burritos

That's impressive.

cruiserhead

by all means, continue with your 3 to 5 hour rides without water. good luck to you.

burritos

Thanks.

rubiksoval

It was 42 minutes of activity, and the majority of it was AFTER he stopped fasting.

Seriously, man. I can't tell if you're just trolling or you genuinely do not read and think about the examples you're posting. Every single one of them has nothing to do with what you're proposing. Even your own rides have nothing to do with what you're proposing.

There's a massive disconnect, here.

wphamilton

I've had some 3 hour rides without water, didn't like it because after about 5 pounds (for me) of water loss my performance takes a hit and it feels horrible. Only a few times though because with the summers here in Georgia I could lose a lot more than that and be edging into dangerous territory.

The water loss doesn't just come from burning fat by the way. 35% of your water is intravascular - stored in your blood. When your body needs it quick for cooling, it takes it from there and that's where the performance hit comes from, your examples notwithstanding. It's also where the danger is. Thickening up the blood a little is no big deal. Happens all the time, totally normal. A lot, and you're taking big risks.

burritos

Thanks for that. You may be right. I don't know for certain. A quick survey from a pubmed sweat review article possibly implies otherwise:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6773238/

If enough fluid is drawn from the interstitia, no doubt you'll get an osmotic draw from vessels. However, I suspect if this type of physiologic pressure is imposed on your vasculature, your body will secrete the necessary aldosterone to preserve serum volume. What's the purpose of aldosterone if it's not drawing fluid from the third space If you acutely drop 5 lbs of sweat, unlikely it's all coming from serum. That type of sudden hypovolemia would likely be incompatible with life, much less functioning consciously on a bike. Yes exogenous replacement would be advantageous. But in the setting of nature where that's not always available, I believe fluid/balance adjustments will ward off what sounds like a certain death sentence. And yes, I understand for most civilized people dropping 5 lbs of sweat could be a death sentence. But I suspect prehistoric man could tolerate it. That being said, I always bring water on my rides, everyone should.

wphamilton

I don't see that it does, at all.

Transport of the water from intravascular storage might be osmosis, or might be some active transport mechanism. I haven't looked into it beyond confirming that transport does in fact happen, and pretty quickly in response to physiological demands. The effect of on blood density however is well documented.

ZHVelo

You guys are crazy. I get hangry after at most 90 minutes.

burritos

While you don't have to avoid fluids, consider training fasted. Hangriness is reversible.

cubewheels

Since I started this thread, I have made it a habit to bring a bottle of milk on every ride that is expected to be at least 1 hr long, usually involving lots of climbs. At 80F and 80% humidity it can feel very hot on climbs.

rubiksoval

The ideas in this thread get more and more bizarre.

rubiksoval

Speed is a better cure.

burritos

Some people like speed and performance. Some people(much less a numeric) like maximal mitophagy flux.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics...logy/mitophagy

Though I'm a slow turtle compared to you, I still PR'ed a segment on my return home commute 2 days ago. 25 hours after my last drink/eat. Been doing this commute for over a year. Could be a fluke, but should be an unlikely occurrence if the burden of the fasted state is really that bad. These ideas might be odd and weird, but I find them fascinating. If that makes me a biking forum troll, I apologize.

Bradbikes

It's not crazy to do a three hour relatively flat ride without eating or drinking something, but I probably would have forced myself to drink some water either way. And I always bring at least water and a snack bar or something for any ride.

rubiksoval

No, you don't.

You post the same thing on nearly every response while 100% ignoring the fact that it has absolutely nothing to do with the context being discussed. You seem to enjoy that for some reason, but no one really cares about trying to better their PRs fasted. It's a pointless exercise and tangent.

You like doing it. Yay. And? There's not much more to it than that, so it really is not a reasonable response to multiple people's posts. It's as meaningless as me saying everyone should just ride faster. It's silly.

burritos

Context? Isn't the thread about whether biking dryfasted is ok or not? For most it's not ok, but it can be. Also you bring up performance a lot. So why is performance while fasted irrelevant(even though for me it is a tangential issue.)? I bring it up to show that it's not always materially detrimental.

And did you indulge in the topic of mitophagy? Do you dispute that it's a real phenomena and that is relevant to cellular/metabolic health?

rubiksoval

The bolded is the only thing you've said that I agree with .

Your last two questions exemplify my point about context. Neither of them have a single thing to do with what I've stated. You're continually trying to steer a discussion into unrelated tangents.

There has to be an understanding of the context of a post and whether what you're continually typing has anything to do with that or not.

rubiksoval

Performance while fasted is irrelevant because fasting for performance is irrelevant. It doesn't aid performance, it hinders it. As has been mentioned umpteenth times. As you've alluded to with your own rides and your own links.

burritos

Yes. I agree. My thoughts can be tangential.

burritos

I also suspect that deep down inside I too am seeking attention and affirmation. Obviously I'm not getting either. But that's ok. I still appreciate the back and forth. It was fun. And thank you.

burritos

I agree. Just like putting on a weighted vest or training at high altitude.

ZHVelo

Every pro athlete drinks, and yet you think it might be a good idea not to? I can't fathom that.

Carbonfiberboy 

Some have it harder than others. One of my favorite stories: My wife and I were about a 1/2 mile from the trailhead, returning from a 5-hour hike up a local mountain. We met a family: man, woman, 2 young children, on their way up, no day packs. It was maybe an hour before dark. It's a mountain. People have died. We asked them about their hiking plans, hoping to turn them around. The man said, "Don't worry. I have a gun." It's all fine until it isn't. This somewhat exaggerates this thread - or maybe not.

burritos

I always bring food and water just in case. On 2 particularly long warmish rides of 5hr+, I did have to consume and imbibe. But for all other excursions, I bring back my backup hydration and calories unused.