuredness on my part will somehow convince him to stop? I suppose that is possible. My problem with this, though, is, what if I am wrong about that? If I hadn't 'hesitated,' as you describe it, I probably would have eaten his front end. Game possibly over. At the very least, probably a destroyed rather expensive bike.

As I say, I have been hit before. Not my first rodeo. I do know my town and it is abundantly clear that cars routinely blow stop signs and red lights here. Routinely. There is zero question that I would have been hit again by now if I didn't ride as I do. That is 100%. So, I guess I'll take the 'hesitant' label and run with it. If 'hesitant' keeps me out of the SICU, I'm good with that. At least I still have my bike.
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Old 11-20-19, 04:31 AM
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Originally Posted by rseeker View Post
On the general topic, a couple months ago I changed two things.

1. I got tires with a reflective strip (to go with a new bike).
2. I got 18650s to drive the two flashlights on my helmet. Since these are rechargeable, instead of running on low to save AAAs, I'm running on high.

Now cars are slowing down sooner and giving me more space. I assume it's because they can see me sooner.





Nice! Great to see that working.
How many lumens or lux are those lights, by chance? Are cars flashing their brights at you? Are peds and other cyclists complaining that your setup is too bright? Just curious. One of my Cygolites looks like it's dying and I am in the market for a new light.
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Old 11-20-19, 05:11 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
How many lumens or lux are those lights, by chance? Are cars flashing their brights at you? Are peds and other cyclists complaining that your setup is too bright? Just curious. One of my Cygolites looks like it's dying and I am in the market for a new light.
Yes, I understand your point. I'm being sensitive to that. I mostly ride farm roads, which are lightly traveled. When I have on-coming traffic I'm mostly averting my own gaze to protect my own vision, which means my helmet lights are pointed at the ground in front of me. But I go through some settled areas where I could remember to turn it down. Eventually I'll replace my cheap 120 lumen handlebar light with a proper one with a proper mount, and then I'll be able to run the helmet lights at a lower level. No, I've never had lights flashed at me. I basically never see pedestrians, except in one neighborhood where people walk before work, and in 15 years I've seen people on bikes nine times. (The ninth was yesterday -- he was circling at the exit from a neighborhood and looking like he was waiting for a friend to join him -- we traded big hello brother waves). So essentially I live out in the sticks. From that map you posted recently it looks like you're a lot closer to a central downtown area.

I think the helmet flashlights were advertised 1100 lumens, on eBay, cheap Chinese imports, which means, what? 550 actual? I'll see if I can find the link.

Here's my helmet set-up: https://www.bikeforums.net/21164635-post7.html
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Old 11-20-19, 05:26 AM
  #15  
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this time of year is brutally dangerous & our tiny lights blend in with all the other lights out there. I drove a round a crash detour recently & as I got back on the main road, I looked right, toward the emergency vehicles. there were cops & fire trucks, so lots of lights. as I was trying to see what was happening I noticed one little irregular light. it was a bike coming toward me. I guess he didn't take the detour? anyway, I barely noticed him
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Old 11-20-19, 05:31 AM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
while looking right at me!
I have often mouthed the words "stop your car" to ppl like this. ppl don't come to a full stop. I constantly lecture my kids & wife about this too. & eye contact is bad cuz we think it means they see us & will stop for us, but "they" think it means the bike sees me, so I'm safe to go before them. sometimes, I think, it's better NOT to have eye contact
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Old 11-20-19, 05:48 AM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
So, @Happy Feet, you are suggesting that when I see and sense that someone I am perpendicular to appears not to be coming to a complete and full stop at their stop sign that the wise move for me is to accelerate into the intersection and toward him and into his path anyway? That this display of confidence and assuredness on my part will somehow convince him to stop? I suppose that is possible. My problem with this, though, is, what if I am wrong about that? If I hadn't 'hesitated,' as you describe it, I probably would have eaten his front end. Game possibly over. At the very least, probably a destroyed rather expensive bike.

As I say, I have been hit before. Not my first rodeo. I do know my town and it is abundantly clear that cars routinely blow stop signs and red lights here. Routinely. There is zero question that I would have been hit again by now if I didn't ride as I do. That is 100%. So, I guess I'll take the 'hesitant' label and run with it. If 'hesitant' keeps me out of the SICU, I'm good with that. At least I still have my bike.
This is a classic you had to be there situation. I read the situation, and act accordingly. I'm pretty sure you're both intelligent people who understand the situations you face better than I do. That said, I vary my approach to this type of situation in part by seeing if I can read the driver's face or actions, or if I can move farther from them in the lane so that if they do go, I'm already through the intersection. If I can't do either of those things, I will stop.

Slamming my brakes creates some risk as well, so this isn't a one size fits all safety judgment. My actions are also going to depend on how fast I'm approaching the intersection. There's some chance that my braking distance would just stop me right in front of the illegally crossing car.
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Old 11-20-19, 05:51 AM
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I commute to work in the dark, plenty of light on my bike, but I still have to watch people. I have a truck which stays at the shop, 3/4 ton Ford, white, service box and sits plenty high even though it is only two wheel drive. One would think it would be hard to miss, but I get people pulling out nearly hitting me, cutting me off and the works. And people wonder why I prefer the bicycle. Bottom line is people will drive like they are the only ones out there who matter, and it is up to you to watch out for them.
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Old 11-20-19, 07:04 AM
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It's very difficult for people to gauge speed and distance when you present only a single point of light. I'm guessing that these 2 drivers did see you, but underestimated both speed and distance. Multiple lights would help, but only if there were at least 12" between them. My commuting bike had a dyno powered light at the fork crown, a battery powered light on the left fork near the axle, and sometimes I used a helmet mounted light. I rarely had anyone pulling out on me.

As others have said, be careful and always assume that a driver will do something that puts you at risk.
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Old 11-20-19, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by rumrunn6 View Post
this time of year is brutally dangerous & our tiny lights blend in with all the other lights out there. I drove a round a crash detour recently & as I got back on the main road, I looked right, toward the emergency vehicles. there were cops & fire trucks, so lots of lights. as I was trying to see what was happening I noticed one little irregular light. it was a bike coming toward me. I guess he didn't take the detour? anyway, I barely noticed him
Tiny is right. They may be bright, but most bicycle lights I see look like a pin point unless its aimed at my eyes.

Even cars have moved away from only projector beam head lights in the last several years. Two pin points of white light coming from a car is hard to judge distance and speed of that car. Now most cars also have an array of extra LEDs around the main headlight to increase the size of the visible light to other traffic.
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Old 11-20-19, 07:25 AM
  #21  
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This kind of thing can happen during the day!
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Old 11-20-19, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
So, @Happy Feet, you are suggesting that when I see and sense that someone I am perpendicular to appears not to be coming to a complete and full stop at their stop sign that the wise move for me is to accelerate into the intersection and toward him and into his path anyway? That this display of confidence and assuredness on my part will somehow convince him to stop? I suppose that is possible. My problem with this, though, is, what if I am wrong about that? If I hadn't 'hesitated,' as you describe it, I probably would have eaten his front end. Game possibly over. At the very least, probably a destroyed rather expensive bike.

As I say, I have been hit before. Not my first rodeo. I do know my town and it is abundantly clear that cars routinely blow stop signs and red lights here. Routinely. There is zero question that I would have been hit again by now if I didn't ride as I do. That is 100%. So, I guess I'll take the 'hesitant' label and run with it. If 'hesitant' keeps me out of the SICU, I'm good with that. At least I still have my bike.
+1

Discretion is the better part of valor

Caution is preferable to rash bravery. Said by Falstaff in King Henry the Fourth, Part One, by William Shakespeare.
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Old 11-20-19, 07:50 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by rumrunn6 View Post
...our tiny lights blend in with all the other lights out there....
So "blend out"...

...and get a horn.
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Old 11-20-19, 08:24 AM
  #24  
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I gotta vent
Originally Posted by Chris! View Post
I was riding home today from work later than normal in the dark. I have a 1000 lumen head light on high and I even tipped it up a little bit to shoot the beam farther and be seen.

Not once but 2x some one started to pull out in front of me at an intersection that I didnt have a stop sign. Just saying.
Originally Posted by Flip Flop Rider View Post
be careful and watch out for yourself. Don't count on drivers seeing you, in fact, assume they don't
I frequently post about my my “safety aphorisms” that come to mind when I encounter a situation where unseen or unanticipated dangers lurk. As a flip side of the situation where the driver at night apparently did not see the cyclist, I remind myself at intersections or driveways, “When riding at night, look for cars, not just headlights.”

I fear getting lulled into a sense of security since car headlights are so obvious. I think that drivers without headlights at night, though may be inadvertent on well-illuminated roads, might be more likely to be inattentive.

I do try to pass my hand back and forth in front of my headight to flash a signal, as I would do in a car. I recall reading though that a criminal gang once would use such a signal to maliciously shoot at the signalling car.

Nonetheless, I have posted during my early AM commute, when I think headlights are more likely to be turned off,
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
I like early morning riding between 4 to 6 AM. I think the drunks and crazies are mostly off the road by that time (since the bars here close at 2:00 AM), and the ones driving at those hours are pretty responsible people. I think of them as the ones entrusted to get the world started for the rest of us.

Also the overnight shift changes usually occur at 7:00 AM, so those possibly sleep-impaired commuters are also off the road.
Originally Posted by Jim from Boston View Post
Last autumn, when I stayed overnight at my job at a suburban site, I tried some very early morning riding and had the same problem about oncoming car lights.

In the city there is enough ambient light to keep my pupils constricted, but on the very dark suburban/exurban roads I become very dark-adapted and oncoming lights are blinding.

But I too enjoy that sensation that everything is mine, and I’m in my own world. I call it “cocooning.”

Last edited by Jim from Boston; 11-20-19 at 08:43 AM.
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Old 11-20-19, 09:07 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by bpcyclist View Post
How many lumens or lux are those lights, by chance? Are cars flashing their brights at you? Are peds and other cyclists complaining that your setup is too bright? Just curious. One of my Cygolites looks like it's dying and I am in the market for a new light.
I'm pretty sure it was these. I was wrong, they're claiming 1800 lumens (not 1100 like I said before).

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07537C91H...0_fxm_3_0_i_id
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