1855Cru

Salsa Cycles

The new Marrakesh from Salsa looks interesting. Available in flat or drop bar configuration with differing geometry to suit the bar type.

Seems like a sensible touring build (Shimano 590 triple, 40c Schwalbe Marathon+, bar end shifters, BB7 discs, alternator dropouts to run a variety of drivetrains, full compliment of braze-ons etc) and geometry at a reasonable price. Looks like QBP has made a direct (perhaps superior?) competitor to it's own Surly LHT?

I wonder if they will now change the Vaya to be less of an all-rounder and more of a focussed gravel/adventure bike?

cyber.snow

Found it under the 2016 bikes, wonder when it will be available?

1855Cru

The article says October 2015

vatdim

700x40 tires with fenders sounds good. Brooks B17 saddle included in the $1600 asking price. I'm a little disappointed they're using bar end shifters on the drop bar version, but other than that it looks like a deal.

cyber.snow

what is wrong with bar end shifters on a drop bar touring bike?...seems like that is what everyone is doing.

DropBarFan

Salsa should do spec list with ETRTO style ie 40-622. More importantly if one did an S & S conversion the 622's complicate packing into airline-legal cases. Marrakesh frame is steel & one of steel's advantages is possibility of S & S couplers. Otherwise, why not use aluminum alloy frames? Marrakesh called a "world tourer" but 40 mm tires rather narrow for bumpy primitive roads. Salsa mentions the chance of repair in distant lands, the desperate argument of steel promoters. I've had a couple of crashes where fork/top tube/down tube simultaneously damaged; seems highly unlikely some guy with a welder could fix that. For tough expedition touring one would probably want to think about a bike that could use 55 mm tires & perhaps include fork suspension.

DropBarFan

My previous Novara Randonee had brifters & I liked the convenience/safety. OTOH the Shimano (BR-50?) brifter derailleur cable housing sticks out vs tucking onto handlebar, this gets in the way of front luggage. Some tourers like bar-end shifters for reliability & flexibility & ease of maintenance. Would be awesome if Campagnolo made a touring drive-train/brake set package w/brifters. IE Campy stuff was traditionally sturdy but maintainable. The Shimano brifters were complicated though I suppose for long-distance tours one could tote spares.

vatdim

Isn't 40-622 the same as 700x40, just a different designation? I agree it's hard to find a good welder for steel frames, but it's much harder finding one for aluminum or another material. As for the tire width, 55mm would be amazing, but maybe a bit too wide for most tourists. Salsa claim you could still use 29 x 2.00'' tires without fenders, which equals about 50mm width, so I'd say that is pretty close to what you need. On the other hand, if you really want something wider, you should maybe consider a 26-inch wheel tourer.

vatdim

It's just personal preference, I guess. I like brifters, they make me feel safer and more comfortable.

Tourist in MSN

Before brifters were developed most touring bikes had bar end shifters because that was the only good option to have both hands on the handlebars while you shifted. Otherwise you were using downtube shifters and with a heavily loaded bike and friction shifting, taking one hand off the handlebar to shift could be a hazard. Some urban bikes were sold with stem mounted shifters for a few years but they were never serious contenders for touring.

When brifters were developed, those that started doing touring that had not used brifters would usually start using bar ends. As noted, brifters could be finicky and might not work so well after a while and initially they were quite a bit more expensive than bar end shifters. If you switched to touring from a more upright handlebar, you probably used bar end shifters because that is what was most common on touring bikes.

But, those that started bike touring after they were used to using brifters on expensive road bikes usually wanted brifters on their touring bikes too. And if they could afford a good road bike with brifters, they could afford a touring bike with brifters. A few people that wanted brifters and also handlebar bags would put a V brake noodle on the cable run coming out of the brifter to get the shift cable to take a smooth bend.

So, today, it usually is one or the other, most people pick one or the other based on past preferences.

I started using Shimano bar end shifters back before index shifters were developed, I was one of the rare people that had Shimano instead of Suntour bar end shifters, I won't bother going into the history of pre-index shifter bar end design. I tried a pair of brifters a couple years ago and did not like them, went back to bar end shifters.

You should try both and buy what you prefer.

Lance Armstrong used to race with a downtube shifter for the front shifter and brifter for the rear while others on his team used brifters for both front and rear, so even in the world of high performance racing there is some personal preference involved.

I have no clue why some people feel that brifters are safer. But if that is what they have on other bikes, they probably feel safer if all of their bikes have the same controls.

bikemig 

The brifter/bar end choice is a matter of taste. I use brifters and bar ends on different bikes and don't buy the safety argument. I like bar ends with a triple since a friction set up is a bit less finicky than with a click shift.

I like the bike.

Tourist in MSN

Interesting that they use different geometry for the drop bar bike than the flat bar bike. Before now the only manufacturer that I was aware of that did this was Thorn.

BigAura

Nice! Out of the box, and you're ready to go, IMO

cyber.snow

Since I was still searching for a new touring bike the Marrakesh might be a great choice. I did take a short ride on a bike that had Jones bars on it and I think that is the way I want to go, instead of drop bars or a standard flat bar. I noticed that the geometry of the two bike is substantially different. Why would the flat bar bike be longer than the drop bar? It has a longer top tube, reach and wheelbase. Would that make it less responsive? The drop bar configuration is about the same as the LHT, 520 and others I compared. Which one would be better for either a butterfly/moustache or Jones bar? Which one would be better fully loaded? I am still eyeing a much longer trip in 2017 but starting with shorter trips in the Northwest starting in Spring of 2016.

gerryl

Have to agree. A person can go places with a bike like that.

Tourist in MSN

With drop bars you usually have your hands forward of where the handlebars go into the stem. Most riders have their hands on the hoods of the brake levers which is several inches forward of teh stem. With flat bars, your hands are usually further back beside or behind where your handlebar goes into the stem. So, it is a difference in reach, you want a shorter top tube and shorter stem for drop bars than for flat bars.

The drop bars they use are those weird ones that are wider at the bottom than the top, I prefer normal drop bars.

DropBarFan

Well w/brifters one can shift w/hands on brake hoods so basically no movement required from shifting position to braking position. Of course one can simply avoid shifting when a possible braking situation occurs. On tours one might encounter few intersections & little traffic so the need for quick braking might be insignificant. OTOH on sketchier and/or bumpier descents I like to ride on the hoods anyway, feels like it gives better control to shift body weight back a bit. Could be psychological, I dunno.

intransit1217

As if my options for a touring bike weren't crowded enough, now this. Thanks, Salsa !

corwin1968

I wish Salsa would offer the option of cantilever/V-brakes on at least some of their bikes. This would be a good candidate as not everyone wants or needs disk brakes. Also, they got a bit crazy with their top-tube length on the flat-bar version. If I sized by ETT, I would be riding a bike with a seat-tube that is 10cm shorter than I would like to ride.

seeker333

The only thing remarkable about the Marrakesh over the LHT is the alternator dropouts, which would allow easy fit of a Speedhub. Too bad they don't make it in 26" wheeled versions. Notice Salsa made the HTA slack to help with toe overlap on smaller frames, which results in a super long wheelbase, especially on the flat bar variant. Surly did the far more sensible thing and simply reduced wheel diameter on <56cm. The Marrakesh fork has a bunch o holes in it for people who can't decide how to carry stuff. I think traditionalists will prefer LHT's elegant fork crown. I wish Surly would redesign their front Nice Rack to utilize the LHT's fork crown bosses - and switch to Alternator dropouts.

I believe if you own a Salsa Marrakesh then you also have to own a Salsa Alternator rear rack (15kg limit), since that's the only rack that will fit properly mounted to the pivot bolt of the swinger dropout. The lower mount on the interchangeable aluminum dropout (traditional rack mount point) is designated "fender mount only" in the QBP catalog. You could bolt a std rack to the pivot bolt but it would be ~6cm higher than normal - look kinda weird, maybe handle badly.

Exactly who is it that needs all these monster head tubes? Has anyone ever been JRA and thought "I gotta get me a bigger diameter headtube". I suspect this trend is entirely driven by ease and cost of manufacturing rather than a genuine need. Marketers sell it as "beefier headtube strengthens front end", since this sounds better than "our robot can weld this easier and neater".

These frames are both made in the same factory (Maxway, Taiwan), probably from the same tubing. The LHT is a better deal at $470 (often discounted) vs $650 for the Marrakesh frameset. I got my 2012 Disc Trucker frameset for $356 total. I've never seen a discounted Vaya frameset anywhere.

LHT is also a lot easier to write about.

seeker333

A drop bar fitted to the same bike will extend reach 9-14cm over a "flat bar" (3-5 deg bend). The TT must be shorter on the drop bar version to make the bike fit the same.

SparkyGA

I am very excited for the new products that Salsa put out for 2016, both for the new touring bike and the Cutthroat. It's really nice to have another option for an off the shelf frame that takes IGH with ease. I could see myself building up a drop bar Marrakesh with a Rohloff and building a gravel grinding CX touring bike.

The Cutthroat just looks plain fast to me Too much fun.

max5480

I think you'll start to see a lot of these around next spring.

edthesped

I quit looking when I saw the alternator rear rack was the only option.

Yan 

I never understood why frame builders design an offset between the top tube and the seat stays. Any deviation from perfect triangles weakens the frame. And unicrown fork, ugh.